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Phil Savage

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Def like the discussion in this thread..

A couple of things from my part and then i will go in detail later cause Im at school, looking at the stats, it said Leon hasnt played in four games I believe, so maybe ESPN.com is wrong in that part.

And Minter, I was looking all over for why he was the PUP and I couldnt see it, so thanks for bringing that up,.
 
cavincali said:
Schaffer hasnt panned out, but he seemed adequate as a replacement for shelton.
Cali, you and some others in this thread seem like you want to give Savage credit just for trying. You don't get a good score just for trying. Schaffer may have seemed like an adequate replacement for Shelton, but he's awful. It's the job of the GM and his underlings to scout and evaluate players, to figure out who is actually good, who fits in their system, etc. Trying and failing is still failing.

I haven't totally given up on Savage yet. I think he's head and shoulders ahead of the past regimes, but that's not saying anything. In all honesty, I could of done better than Clark and Davis. Still, I feel better than I did two years ago.

At this point I have 3 big complaints with Opie Cunningham (Savage):

1 - Not drafting linemen. The game is won in the trenches. Phil hasn't drafted any linemen high, and the Browns have zero young talent on the OL and DL. IMO, in your top 4 draft picks you should have at least 1 OL and 1 DL EVERY YEAR! Savage gets an F in this category. An F actually isn't even harsh enough.
2 - Giving away players with value. This has been documented through out this thread.
3 - Putting a team on the field without a starting caliber NFL QB. Two years in a row under Opie, and all he's give RAC to choose from to fill the most important position on the field is backups. To be honest, this year I don't know that the Browns QBs are even quality backups. What's worse, finding a QB has never been a strength of the teams Phil has been involved with. Kyle Boller anyone?

Getting three quality starters a draft is actually not too bad. If you can draft three quality starters and 3 quality backups every year, you would be one of the elite GMs. If he can keep getting us players through the draft, add some young talent to our lines, stop giving away players with value, and land us a real QB, I'll be thrilled.

Oh, and he needs to whack Carthon, obviuosly.
 
Next year, I think the team could greatly improve if he were to sign someone like Michael Turner to play RB, and draft some linemen. Bentley is a great center, so hopefully it will allow the guards to help out more with the premeire pass rushers, as LeCharles can take the DT's more one on one.

And a lot of the guys they got rid of had to go cause of their costs, etc. Obviously Warren and Brown were somewhat effective starters elsewhere last year, but a main factor of that was that they were most likely willing to take significant pay cuts to play somewhere else, versus what they were demanding the Browns to pay them. If a guy's base salary is 6 million, plus he counts another 3 million in bonus(for a 9 million dollar cap hit), if he's not willing to drop his base salary by a few million your only options are to cut or trade him.
 
Cali our gaurds suck, especially Andruzzi.
 
Style, I agree with just about everything you said except Frye. I give him the benefit of the doubt right now. You, me and many others agree our o-line is bad along with mo. Shouldn't that reflect a bit on your assessment on Frye? He should be given some leeway seeing, he is still a young starting qb.

I mean look at Grossman, it took him what 3+ years, now look at him. Everyone's already starting to write frye off after starting what 7 games?

The bears finally got a good o coordinator now look at them.

Fix our o-line and get a new coordinator, then I say we should re-evaluate charlie.
 
As for our RB situation, RD sure looks slow this year. Turner isn't a bad idea. I'd rather address our Guard and RT situation this FA and draft along with our d-line.

Savage has his work cut out.

I've said it many times for years, especially since romeo and Savage have hit the scene. I'm not worried at all about our defense with Savage, Romeo and Grantham. It's our offense that always struggles and seems completely inept
 
Droughns can be cut after the season and save around 3 million. He may have gotten that new deal, but he can still be replaced, and that's nice.
 
Another suggestion would be to look at a guy like DT Johnathon Sullivan who the Patriots just cut. He may be too injured to even play this year, but he was a top 10 pick 4 years ago. Try to get him in for a 2 year deal, rehab this offseason and practice with the team. Obviously he has some talent, or he wouldn't have gone that high, and in a low to no risk type situation, he may even pan out. He may suck, but you aren't out much if he does....he was free.
 
I have no qualms about Savage being the GM.... the Browns were completely broke when he got them, and he brought them to a respectable 6 wins, as opposed to broken ones (like the Ravens last season).

As for giving up players with value... let's talk about our entire defense that went to Denver...

Fixed: Running back problem with non-contributor Willie Green and oft-injured Lee Suggs in a terrible platoon system.. the only thing we got out of that was "combined running backs to exceed 1000 yards."

We traded our problem childs left over from Savage for a RB... that went on to rush for more than 1000 years, the first time in 20 some years of franchise history. Be it contract glee or injury, Droughns is slumping right now, no doubt, but I think that our running game will shape up once our o-line becomes more comfortable. He still has been hitting hard and being the rock he is... he broke Pollack's neck, poor guy.

Kenard Lang... we changed our defensive scheme, and he was no longer fit to be a DE. We attempted the conversion to LB because of his size and quickness. It failed, so we cut a grossly overpaid linebacker. He certainly had talent, but he did not fit with us so we didn't see fit to pay extra for him.

Of course he had been playing DE all his career, but he also should learn quick, given all the defensive experience he had. Kamerion Wimbley is growing into a fine LB, and he's heard less plays and been in less huddles than Lang. Kenard was given a year to prove himself, and he did not.


We haven't seen Wilson yet, except for in the preseason. But we will soon, if Northcutt stays injured for the next game. As a slot receiver, steady hands is key, and Northcutt is the best at dropping easy passes on 3rd downs. He does catch balls, just not on 3rd downs. Wilson will get a chance, don't write him off yet.

In terms of the O-line, I would have wanted to draft some young linemen. However, I am also in favor of getting linemen with some experience rather than raw ones, considering we have a very young QB to protect. Had Bentley not been injured for the season, the OL would have been much more sturdy than it is now. Bentley would have been the BEST pickup since the Browns came back to town. The offense has never had a leader, and Bentley certainly would have been that.... and will be. The O-line is the heart of the team.. if they don't perform, then the RB and QB can't do anything... so the offense is constantly putting up 3 and outs, and the defense is on for prolonged periods of time.

Savage has constructed a team with playmakers at every position.
Frye is a smart QB with good leadership skill,
Edwards is going to be in the top 5 WR's for the rest of his career,
as will Winslow among TE's,
Droughns has the potential, if he reaches the endzone more (OL), to be a Rudi Johnson/Jamal Lewis type (1200+ yards, 10+ TD's).
Bentley among the best at his position and is a Probowler
Leigh Bodden is one of the best corners in the league
Wimbley is coming into his own with the leadership qualities that McGinest brings
Ted Washington is as big a DE as you can get, also with leadership and winning experience
Sean Jones is a beast.

We didn't do so well last week, but we went up, with a shaky O-line, against an 0-3 Panthers team that still has one of the best defenses in the NFL... one that needed a win bad. Frye does well when he knows how much time he has, not being chased around be LB's and having his receivers covered by a top notch secondary.
 
hbomber20 said:
Style, I agree with just about everything you said except Frye. I give him the benefit of the doubt right now. You, me and many others agree our o-line is bad along with mo. Shouldn't that reflect a bit on your assessment on Frye? He should be given some leeway seeing, he is still a young starting qb.

I mean look at Grossman, it took him what 3+ years, now look at him. Everyone's already starting to write frye off after starting what 7 games?

The bears finally got a good o coordinator now look at them.
I'd be more optimistic about Charlie if he had Rex's arm. However, he has does not. Instead he has the worst arm in the league. :woohoo:
 
Style said:
I'd be more optimistic about Charlie if he had Rex's arm. However, he has does not. Instead he has the worst arm in the league. :woohoo:
My point is it took grossman this long even with that cannon and people wanna run frye out already.
 
The thing about Frye is, he doesn't learn. He still beleives he a strong arm and tries to force passes in and loses the game for us.

He doesnt know how to manage agame because he does the same stupid mistakes over and over and over and over.
 
Harp-

I agree, I think a player like Michael 'the burner' Turner could really help alot...
 
LT had trouble hitting the holes but Turner just broke through the STEELER D like it wasn't there...
 
I think I heard Courtney Brown was officially placed on IR yesterday by Denver. He just can't get past the injuries and it's too bad.
 

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