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Cavs Free Throw Shooting

Discussion in 'Cavs Talk' started by Dillinger, Nov 26, 2012.

  1. Dillinger

    Dillinger Cemented in the rotation

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    I haven't seen this discussed much, but the Cavs have been painfully bad at shooting free throws. And not just this season, but for the past eight years now...

    2005/2006 - 72.9% - 22nd
    2006/2007 - 69.5% - 29th
    2007/2008 - 71.7% - 28th
    2008/2009 - 75.7% - 21st
    2009/2010 - 72.0% - 30th
    2010/2011 - 74.5% - 24th
    2011/2012 - 71.6% - 28th
    2012/2013 - 70.6% - 27th


    Which equals a 72.31% average over an 8-year span. Not good.

    It's disheartening for me, because often times one or two more made free throws can be the difference between winning and losing.

    Free throws are one of the strangest instances in all of professional team sports. It's literally the easiest attempt at attaining points within a team concept. In any other team sport, an attempt at garnering points is always met with some sort of resistance. For every touchdown or field goal attempt in football, there's 11 members of the opposition trying to stop you. In baseball, scoring any run must be done against the will of your opponent. There are plenty of other examples, but you get the idea.

    It is both the easiest and most difficult shot to make in basketball. It's one of those conundrums that reveals how important psychology is in athletics. Even for a small moment in time, the free throw takes the team aspect out of the equation and turns it into an individual sport. It's just you and the basket with no one defending your shot or defending the goal.

    The roster makeup from 6, 7, or 8 years ago is completely different than it is now, so we can't blame that. We've had different coaches, assistant coaches, and players yet we remain near the bottom of the league each and every season.

    I don't know. Maybe I'm making too much of this. It's just one of those things that gets under my skin.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  2. Len

    Len Situational Stopper

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    For most of those Lebron years he sucked at shooting FreeThrows so he put the average right in that 72%ish zone. Also, we did not have any elite FreeThrow shooters to help bring the average up. But what we did have was BenWallace and Shaq for a couple of those years bringing the average down.

    For this years team, we have a couple guys who should be above 80% pushing 85-90 (Irving,Waiters,Gee,Gibson) so that will help the overall average, but again, we have TT with his 50%.
     
  3. Cavatt

    Cavatt NBA Starter

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    Man I think Gee has been playing well, and he he was leading the league in ft%, but then he missed 3 against the Heat. When you lose by 2 that hurts.
     
  4. Cratylus

    Cratylus Brunette Connoisseur

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    I'm with ya, Dillinger. When I'm yelling at my TV during Cavs' games chances are it's because of missed free throws. As a player who excelled at this in high school (I made 126 out of 138 during my senior year which is 91.3%), to this day it irks me when a professional player can't hit them for at least a 80% clip. Being successful at FT shooting is mostly about muscle memory... which means finding a form that works for you and then duplicating that form by repeating it over and over and over again in practice. If these guys are professionals, then they should have no excuse why they can't find the time to work on and "perfect" this important aspect of their games.

    As you pointed out, these are basically FREE POINTS that players are just giving away.
     
  5. Dillinger

    Dillinger Cemented in the rotation

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    To be fair, Tristan isn't the only player going through free throw shooting woes.

    Gibson is at 73% right now. He's better than that.

    Even Zeller... What the hell is wrong here? This is a guy that averaged 77% in college (80% just last year) and is now at 48%. I know it's a small sample size early on and it will probably even itself out, but it is concerning to me.

    It's the same exact shot as in college, yet he comes to Cleveland and suddenly can't even make half of them? What gives?
     
  6. Rainman

    Rainman SuperStar

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    Although free throw shooting is probably one of the most important and easiest ways to put points on the board, shooting 72% is just below the league average. Making just one or two more free throws a game is crucial in close ball games but I wouldn't get too worried about it. I think about 75% would do it! You just have to put the right guys at the line, no guys like TT. Either way I think we will be ok. Look at last years stats, only 1 team was able to put up an 80%, and that is amazing... OKC

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    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]16
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Portland Trail Blazers
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    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15965
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    [TD="align: right"]2402
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    [TD="align: right"]5417
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    [TD="align: right"]478
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    [TD="align: right"]1133
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    [TD="align: right"]1251
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    [TD="align: right"]6415
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    [TD="align: right"]97.2
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    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]17
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Atlanta Hawks*
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    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]16165
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    [TD="align: right"]2429
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    [TD="align: right"]5348
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    [TD="align: right"]492
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    [TD="align: right"]1025
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    [TD="align: right"]652
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    [TD="align: right"]1178
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    [TD="align: right"]96.6
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    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]18
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Chicago Bulls*
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    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15940
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2467
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5462
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    [TD="align: right"]419
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    [TD="align: right"]915
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    [TD="align: right"]2165
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    [TD="align: right"]3080
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    [TD="align: right"]1527
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    [TD="align: right"]456
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    [TD="align: right"]388
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    [TD="align: right"]923
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    [TD="align: right"]1139
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    [TD="align: right"]6359
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]96.3
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]19
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Dallas Mavericks*
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    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]16065
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2398
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5412
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].443
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    [TD="align: right"]497
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    [TD="align: right"]1464
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    [TD="align: right"]1029
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    [TD="align: right"]1334
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    [TD="align: right"].771
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    [TD="align: right"]665
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2158
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    [TD="align: right"]2823
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    [TD="align: right"]1380
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    [TD="align: right"]565
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    [TD="align: right"]337
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]926
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1226
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6322
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]95.8
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]20
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Memphis Grizzlies*
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15940
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2425
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5422
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].447
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]277
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]849
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].326
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1142
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1504
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].759
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]831
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1944
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2775
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1290
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]631
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]345
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]955
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1316
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6269
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]95.0
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]21
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Orlando Magic*
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15965
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2275
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5162
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].441
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]670
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1785
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].375
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]995
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1508
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].660
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]742
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2060
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2802
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1321
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]451
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]275
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]984
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1168
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6215
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]94.2
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR="class: hl"]
    [TD="align: right"]22
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Washington Wizards
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15865
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2414
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5475
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].441
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]344
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1075
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].320
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1008
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1386
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].727
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]775
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1975
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2750
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1262
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]527
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]417
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1008
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1405
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6180
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]93.6
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]23
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Philadelphia 76ers*
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15915
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2471
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5516
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].448
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]349
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]963
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].362
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]889
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1198
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    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: right"]340
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]738
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1157
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6180
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]93.6
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]24
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]New Jersey Nets
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15890
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2262
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5320
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].425
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    [TD="align: right"]1481
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].342
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1113
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    [TD="align: right"]1433
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    [TD="align: right"]783
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    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: right"]1268
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6144
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]93.1
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]25
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Cleveland Cavaliers
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15965
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2261
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5360
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].422
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]440
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1273
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].346
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1178
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2790
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1308
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]466
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]262
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1017
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1317
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6140
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]93.0
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]26
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Boston Celtics*
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15940
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2341
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5086
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].460
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]363
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"].367
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    [TD="align: right"]1017
    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: right"].778
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]509
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2560
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1557
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]498
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]362
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]979
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1315
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6062
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]91.8
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]27
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Detroit Pistons
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15965
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2291
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5232
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1033
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5997
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]90.9
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD="align: right"]28
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: left"]Toronto Raptors
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    [TD="align: right"]66
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15965
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5154
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    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: right"]90.7
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: left"]Charlotte Bobcats
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15890
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    [TD="align: right"]2193
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]5293
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [TD="align: right"][/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]15968
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]2407
    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
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    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1384
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]507
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]336
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]962
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]1291
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]6353
    [/TD]
    [TD="align: right"]96.3
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    </TBODY>[/TABLE]
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Maximus

    Maximus BANNED Staff Member

    Joined:
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    First couple games it was probably just nerves. The last few i'd blame some on the mask...it's driving him crazy. He'll by fine from the line as the season progresses.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. "Boobie" Gibson

    "Boobie" Gibson In the Rotation

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    Isn't it pathetic when these dudes who get paid to do this shit can't hit 9 out of 10 FTs?

    You can find normal people who can do that.
     
  9. Jon

    Jon ~

    Joined:
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    Outside of an endgame situation, I never felt like missed free throws / points earlier in the game meant all that much. There always seems to be a letdown where the winning team (and/or the refs) will let you back in, and then it's all about which team can keep control once both teams are fully engaged in the outcome.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  10. Cavatt

    Cavatt NBA Starter

    Joined:
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    I think you are right about this. Points at the end are worth more because the team knows approximately how many additional points will be needed to win.

    It also obviously depends on how much your team gets to the line. Teams vary a lot in in regards to the percentage of their points that come from foul shooting.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. "Boobie" Gibson

    "Boobie" Gibson In the Rotation

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    Hahaha, easily one of your worst posts of all time.

    Points are points are points. You won't be in a position to win a game if you don't score enough points leading up to the end of the game...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. MoFlo

    MoFlo Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
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    9 out of 10?

    Hell, only 3 players in NBA history have been able to hit 90% of their career free throws..
     
  13. Rainman

    Rainman SuperStar

    Joined:
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    Yes and no. Put a regular guy who couldn't play at an NBA level but shoots 9 out of 10 from the line may be different in game. Free throws have more to do than putting the ball in the basket. Put a regular guy in the situation and add fatigue, the pressure of thousands watching you and a team relying on you in a tight game then you probably won't see that high percentage. Only repitition and being placed in those same situations again and again will get you more comfortable.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2012
  14. "Boobie" Gibson

    "Boobie" Gibson In the Rotation

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    I still think it's pathetic. It's a skill... nothing more, nothing less.
     
  15. Jack Brickman

    Jack Brickman Preview Team

    Joined:
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    I remember thinking during the Heat game, "Why are the Cavs always so awful at free throw shooting?" Guess you read my mind, Dillinger.
     
  16. Giambiwannabe7

    Giambiwannabe7 Sixth Man

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    I love this mentality of well, hey, I can make 9 out of 10 in my backyard all day, or I made 9 out of 10 in HS ball. :chuckles: Well, Chauncey Billups, Ray Allen, Ric Bary, Larry Bird all need your phone number because only mark Price and Steve Nash averaged 90% over their careers.

    The X Factors of playing in a game and doing it multiply the difficulty quotient to a million as compared to just about any other situation imagineable.
     
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  17. "Boobie" Gibson

    "Boobie" Gibson In the Rotation

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    I don't believe you. You're just giving them a pass like a lot of other people.

    If both Price and Nash were able to do it, I'm sure plenty of other players are capable of doing so as well. Players just don't focus on that part of their game as much as they should. It isn't the "cool" thing to do.

    If you shoot 200 free throws a day it should be as routine as walking down the street.

    Prove otherwise.
     
  18. MoFlo

    MoFlo Administrator Staff Member

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    So, Larry Bird was worried about doing the "cool" thing, and that's why he failed to shoot 90% for his career on FT's? :chuckles:

    Shooting them in the gym isn't the same as shooting them in a hostile environment. Even shooting them by yourself in the gym, you're not going to make 200 out of 200.
     
  19. "Boobie" Gibson

    "Boobie" Gibson In the Rotation

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    Lol no, but just like any other trait, the more you practice the better you will become.

    Point being, there is no reason that professional NBA players should be shooting 50% from the stripe. Inexcusable in my opinion.

    EDIT: And lol... Larry Bird shot 88.6% for his career and 89% (in more "high pressured" games (playoffs)). That's virtually 9 out of every 10, so that example isn't even valid. I'm talking about 50% more so than 89%...
     
  20. Giambiwannabe7

    Giambiwannabe7 Sixth Man

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    What do you mean you don't believe me? There are only 2 guys who have shot 90% for their career. Period. Look it up yourself if you don't believe me.

    The point is this whole concept of it's just muscle memory is pure garbage. Muscle memory is part of the core of good FT shooting, but it is by no means the be and end all. If that was the case there would be 100's if not 1000's of 90% FT shooters. You think all it takes is good muscle memory based on a couple hundred reps every day? These guys are pumped in the beginnig of games and fatigued at the end of long stretches. They have thousands of people screaming at them, players trying to psyche them out, and the pressure that comes with making millions.

    I'm not giving anyone a pass, but your definition of what these guys should do is far fetched. Should we be better than 70%? Absolutely. 90%? Get over yourself.
     

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