Offseason Rumors

[Steve_424]

How about a reset as the winter meetings are set to being in one week?

Some things to watch:

1) I'd expect Marcel Ozuna to be dealt sometime over the next 2-3 weeks. His relationship with the Marlins Front Office seems toxic, and Jeffrey Loria seems to want to get rid of him sooner rather than later. The Indians have been tied to him since July, with the Mariners reportedly showing serious interest as well.

2) I really don't see the Tribe dealing any of the big 3 SP. They saw what the Mets did and know what this rotation could be capable of. If the Indians get in the Playoffs again, an opposing team having to face one of Kluber/Carrasco/Salazar for 6 out of the 7 games would make the Indians a tough out. I think they'll wait for Zimmer in 2017 before jumping the gun and dealing away from their strength.

3) With that said, I expect the Indians to target one year stop-gaps for the outfield. This is why we've heard Shane Victorino's name. I could also see a smaller deal for a player like Ender Inciarte.

4) I also think any free agents will be one year deals. I can see Justin Morneau landing here. Juan Uribe has also been mentioned.

5) I don't see any major changes. That won't sit well with some folks, but I think the Indians view 2017 as the year another wave of young talent will hit the majors.

 

[BimboColesHair]

How would we feel about Hanley Ramirez if Boston picks up a nice chunk of his remaining salary...then play him at 3rd, 1st, or DH him...sounds like they are trying to move him for peanuts

 

[AZ_]

1B or DH only, and with very little money involved.

He's not generally the type of character guy this team looks for either.

 

[BimboColesHair]

1B or DH only, and with very little money involved.

He's not generally the type of character guy this team looks for either.

I know the character, and money, is an issue...but every single target the Indians will be linked to is going to have some sort of issue with them...his bat would look really nice in the lineup, provided he is healthy, another issue.

 

[Real Deal]

Our big 3 SP means nothing if we dont go make a splash and grab a bat.

Since the Mets are a comparison, go grab a bat like Yoenis, doesnt have to be him, but a simliar bat. These stopgaps wont put us over the top. Its now or never, cash in for a bat to go with our awesome pitching.

 

[AZ_]

I know the character, and money, is an issue...but every single target the Indians will be linked to is going to have some sort of issue with them...his bat would look really nice in the lineup, provided he is healthy, another issue.

He was getting himself out frequently last year, even when he was healthy.

He just doesn't work hard enough to age gracefully, so unless Boston literally wants to give someone $50 million to let him play for someone else it doesn't seem like a viable option.

You may be right about Indians targets having issues, but these are far too glaring.

 

[Steve_424]

Our big 3 SP means nothing if we dont go make a splash and grab a bat.

Since the Mets are a comparison, go grab a bat like Yoenis, doesnt have to be him, but a simliar bat. These stopgaps wont put us over the top. Its now or never, cash in for a bat to go with our awesome pitching.

That's the conundrum for the Indians though - if you deal one of the big 3, is the starting pitching all that great anymore? Is Kluber/Carrasco or Salazar/Bauer/Tomlin/Anderson going to be enough to seriously contend? I just don't think it is. You have Kluber locked in through 2018, Carrasco through 2020, and Salazar though 2019, all of team-friendly deals. They just need to get creative to fill holes on offense. If you add Ozuna in a trade using Bauer or Anderson and sign Morneau and Uribe to one year deals, maybe that's enough of a boost?

L-2B-Kipnis
S-SS-Lindor
L-LF-Brantley
L-DH-Morneau
R-CF-Ozuna
S-1B-Santana
R-C-Gomes
L-RF-Chisenhall
R-3B-Uribe

Bench - Perez/Almonte/Johnson/Ramirez

You could also start Almonte in CF and Ozuna in RF.

There are obviously a ton of scenarios that could play out different from this one but the point is I'm just not sure I buy that the Indians need to add a star bat to have a shot at seriously contending. Lindor/Kipnis/Brantley are your stars, you just need better complimentary pieces around them.

 

[macbdog]

More than one way to skin a cat. The Mets just went to a World Series with a trio of young studs, but they lost to a team whose rotation was fueled by stop gaps in Johnny Cueto, Edinson Volquez and Chris Young. Tomato/tomato/: I saw two teams that either dumpster dove or played the margins wonderfully, with risks on aging veterans on short deals paying off handsomely (Colon, Young, Volquez, Morales).

The deal for Zimmermann doesn't make it more necessary to hold onto a Kluber, Carrasco or Salazar- it makes them even more valuable. Look they can't sit here, call Zimmermann a no. 3 and an injury risk then act like Salazar- who is a shorter Dominican equivalent- is untouchable. I think now is the time to shop Salazar, be patient to wait out the Grienkes and Prices, then be ready to pull the trigger on a team buying high. Team Has to keep their options open considering the teams issues offensively.

 

[Steve_424]

More than one way to skin a cat. The Mets just went to a World Series with a trio of young studs, but they lost to a team whose rotation was fueled by stop gaps in Johnny Cueto, Edinson Volquez and Chris Young. Tomato/tomato/: I saw two teams that either dumpster dove or played the margins wonderfully, with risks on aging veterans on short deals paying off handsomely (Colon, Young, Volquez, Morales).

The deal for Zimmermann doesn't make it more necessary to hold onto a Kluber, Carrasco or Salazar- it makes them even more valuable. Look they can't sit here, call Zimmermann a no. 3 and an injury risk then act like Salazar- who is a shorter Dominican equivalent- is untouchable. I think now is the time to shop Salazar, be patient to wait out the Grienkes and Prices, then be ready to pull the trigger on a team buying high. Team Has to keep their options open considering the teams issues offensively.

Salazar is the better pitcher, both now and moving forward. I think it's fair to say both are #2-3 types at the current stage, with Salazar having the potential to trend up and Zimmerman down. Of course, the primary difference is Zimmerman will be making $22 M next year (and 4 years after) while Salazar will make the league minimum in 2016. That's just it - in most cases you have to have pretty good starting pitching to get to the postseason and win a championship. The Indians can't afford a guy like Zimmerman in free agency - a #2 or #3 - so it makes it that much more difficult to let go of a young, cost-effective #2 or #3. I'm not saying he's untouchable, I'm just saying I think you'd have an easier time finding complimentary bats than complimentary starting pitchers with the payroll the Indians will be working with.

 

[I'mWithDan]

That's the conundrum for the Indians though - if you deal one of the big 3, is the starting pitching all that great anymore? Is Kluber/Carrasco or Salazar/Bauer/Tomlin/Anderson going to be enough to seriously contend? I just don't think it is. You have Kluber locked in through 2018, Carrasco through 2020, and Salazar though 2019, all of team-friendly deals. They just need to get creative to fill holes on offense. If you add Ozuna in a trade using Bauer or Anderson and sign Morneau and Uribe to one year deals, maybe that's enough of a boost?

L-2B-Kipnis
S-SS-Lindor
L-LF-Brantley
L-DH-Morneau
R-CF-Ozuna
S-1B-Santana
R-C-Gomes
L-RF-Chisenhall
R-3B-Uribe

Bench - Perez/Almonte/Johnson/Ramirez

You could also start Almonte in CF and Ozuna in RF.

There are obviously a ton of scenarios that could play out different from this one but the point is I'm just not sure I buy that the Indians need to add a star bat to have a shot at seriously contending. Lindor/Kipnis/Brantley are your stars, you just need better complimentary pieces around them.

Indians have proven over and over again they can find and manufacture pitching. They have also proven they're awful at developing power hitters.

I wouldn't love trading one of the young pitchers but at this point, can you win in the AL with an offense this average / below average?

To do so, you need to see signifgant improvement from a pitching staff that was already 8th in the MLB in ERA (#2 in the AL), #2 in SO (#1 in the AL), #2 BAA (#1 in the AL) and #1 in CG. It's just asking a lot. How much better can they really get?

Kulber had a 3.49 ERA and won 9 games last season. He had a top 10 WHIP and top 20 WAR and didn't even get to 10 wins because his run support was so miserable.

The offense was in the back half of the league and bottom third of the AL. If you're looking for a win bump, that's where you're going to get it. Not by trying to just pitch your way there and put gum in the leaking dam holes.....IMO that is a low probability move based on their win total from last season and the unlikelihood the pitching staff can get significantly better.

 

[EdMonix11]

Price to Boston. 7/$217M

 

[BimboColesHair]

The Yankees are the evil empire because they buy all their players - The Boston Red Sox.

 

[AZ_]

 

[buckeyefan]

Nice to see the Tribe asking for a good amount for CC. Would love for the them to get a bat, but not if it isn't fair value or a steal for us.

 

[macbdog]

...why would San Fran turn that down? If that was it, that seems really fair. Belt is a solid bat at 1B and Pan in looks like a similar solid guy at 2b. Neither strikes me as an untraceable bat- not for an org that can draft. Must have been asking for an arm too.