2015 Cleveland Browns Regular Season Thread

[Chris]

draft hits by farmer:
Bitonio, Kirksey, Desir, duke, cooper, campbell (in limited action)

udfa hits:
crowell, gabriel, kwaun williams

These are just off the top of my head, that's solid IMO

Do those 1st round picks look bad, aorn sure. But to say Farmer hasn't added talent to this team is not a fair statement.

Most of these guys are average players. Not horrible. Not difference makers.

 

[GreasySpread36]

Which is exactly why I don't even entertain the thought. We have so few hits in the draft, I'm not getting rid of Thomas for late first and late second rounder. Wouldn't even do it for two firsts.

I know we will probably have a new regime, but fuck it if we keep drafting like we do I wouldn't do it for 7 first rounders. Am I overexagerrating? I don't even know anymore.

Shelton, Erving, Manziel, Gilbert, Mingo, Trent, Weeden. Our last 7 first rounders. Many of them top 20 (which is not where the Broncos picks will be). Anyone want to trade that crap heap for Thomas? I know everyone assumes at some point we have to have competence and hit, but I just don't know anymore man. Leave me Joe Thomas. It is one of the few joys I have left watching this team.

The organization absolutely cannot take this attitude. They cannot paralyze themselves because they're afraid of making mistakes.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

If you cant even have faith that the FO will use the picks well, there are way bigger problems.

Do you have faith that if we got a late first and a late second we would get equal value in return for Thomas?

@GreasySpread36 same question. It isn't just our front office either, the end of the first round can be quite the crap shoot. Check out picks 20-32 the last 3 years. Yeah there are some players I'd love to have, but a lot more that haven't exactly been stellar to date.

 

[CommD]

Interesting, from Grossi's article today. I had not read this when I posted above, but it appears that CLE already had proposed the move I suggested, but it was turned down prior to the current LT being injured.

Offensive tackle Joe Thomas

Thomas repeatedly has said he doesn’t want to be traded to a contending team, that he wants to be a part of the “turnaround” of the Browns’ franchise. Trading the popular, blue-collar Thomas would be a PR fiasco for the Browns. But he is the only player on the team who could bring a first-round draft pick in return.

According to a source, the Browns had talks with the Denver Broncos early in the season after Denver lost left tackle Ryan Clady to injury in the preseason. The Broncos were willing to part with their first-round pick in 2016, but the Browns also asked for second-year linebacker Shaq Barrett, and that apparently killed the deal.

Coincidentally, Barrett had a big hand in Denver’s 26-23 overtime win over the Browns in Cleveland on Oct. 18. Playing in place of injured DeMarcus Ware, Barrett led the Broncos with nine tackles, had 1.5 sacks, forced a fumble, had three other tackles for loss, forced a fumble and defensed a pass.

The Broncos had resigned themselves to having rookie Ty Sambrailo fill Clady’s big shoes at left tackle. But Sambrailo will have season-ending shoulder surgery and the Broncos are revisiting the idea of trading for a left tackle to protect Peyton Manning.

Thomas, 30, has made the Pro Bowl in each of his eight seasons with the Browns. He is signed through 2018 at roughly $10 million a year in salary and bonuses.​

http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=51211

 

[GreasySpread36]

Do you have faith that if we got a late first and a late second we would get equal value in return for Thomas?

@GreasySpread36 same question. It isn't just our front office either, the end of the first round can be quite the crap shoot. Check out picks 20-32 the last 3 years. Yeah there are some players I'd love to have, but a lot more that haven't exactly been stellar to date.

I get the sentiment. I'm just saying the organization can't think that way. What are they going to do, refuse to draft because they've screwed up picks in the past? Those mistakes are over and done with, they can't be undone- all the organization can do is try and move forward.

 

[Chris]

Do you have faith that if we got a late first and a late second we would get equal value in return for Thomas?

@GreasySpread36 same question. It isn't just our front office either, the end of the first round can be quite the crap shoot. Check out picks 20-32 the last 3 years. Yeah there are some players I'd love to have, but a lot more that haven't exactly been stellar to date.

I never said I disagreed.

Getting the pick(s) for Thomas right now, while he still has his reputation, is absolutely the right football move, as the Browns will not be contending any time soon. They are on the treadmill not of mediocrity, but of suck. The problem is you are correct, it's not likely that the picks accrued in return would amount to much given the last ~8 or so first round selections by this team.

What I am saying is when you start operating your franchise under such parameters (ie: "We shouldn't make this move. We'll just fuck up the draft picks!") then you have much, much deeper seeded issues as a football team and honestly with that outlook you may as well just not follow the team at all.

 

[Surge]

Doing something with that value has generally been the issue.

This x100.

I don't care if we got 10 first round picks in this years draft. We'd likely swing and miss or trade down for shittier players anyway.

I have zero faith that we'd snag a difference maker in the draft. We've epically failed at getting game changers, and when one falls in our lap (Julio Jones, I still think Sammy Watkins can be one) we trade back.

Just another turn on the carousel in the life of a Browns fan.

Bring me a drink...

Also, if we're asking for a first for Joe Thomas, just think what they are asking for Barnidge!

 

[Phills14]

Whatever happens I pray to god we don't end up with the 22nd pick.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

Also, if we're asking for a first for Joe Thomas, just think what they are asking for Barnidge!

There isn't a team in this league with enough ammo to even make the initial inquiry for Barnidge.

 

[Surge]

Whatever happens I pray to god we don't end up with the 22nd pick.

Oh there's already some qb that is too short, too old, no arm strength, and parties all the time that prays we get that pick.

I know your type Jimmy!

 

[natedagg]

Re: Thomas. If he hasn't asked to be traded and he isn't all pissed off and being a malcontent, then we really shouldn't trade him. The biggest problem that the Browns have is a horrible brand. You have agents telling players not to talk to them. It's a bit of a self-reinforcing(?) feedback loop. Not so much a treadmill of mediocrity, more like a black hole of feces, pulling into it all of the shit, so many players avoid.

We need to build it from the top down so that people say "oh yeah, the Browns, what a solid organization." I think that means taking care of your classy players, especially Joe. So if he's down to stay, he should stay. He will help our other linemen, he will help players practice hard and be professional, he's a role model.

Everyone has a price, so if we get a 1st and 2nd, or a 1st and Shaq, then carry on. But his worth goes beyond what we could get back from the trade.

 

[Birdy89]

There isn't a team in this league with enough ammo to even make the initial inquiry for Barnidge.

They'll just wait until this off-season when they can sign him away as a free agent while we hoard cap space and compensatory picks.

That is the Ray Farmer doctrine regarding free agency after all when it comes to signing your own players.

Be very afraid.

 

[Birdy89]

Re: Thomas. If he hasn't asked to be traded and he isn't all pissed off and being a malcontent, then we really shouldn't trade him. The biggest problem that the Browns have is a horrible brand. You have agents telling players not to talk to them. It's a bit of a self-reinforcing(?) feedback loop. Not so much a treadmill of mediocrity, more like a black hole of feces, pulling into it all of the shit, so many players avoid.

We need to build it from the top down so that people say "oh yeah, the Browns, what a solid organization." I think that means taking care of your classy players, especially Joe. So if he's down to stay, he should stay. He will help our other linemen, he will help players practice hard and be professional, he's a role model.

Everyone has a price, so if we get a 1st and 2nd, or a 1st and Shaq, then carry on. But his worth goes beyond what we could get back from the trade.

Horrible rep is well earned when you look at how we handled guys like Gipson and Mack, as well as continually letting our best players walk instead of extending them.

There is a distinct difference between prudent cap management and just being cheap, and unfortunately Jimmy has developed a well earned reputation towards the latter since he got here.

He's sold off the naming rights to and monetized everything not bolted down, and yet has been more than suspect in his willingness to spend.

Just doesn't give off a good vibe to outsiders who you might want to convince to come here.

 

[AZ_]

Horrible rep is well earned when you look at how we handled guys like Gipson and Mack, as well as continually letting our best players walk instead of extending them.

There is a distinct difference between prudent cap management and just being cheap, and unfortunately Jimmy has developed a well earned reputation towards the latter since he got here.

He's sold off the naming rights to and monetized everything not bolted down, and yet has been more than suspect in his willingness to spend.

Just doesn't give off a good vibe to outsiders who you might want to convince to come here.

Yes, making Alex Mack the highest paid center in the league is a great example of Haslam being cheap.

Fantastic point.

 

[GreasySpread36]

He will help our other linemen, he will help players practice hard and be professional, he's a role model.

JT has been here for almost a decade and aside from him and a few other guys we haven't seen a whole lot of professionalism out of this organization. So apparently it isn't really rubbing off.

I would take Denver's 1st-rounder in a heartbeat. We can go 4-12 without Joe Thomas.