Journey to the Ring

[Walter White]

I feel weird. Maybe it still hasn't sunk in or just hasn't hit me yet. But LeBron is on this team, and we are in the playoffs. After a whirlwind of an off season and the rocky start to the season we had, it's almost easy to forget but it's amazing we are where we are right now.

There are a lot of things to watch for this playoffs. It's exciting to get to see Kyrie and Love's first time in the playoffs! Hopefully we get to see them elevate their games to new levels we haven't seen before. I'm especially hoping Love will have a great playoffs after all the scrutiny and media BS he has put up with all season. And hopefully all that will put an end to the "Love leaving Cleveland" dumb stories as well. I'm fairly certain Kyrie will have a great playoffs so I'm not too worried about him. I feel like he was built for this and he is finally being let loose. I look forward to the excitement and passion out of all these guys we haven't seen before.

Blatt is honestly the person I'm most concerned about when it comes to adjusting to the playoffs. Not to any fault of his own and I love the guy, but it's just the inexperience. He was just starting to get the hang of the regular season when now he is basically being thrust into a "new" season where rotations, minutes, etc. will have to change again. However, the playoffs I think are a better fit for him anyway because he likes shorter rotations and playing guys more minutes. That and the fact he is built for the post season as we have seen from his past, I think we are going to see the best from Blatt as well and we are going to really see him in his element.

The new additions. Moz has been huge for this team (literally and figuratively). He just has to keep doing what he is doing. He will honestly be the difference maker against many of the teams we will face. Can't wait to see JR and Shump in the playoffs. After coming from the situation they were in, they will be so excited to be in the postseason and I can't wait to see what they do and the energy they will bring.

Let's not forget LeBron. Feels good that he is back where he belongs. It feels right. Don't get me wrong, LeBron had a good season, but he doesn't have to sleep walk anymore. Regular season is over and it's HIS time. Time for the beast to be awakened and we get to see the LeBron that gives 110% effort and will do anything to win. May his hunger to win a ring for Cleveland push him to a new level we haven't seen before. One that winning in Miami could never bring him.

What sucks is that Andy won't get to be on the floor. To even allow myself to think of us winning a ring, I don't like to do it without Andy. It's also weird that I have seen several places where Cleveland is the favorite to win the ring. Seems like too much pressure for a team that is new with a "rookie" head coach and 2 of the big 3 haven't been to the playoffs. I just hope we don't get caught up in that. I don't feel like it's championship or bust (for this season). I have a ton of optimism and hope we can win a ring this year, but let's just enjoy this run and watch the team grow.

 

[PIP]

LeBron's legacy is set... He's already got rings and has done this... If we win it this year it will be his 3rd and all be it nice, definitely not like your first....

That being said, I'd really like to see this as Kyrie's path and what can come of his career ? How he can stack up against the great point guards of the past who have won titles and where a few rings can ultimately place him amongst the greats....

In the journey to the ring, I'd really like to see Kyrie use it as a showcase.... LeBron's already set.... Kevin Love ? Well, he's no different than Bosh or a Glen Rice with the Lakers in 2000....So whatever...

However Kyrie has a legit chance to make the Cavs his team and can really lay a foundation here and start a legacy that could be right there with guys that have been with one franchise and had success...

 

[Walter White]

LeBron's legacy is set... He's already got rings and has done this... If we win it this year it will be his 3rd and all be it nice, definitely not like your first....

Sort of disagree in this case. Maybe with any other team, but with the Cavs with their history and LeBron's history with the team/Ohio, a ring (or multiple) with the Cavs could be what gives him a legitimate argument to surpass MJ as the greatest player that ever lived.

 

[tocov]

For me, this is all about Kyrie.
Bron has his rings. He's the experienced guy and the one who should lead us into battle. But I think this is the time when Kyrie steps up and turns from a promising your PG to one of the best in the game.
I definitely believe he has it in him, and I think LeBron will help him a lot with mental and psychological guidance. They seem to bode well and LeBron is going to bring Ky to heights we haven't seen before.

Also, I feel JR is gonna be a monster. I seriously think this is the first team JR feels 'at home'. He gelled so well with the team so quickly, and immediately became a favorite in the locker room. I think that makes him push harder on D and be the player he really has the potential to be. Not a sensless chucker, but a guy who knows how to get to his spots, knows how to play off the stars and gives it all he can on D.

All other guys will be instrumental, obviously. The machine must run smoothly and accurately, and we've seen during the season that if we get the rest and the practice - this is exactly what we see.

I am SUPER excited about these playoffs and am counting the hours.
LET'S GO CAVS!!!

 

[PIP]

He's never going to surpass MJ... The kid had already been on the ultimate stage 5 times and has lost 3 of those.... 10 scoring titles, 6 rings, 6 finals mvp, 5 mvp, defensive player of the year and countless achievements....

But most importantly 6-0 in June..

Losing 1 ? Maybe... Already losing 3 ? No chance.. That being said, he's already in that group with the greats and that's never gonna change whether he wins with Cavaliers or not... Winning a title for the Cleveland will be huge locally and will get acknowledged but that novelty will wear off outside of cleveland soon enough....

That's why I'm kinda excited for Kyrie here.... First off can he surpass Mark Price as the best Cavaliers PG based on his achievements ? Then can he reach heights that some of the greatest PG's of all time have ?

I'd love to see how his career would take off with a ring ? Would he separate himself from the rest of today's PG's ? Could it be the start of a career that could have 3 or 4 rings ? To which not many high level PG/scoring guards have ?

For the record, I think Kyrie is going to be spectacular during this run...

 

[Ohio]

LeBron can solidify himself as #2 ever based on what he does here. He has plenty to play for.

 

[Walter White]

He's never going to surpass MJ... The kid had already been on the ultimate stage 5 times and has lost 3 of those.... 10 scoring titles, 6 rings, 6 finals mvp, 5 mvp, defensive player of the year and countless achievements....

But most importantly 6-0 in June..

Losing 1 ? Maybe... Already losing 3 ? No chance.. That being said, he's already in that group with the greats and that's never gonna change whether he wins with Cavaliers or not... Winning a title for the Cleveland will be huge locally and will get acknowledged but that novelty will wear off outside of cleveland soon enough....

That's why I'm kinda excited for Kyrie here.... First off can he surpass Mark Price as the best Cavaliers PG based on his achievements ? Then can he reach heights that some of the greatest PG's of all time have ?

I'd love to see how his career would take off with a ring ? Would he separate himself from the rest of today's PG's ? Could it be the start of a career that could have 3 or 4 rings ? To which not many high level PG/scoring guards have ?

For the record, I think Kyrie is going to be spectacular during this run...

I see what you are saying. Not trying to turn this into a LBJ v. MJ thread, but if LeBron won 5-7 total rings, and obviously some of those would be in CLE, he would definitely be in the discussion. Of course he can't go perfect like MJ, but going to more Finals is good in itself in my eyes.

Anyway, really this first one is all about CLEVELAND anyway. Not even thinking about anyone's careers or any of that, but Cleveland breaking the drought/curse, whatever you want to call it, with these starved loyal fans, that will be beyond special. It will be one of the greatest sports moments in history.

 

[PIP]

Kobe's been to 7 and won 5. Still not good enough.

But agreed, it's about Cleveland

 

[enigmatic]

LeBron's legacy is set... He's already got rings and has done this... If we win it this year it will be his 3rd and all be it nice, definitely not like your first....

That being said, I'd really like to see this as Kyrie's path and what can come of his career ? How he can stack up against the great point guards of the past who have won titles and where a few rings can ultimately place him amongst the greats....

In the journey to the ring, I'd really like to see Kyrie use it as a showcase.... LeBron's already set.... Kevin Love ? Well, he's no different than Bosh or a Glen Rice with the Lakers in 2000....So whatever...

However Kyrie has a legit chance to make the Cavs his team and can really lay a foundation here and start a legacy that could be right there with guys that have been with one franchise and had success...

I said it in another thread but if Lebron wins a title here (hopefully this year) and breaks the curse of the most tortured fanbase in sports, it will completely stand apart from anything Magic, MJ, Bird etc have done. Not better or worse, but on it's own it will be one of the great moments in sports history, certainly in a few generations. It's inconcievable how much it would affect Cleveland/NE Ohio if it happens. It's literally uncharted territory.

I don't know what's going on in his head obviously, but if he can win the Cavs a title or 2, I would think he could live w/ that rather than catching MJ in rings.

 

[Huber.]

That first finals appearance loss with the Cavs doesn't count against him. Only for him for getting a bunch of scrubs there.

 

[bigfoot5415]

He's never going to surpass MJ... The kid had already been on the ultimate stage 5 times and has lost 3 of those.... 10 scoring titles, 6 rings, 6 finals mvp, 5 mvp, defensive player of the year and countless achievements....

But most importantly 6-0 in June..

Losing 1 ? Maybe... Already losing 3 ? No chance.. That being said, he's already in that group with the greats and that's never gonna change whether he wins with Cavaliers or not... Winning a title for the Cleveland will be huge locally and will get acknowledged but that novelty will wear off outside of cleveland soon enough....

That's why I'm kinda excited for Kyrie here.... First off can he surpass Mark Price as the best Cavaliers PG based on his achievements ? Then can he reach heights that some of the greatest PG's of all time have ?

I'd love to see how his career would take off with a ring ? Would he separate himself from the rest of today's PG's ? Could it be the start of a career that could have 3 or 4 rings ? To which not many high level PG/scoring guards have ?

For the record, I think Kyrie is going to be spectacular during this run...

I agree with the Kyrie comment 100%. I think he has a coming out party similar to DWade, young Kobe, AI, etc. He steps up in the big moment, and can score in so many ways. The only haters he has are out of jealousy. Those people dont actually pay attention to the details of his game.

As far as Lebron not passing Jordan due to finals loses. I dont get that. Why is it not celebrated that he has been to 5 finals before he was 30? As opposed to MJs 3 appearances? I understand MJ came out of college, but using that as a crutch does not reflect the changing times. Not to mention, I feel like losing in the playoffs is no different than losing in the finals. At the end of the day you werent the champ.

MJ won 6 rings in 13 playoff appearances. With multiple years that he had the opportunity to lose if he never walked away.

Lebron only has 2 finals through 9 playoff appearances as of right now, but he could hit that mark at season #13.

What happens if Lebron wins 3 more rings, and goes 5 for 8? I think that would be far more impressive.I dont think we could discredit 8 finals appearances.

I also hate to hear that Jordan retired excuse (not that youre using it), but so many fans say, "well Mike would have won more rings had he kept playing". Would he? I recall the 95 Magic beating the MJ lead Bulls in 6 games in the ECF. IDGAF that MJ just came back. At the end of the day, they had no answer for the inside out game.

Shaq had injury problems the next two years and heads West. MJ never has to see him in the playoffs again.

Then we look at the Spurs & Lakers teams of the late 90s and early 2000s (say through MJs final retirement). I cant see MJ with a watered down Bulls (no Scottie, Pip, or Rodman) beating those teams....even if he made it to the finals. IDC if Jordan stays, that team was going to be blown up by their cheap ass owner regardless & Phil was headed to LA. Hence why none of those guys stayed with the organization.

At the end of the day, Lebron can catch Mikes on court legacy, with an outside shot of even breaking the scoring record.

Right now, hes the best of all time, but passing him is a possibility.

 

[TransplantII]

No more "Chill mode"

LeBron will go all out and demand the same from everyone on the team.

 

[Ohio]

I always thought punishing someone for losing in The Finals was strange. Like, it would be better if he lost in the 1st round?

I think there's about a 1% chance LeBron passes MJ. Not impossible (I mean, he could go win 4 or 5 in a row, that would pass MJ). But highly unlikely.

But #2 is well within reach, and that is where I suspect he'll end up. He has the numbers. He has the MVPs. He'll probably get at least another 2 titles, which will be enough.

I do agree it is more about Kyrie, though. He obviously has way more to gain at this point in their respective careers.

Most importantly, it is more about Cleveland as a city/sports town than anything, as previously mentioned.

Go Cavs.

 

[priceFTW]

He's never going to surpass MJ... The kid had already been on the ultimate stage 5 times and has lost 3 of those.... 10 scoring titles, 6 rings, 6 finals mvp, 5 mvp, defensive player of the year and countless achievements....

But most importantly 6-0 in June..

Losing 1 ? Maybe... Already losing 3 ? No chance.. That being said, he's already in that group with the greats and that's never gonna change whether he wins with Cavaliers or not... Winning a title for the Cleveland will be huge locally and will get acknowledged but that novelty will wear off outside of cleveland soon enough....

I agree that LeBron will not be "forgiven" for losing three finals by the media and the mass audience that consumes easily digestible memes (2-3 vs. 6-0), but I think a lot of people forget that in Jordan's final three titles, he didn't play great offensively and he was not the best defensive player for the Bulls (Pippen was and Rodman has a case for number two) yet still gets the majority of the credit for the Bulls' final three titles. His teammates had a lot to do with him getting those three titles.

James led the playoffs in PER, WS, WS/48 and ORtg last season. In addition, five times in NBA history has a player had a PER of 30+ during an entire playoff run through the finals. Every team has won the title save last year's Heat:

Jordan, '91, Bulls 15-2 in playoffs.

Jordan, '93, Bulls 15-4 in playoffs.

S. O'Neal, 2000, Lakers 15-8 in playoffs.

James, 2012, Miami 16-7 in playoffs, down 3-2 to Celtics and 2-1 to Pacers.

James, 2014, Miami 13-7 in playoffs, only team ever to have a dominant player have a 30+ PER playoffs and not win the title.

LeBron had a better Finals series than did Jordan in any of Jordan's final three runs (yes, Jordan was older then, but when arguing about 2-3 vs. 6-0, the stats are still germane) and LeBron had a better overall playoffs, YET all James gets is "you lost" when his teammates didn't do anything while Jordan's did.

James in last year's finals: 28.2 ppg., 7.8 rpg., 4 apg., 57% FG, 52% 3P, 68% TS, 124 ORtg. He was a few throw away chucks away from 70% TS which is ridiculous, but nobody else did anything.

Jordan's averages for his final three runs: 27.5 ppg., 4.9 rpg., 3.8 apg., 43.4% FG, 31.6% 3P, 51.8% TS, 113 ORtg. He never shot better than 45.6% in any of the finals and never had a true shooting % higher than 53.8% nor had an ORtg higher than 116.

But all we get is "2-3 vs. 6-0" even though it's more complicated thn that.

Jordan took 22 shots per game over those final three runs and posted a 51.8% TS % DESPITE getting a shit ton of FTs (more than 10 a game) despite not being anywhere near his athletic prime and not driving the ball as much. If LeBron or any other first option shoots like that, he'll get murdered by the media. Even in his much maligned 2011 finals, James shot 48% compared to 41.5% by Jordan, but Jordan shot 67 FTs compared to 20 for James. Of course a lot of that was James's fault for the way he played, and some of it had to do with the zone defense Dallas played. Jordan got a lot of touch fouls called while shooting fadeways. LeBron's indecision and turnovers, of course, really hurt him and the Heat in that series.

Heck, even in the 2007 Spurs series, when he played poorly offensively, he was a total -4 on court over 170 minutes and was actually +6 in the two games here at home. Think about that: we were completely outmatched yet over 170 mi utes of play on court, he was only -4 against the best team in the world.

I don't think he can ever get to #1, but I do think it's more complicated than "2-3 vs. 6-0."

 

[artimusprime]

Sort of disagree in this case. Maybe with any other team, but with the Cavs with their history and LeBron's history with the team/Ohio, a ring (or multiple) with the Cavs could be what gives him a legitimate argument to surpass MJ as the greatest player that ever lived.

Yeah from a spots story perspective, if Lebron brings a ring back, it's one for the ages. You can imagine all the books, the movies that will come from that. It literally is a disney movie that's being lived out.