Dion Waiters

[Lazor]

Don't take it personally. The 10 days before Dion was traded I outlined in detail why he was a bad player. I got about 10 dislikes from cashius, 25 from red and 15_ from qaws. At least Cashius will attempt to talk about it though.

Let's not forget about futuredome

 

[MirORich]

As a casual fan, I'm interested to see how Dion does in OKC over the course of 20-30 games. One 1-9 game like tonight or the 7-9 game he had the previous game do not tell us much more about Dion than we already no. I don't like coming in here to slam him for a game like tonight, because I tend to prefer to look at the longview with our own guys and think its only fair to do the same with other players.

Max's larger point about Dion having so little effect on a game when he does not get points does stand though and is something Dion is going to have to figure out to be viewed as a better player.

In terms of short term impact on this season, I will take Smith, Shumpert, and Mozgov 10 out of 10 times over Dion

For long terms impact, I still tend to favor Mozgov, Shumpert, and Smith over Dion + the Memphis pick. How Shumpert performs in the second half of this season is of course key.

 

[Cashius X]

Since Cashius X, red, and qaws23 seem to hit disagree on every single anti-Waiters post, how about you guys actually respond and explain why you disagree rather than just posting things like "bow down to King Dion..."

You know how high I am on Dion and you saw in the post I "disagreed" with that he said "He doesn't contribute to consistent winning."...

Use your head, the fuck? It's not hard to decipher which part(s) of his post I found disagreeable.

And I don't post things like "bow down to King Dion" so get out of my face with that

 

[Zen]

Max's larger point about Dion having so little effect on a game when he does not get points does stand though and is something Dion is going to have to figure out to be viewed as a better player.

In terms of short term impact on this season, I will take Smith, Shumpert, and Mozgov 10 out of 10 times over Dion

For long terms impact, I still tend to favor Mozgov, Shumpert, and Smith over Dion + the Memphis pick. How Shumpert performs in the second half of this season is of course key.

I'd take just Mozgov 10/10 times for dion + pick. The team looks completely different with him anchoring, he isn't a big name but his impact and fit are paramount.

You throw in JR Smith who is better at every single facet of the game than Dion is as the "throw in" and Shump on top and its highway robbery.

 

[Dylan Windler's Mom]

Don't take it personally. The 10 days before Dion was traded I outlined in detail why he was a bad player. I got about 10 dislikes from cashius, 25 from red and 15_ from qaws. At least Cashius will attempt to talk about it though.

Well it's nice to see you've finally showed your face again for the 1st time in weeks after Dion had a poor shooting performance today. Must have felt it was safe to come out of hiding! Where were you last game and the previous nights before that? It's not a coincidence that you only pop up after he has bad games and nowhere to be found when he performs well. I'm sure you'll be back in here on a night where his shot isn't falling saying "see I told you so!" Like clockwork

 

[Rich]

Well it's nice to see you've finally showed your face again for the 1st time in weeks after Dion had a poor shooting performance today. Must have felt it was safe to come out of hiding! Where were you last game and the previous nights before that? It's not a coincidence that you only pop up after he has bad games and nowhere to be found when he performs well. I'm sure you'll be back in here on a night where his shot isn't falling saying "see I told you so!" Like clockwork

Which would be most nights, as proven by his shooting percentages.

And I know at least for me, my post was moved here. It was initially in the J.R. Smith thread. I don't like coming to this thread anymore.

 

[CHIMOCHIS]

I don't understand what's the big deal

Dion is the guy who would have good game, mixed with bad games


He is a volume shooter who we didn't need

We needed defense

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

He is touching the ball more because he is playing more.

Except he's not getting more touches despite the extra minutes:

Dion Waiters on why he's fitting in well in OKC: 'I actually, like, you know, touch the ball'

....Interestingly enough, while Waiters clearly seems to feel more freedom in Brooks' offense, the numbers don't necessarily back up his claim.

Through 32 games in Cleveland this season, Waiters was averaging 35.6 total touches and 31.6 front-court touches in 23.7 minutes per game, according to the NBA's SportVU player tracking data. Through five games in Oklahoma City, he's seen more court time (27.6 minutes per contest) but a bit less of the ball, averaging 34 total touches and 30.4 front-court touches a night.

His total time of possession has dropped slightly (1.8 minutes per game in Cleveland, 1.7 in OKC) despite the extra four minutes of nightly playing time, too. And while he's tended to get the ball closer to the basket a bit more often through a handful of games with the Thunder than he did with the Cavs this season — he's averaging 0.8 "close touches" (defined as opportunities starting within 12 feet of the rim) per game in OKC, up from 0.5 in Cleveland — it's not a massive difference in terms of the shift in his offensive profile.

And yet, Waiters' offensive efficiency has jumped up a notch. He's gone from averaging .333 points per half-court touch with the Cavs, an unimpressive mark that nestled him snugly between Tony Allen and Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, two wings known far more for their defense than for their scoring touch, to .474 points per half-court touch in OKC, a much stronger tally that would place just outside the top 10 among non-big-men in that department over the course of the full season. His True Shooting and Effective Field Goal percentages with the Thunder would both represent career highs, and his per-minute scoring's much more in line with what he managed during his first two NBA seasons than what he put up during a disappointing start to the season in Cleveland.

So what gives? Well, basically, he's just hitting jumpers more frequently.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-b...like--you-know--touch-the-ball-200356522.html

In other words, Dion resents the Cavs for supposedly causing his poor performance this season, when the truth is the fault was his for not hitting his shots. Simply put, he didn't take personal responsibility for his own poor play -- it was somebody else's fault.

That's a pretty big deal to me, because a guy who takes responsibility for his own poor play is more likely to put in extra effort to make up for his lack of scoring contribution. But someone who doesn't take responsibility for his play, and blames his team/teammates instead, is going to be resentful, and it is going to show in his play.

Of course, there's a decent argument that Dion is just a slow starter, and could have been expected to play better as the season progressed. But that's a different issue from blaming other people for his poor shooting.

 

[TFIR]

OK the real story:

Dion Waiters loves the Thunder because they actually pass to him
By Mike Prada

@MikePradaSBN on Jan 20 2015, 11:08a 15

Thomas B. Shea-USA TODAY Sports
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On a superficial level, Dion Waiters was traded from one team with ball-dominant superstars that don't pass a lot to a different team with ball-dominant superstars that don't pass a lot. And yet, the new Oklahoma City Thunder guard is thriving after struggling to find his role with LeBron James' Cavaliers.

The difference, according to Waiters? His new team actually believes he exists. From Darnell Mayberry of The Oklahoman:

"Listen," he said, "they give me the ball. Like, I touch the ball. Like, I actually, like, you know, touch the ball."

Back in the dark ages, we had to accept Waiters' quote at face value. Now, we have amazing tools at our disposal to make sure we aren't being fed a lie.



THE STATISTICAL EVIDENCE
Waiters was traded on Jan. 5. Thanks to NBA.com, we can actually track touches per game thanks to the recent unveiling of SportVU data. Here's what we've learned.

BEFORE JAN. 5

• TOUCHES PER GAME: 35.6
• MINUTES PER GAME: 23.7
• TIME OF POSSESSION: 1.8 minutes/game

AFTER JAN. 5

• TOUCHES PER GAME: 34
• MINUTES PER GAME: 27.6
• TIME OF POSSESSION: 1.7 minutes/game

Soooooooo, Waiters is playing more minutes in Oklahoma City, yet he's touching the ball less often. THAT'S interesting. Clearly, this shows that ...





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[kookoo]

He didn't want to accept his role here. The reason he has a lower time of possession is because he's actually taking most opportunities to catch and shoot. He still does some of the same dumb dribbling as he did here, but it seems like he's reduced his stupidity by a few possessions a game.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Dion Waiters is a poor man's JR Smith. I still can't believe Griffin turned him and the Memphis pick into JR Smith, Iman Shumpert, and Timofey Mozgov.

I think people need to remember that Smith was having a terrible year and had a bad contract that he can opt into next summer. The Knicks didn't want him back, but the way he was playing there was no way he wasn't opting in for another year at that price.

Now, it looks like we've gotten "locked in" JR Smith, and if that continues it's obviously a win for us. But there's a reason that he was available for free. Hell, they gave us Shumpert just to take him off their hands.

 

[Zen]

I think people need to remember that Smith was having a terrible year and had a bad contract that he can opt into next summer. The Knicks didn't want him back, but the way he was playing there was no way he wasn't opting in for another year at that price.

Now, it looks like we've gotten "locked in" JR Smith, and if that continues it's obviously a win for us. But there's a reason that he was available for free. Hell, they gave us Shumpert just to take him off their hands.

Yeah when I comment about JR its mainly about his talent length and size - strictly basketball stuff. I am fully expecting issues on the mental side.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Oh man, this is just so fantastic. Qaws drops the "old" and what happens, the very next game Dion goes...1-9.

But hey, like any game now he's gonna turn into a consistent contributor. Juuuuuust about there.

Honestly, with the way Dion shoots, I don't think he'll ever be consistent. It's nearly impossible with that much arc. I'm glad we traded him, but was VERY skeptical of the return. If JR Smith turned out to be the biggest cancer in the league, and Shumpert is nothing more than a Thabo Sefolosha who had a good rookie season, we would've been in trouble.

Thank god JR is working out for us.

 

[czvo]

Honestly, with the way Dion shoots, I don't think he'll ever be consistent. It's nearly impossible with that much arc. I'm glad we traded him, but was VERY skeptical of the return. If JR Smith turned out to be the biggest cancer in the league, and Shumpert is nothing more than a Thabo Sefolosha who had a good rookie season, we would've been in trouble.

Thank god JR is working out for us.

Dion's best-case scenario is probably Jamal Crawford. Not really a point guard, takes a lot of tough shots, best role is as 6th man off the bench. If Dion is your primary ball-handler, you're probably going to have trouble winning a lot of games simply because of the number of shots he would be taking on such a poor shooting percentage.

 

[Visitor]

I really wanted Dion to put it together for us but now that he's gone I'm glad I don't have to watch that spasmatic step back jumper of his anymore. Except on Sunday...

JR was a guy I wanted back when Chicago traded him for 2 2nd rounders. So far he seems to be a better teammate and looks like he actually enjoys playing AND seeing his teammates succeed. Not something I saw often out of Dion.