Dion Waiters

[Spencer Hawes]

You guys are too busy looking at shooting percentages to see that Dion is growing over at OKC and ignoring that a similar style veteran in Cleveland is starting and the team is having success.

but yes 3 coaches in three years and none bothering to use a 4th round draft pick for what he was drafted for is a recipe for success because now that lebron is here none of it matters.

Kyrie had 3 coaches in 3 years also. Kyrie is not being used for what he is drafted for also. Stop making excuses for the Dion. He was a mistake. Shouldn't have been drafted so high. Grant fucked up the pick. Not so hard to see.

 

[Tornicade]

Kyrie had 3 coaches in 3 years also. Kyrie is not being used for what he is drafted for also. Stop making excuses for the Dion. He was a mistake. Shouldn't have been drafted so high. Grant fucked up the pick. Not so hard to see.

Kyrie had two pro's in his lineups that didnt have anything to prove in his rookie. Kyrie has had alot of issues overshadowed by his talent.

Kyrie is a spectacular talent and the Cavs did him a true disservice as well

look at the lakers with Magic Johnson. the Celtics with Larry Bird. The Spurs with Tim Duncan. The Heat with Wade. etc

If you want young talent to grow you fill your roster with Veterans who know how to play.

Cavs got bailed out with Lebron returning as did Kyrie.

Lebron has no interest in projects. he is interested in Winning.

Dion also was the primary cog that netted two starters and depth. That is pretty solid for a "wasted" draft pick.

2 gms and 3 coaching staffs in 3 years . we are pretty lucky to have Lebron and Love in Cleveland otherwise the Cavs were hellbent to become a feeder team like the Clippers were for a bit.

This Organization has made alot of mistakes including how Dion was handled.
Does that Absolve Dion of his own shortcomings? no but its there nonetheless.

One thing is for sure Dion is winning while learning and has teammates open to him. Those are things in his favor and only time will tell what he does with it.

 

[Spencer Hawes]

Kyrie had two pro's in his lineups that didnt have anything to prove in his rookie. Kyrie has had alot of issues overshadowed by his talent.

Kyrie is a spectacular talent and the Cavs did him a true disservice as well

look at the lakers with Magic Johnson. the Celtics with Larry Bird. The Spurs with Tim Duncan. The Heat with Wade. etc

If you want young talent to grow you fill your roster with Veterans who know how to play.

Cavs got bailed out with Lebron returning as did Kyrie.

Lebron has no interest in projects. he is interested in Winning.

Dion also was the primary cog that netted two starters and depth. That is pretty solid for a "wasted" draft pick.

2 gms and 3 coaching staffs in 3 years . we are pretty lucky to have Lebron and Love in Cleveland otherwise the Cavs were hellbent to become a feeder team like the Clippers were for a bit.

This Organization has made alot of mistakes including how Dion was handled.
Does that Absolve Dion of his own shortcomings? no but its there nonetheless.

One thing is for sure Dion is winning while learning and has teammates open to him. Those are things in his favor and only time will tell what he does with it.

Dion was given the same opportunity to show what he can do when Lebron came back. I mean, everyone was anticipating BIG things from him, even himself and going as far as calling it the Big 4. Lebron has won 2 championships and been to the Finals 5 times. Has Durant and Westbrook achieve anything close to him? Don't compare whatever he's doing in OKC to someone who's already an NBA champion and had given him the opportunity to prove himself. Kyrie had to change and he most certainly did. Love appears to be on his way. Dion? The only guy on the roster than constantly does the rain dance at the 3 point line whenever he doesn't have the ball? He didn't conform to what Lebron viewed as a championship teammate is suppose be like so he had to go. Point blank. Good for him he's at OKC and "improving" lol. We'll see how that's gonna turn out and whether they'll make it to the Finals let alone win one with Dion taking away shots from Durant and Westbrook.

Btw, I guess you conveniently left out the draft picks that we had to give up in acquiring the other 2 starters? Funny thing is, Moz and JR Smith have exceeding expectations and if both were playing like they are now at the time of the trade, we would have to give up more to acquire them. This is a testament to what a great job the GM had done and NOT what the value was traded for at that time.

Like I said, you was wrong about Dion. He was the WRONG PICK at that time. It was a reach plain and simple. Grant fucked up. Admit it and move on.

You were wrong about TT when you placed his jump shooting abilities to Dirk and LA rofl! And you were certainly wrong about Drummond. He would clearly be the #2 player pick from his draft after a redo and I had said at that time that he was the only player in the draft that had the tools to be better than AD. Fuck Dion's first step. Jamal Crawford has a better one.

 

[natedagg]

The only thing that bothers me about dion is that at one point, I thought he was tough. I bought in to the whole hard knocks philly thing and thought he was emotionally and mentally tough. I liked that and the chip on his shoulder.

Now I see the chip, but I am coming to realize that nothing about his actions on the court represent toughness. He is still competitive in his heart, still athletic even by NBA standards, still talented. But emotionally/mentally tough? It's quite the opposite.

This thread has turned to shit, and most of it is haters who feel duped and want some revenge that they never will quite achieve, and a couple of stubborn donkeys who have taken on the cause of defending this young man.

The thunder are a better team fit for Dion, and with their retooled roster, they are pretty stacked when healthy. Most importantly, the Cabs are building something great here, and it has much less to do with Dion than the right fit that we have with these new pieces. I think it is much easier to root for Dion than root against him at this point, especially since it's obvious that we are in a better place as a team after the trade.

 

[MirORich]

You guys are too busy looking at shooting percentages to see that Dion is growing over at OKC and ignoring that a similar style veteran in Cleveland is starting and the team is having success.

This is where I would disagree.

I still like Dion and think he can grow into a player that has an important role on a winning team.

But three major style differences separate current day veteran JR Smith from current day Dion Waiters.

1. JR, on this team, will attempt to play good defense regardless of whether his shot is falling or if the ball is coming to him. And if he slips on doing that, we also picked up Shumpert who excels at perimeter D

2. JR takes lots of shots like Dion but the vast majority of his shots are catch and shoot in the flow of the offense. He dribbles around into shots far less than Dion did. He is less of a ball stopper than Dion was. He doesn't create as many dribble drive opportunities as Dion did, but we have no shortage of those via LeBron and Kyrie. JR provides a better/more complentary skill set in that regard for OUR roster, whereas Dion while talented, a lot of what he provided was already done better by LeBron and Kyrie

3. JR has always been and likely will always be a superior 3 pt shooter in both raw stats and reputation, which affects how the defense plays us in a positive way.

You say that people are ignoring positive strides that Dion is making in Oklahoma but what do you expect. At this point Dion has zero to do with the Cavaliers. Do you think that Cavs fans are going to log on to FirstRow or Ballstreams to watch every OKC game? No. All most Cavs fans will do is check the raw stats and see that Dion's overall shooting % has gone down from 40% with the Cavs to 38% with OKC and his 3P% has remained the same at a horrid 25%

None of that is meant as a knock on Dion for the long term. I personally still have an interest in seeing how he does over his career but seeing as he's no longer a Cleveland Cavalier, how many other Cavs fans do you honestly expect to have the same outlook or do anything more than look at the raw stats and percentages?

 

[SanduskyCav]

It was in garbage time, but he missed a wide open point blank bunny shot right at the basket. Just hit the backboard and rolled off the rim to the other side lol. Dion couldn't believe it, as if that hasn't happened to him 2 or 3 times already with OKC.

In non-garbage time he also shot the ball from the corner 3 pt area on to the top of the backboard.. lol

For people saying that Dion has grown since going to OKC, you're blind.

 

[Rich]

You guys are too busy looking at shooting percentages to see that Dion is growing over at OKC and ignoring that a similar style veteran in Cleveland is starting and the team is having success.

but yes 3 coaches in three years and none bothering to use a 4th round draft pick for what he was drafted for is a recipe for success because now that lebron is here none of it matters.

Nothing similar between Smith and Waiters in game.

 

[blommen]

You were wrong about TT when you placed his jump shooting abilities to Dirk and LA rofl! And you were certainly wrong about Drummond. He would clearly be the #2 player pick from his draft after a redo and I had said at that time that he was the only player in the draft that had the tools to be better than AD.

Somewhere Lillard is reading this and preparing to make an angry instagram post.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Nothing similar between Smith and Waiters in game.

Well, Waiters could have been a lot like Smith. He just wasn't interested in doing the things Smith does so willingly.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

You guys are too busy looking at shooting percentages to see that Dion is growing over at OKC....

In what respect? In more minutes his assists have dropped from 2.2/g to 1.4/g, while his rebounds have increased from 1.7 to 2.4. Sort of a wash, but both so low as to be below average for his position, and both numbers are worse than his first two seasons in Cleveland. His steals/g have also dropped slightly despite playing more minutes. Most of his other numbers -- including shooting - are pretty much the same, though his FT% has decreased about 8 points.

But in terms of overall contributions, I guess I just don't see the evidence of how he is "growing". Are there particular advanced stats that support the idea?

 

[Marcus]

Dion Waiters now is hardly a better player than he was when he first came into the league. He makes many of the same mistakes, still has an attitude problem, and is still streaky as hell.

To say otherwise is laughable and completely, blissfully ignorant. Dion hasn't grown at all this season. He's regressed.

And the comparison to JR Smith makes me laugh. JR does things that Waiters didn't want to do here. He plays solid defense every night and he is a willing and capable spot up shooter. It's been an absolute shock to me personally just how perfectly he has fit into this system. I dare say that if Dion had played and done the things that JR is doing now in Cleveland, they would not have started out 19-20.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

And the comparison to JR Smith makes me laugh. JR does things that Waiters didn't want to do here. He plays solid defense every night and he is a willing and capable spot up shooter. It's been an absolute shock to me personally just how perfectly he has fit into this system. I dare say that if Dion had played and done the things that JR is doing now in Cleveland, they would not have started out 19-20.

In terms of their raw abilities rather than actual performance, Smith just looks like he's longer and covers more ground than does Dion. Dion was built very strongly, but I don't know if it was his lateral movement/quickness or what, but he just didn't seem to take up that much space on the floor. He always appears undersized to me even if he wasn't.

 

[Tornicade]

LOL people have a short memory.

After game four, Karl informed reporters of his plan to bench Smith for all of game 5. Karl said, "He's done," and explained his frustrations over Smith's poor judgment in shooting a three late in the game, "I have no idea what planet that came from." Karl told the Associated Press that he had drawn up the play to give the ball to either Allen Iverson or Carmelo Anthony. Karl continugh ed, "And then, of course the one with eight seconds to go, from 50 feet, I just love the dignity of the game being insulted right in front of me."[8]

ll what "You were wrong about TT when you placed his jump shooting abilities to Dirk and LA rofl! And you were certainly wrong about Drummond. He would clearly be the #2 player pick from his draft after a redo and I had said at that time that he was the only player in the draft that had the tools to be better than AD. Fuck Dion's first step. Jamal Crawford has a better one."

now your reaching. The Dirk and Aldridge comparisons were to Illustrate a point about how often guys took shots from different ranges and TT has significantly improved his overall shooting. I understand reading comprehension may not be a strong suit of some but the majority of people posting seemed to understand what was actually being said at the time
Drummond is still what i said he was.

Right now Im enjoying watching the Cavs finally getting things together and im enjoying watching Dion play ball in OKC.

 

[JSS2306]

Right now Im enjoying watching the Cavs finally getting things together and im enjoying watching Dion play ball in OKC.

You enjoy watching Dion shoot 5-18 like his last game against the Pacers?

That's like saying you enjoy watching late night infomercials. Dion does a great job of selling himself, until he actually plays.

Wasn't the Karl/Smith beef in 07? What does that have to do with 29 year old Smith? Dion has an opportunity to get better, but I wouldn't enjoy watching him for 5-7 years before he realizes what an idiot perspective he takes toward the game of basketball.

 

[Frank Reynolds]

I do watch late night infomercials....so......