Kyrie Irving

[All4One1ForAll]

His first was the best. His 2nd year was good too before All-Star Weekend. Then he stopped caring.

True, I do remember that. I just feel like Kyrie really came onto the national stage in his second year with a lot of "Mr. Fourth Quarter" moments like the game against OKC, his first All Star Game, his three point contest win, and him being 8th in the league in scoring average. Plus, he was horrifically bad on defense his rookie year and he improved that slightly to just terrible his second year. But yeah, I can definitely see why his first year would be considered the best.

 

[cavsfever]

But what does his improvement path so far say about what he will look like at 25 to 27 years old? (Usually the peak for NBA players.) For some guys you can tell they can improve radically, because their skills have not caught up with their athleticism, or their athleticism will increase with physical development. But Kyrie is a skill-based player whose skills have always been very polished. How much room does he have for improvement?

I would say that passing/'floor generalship' is his major area for improvement. Hard to see him getting that much better at shooting, finishing, penetrating, or dribbling.

 

[metalman213]

I think his second was probably a little better than his first. His third year was his worst year. And this year is his best by a slight margin.

He just came into the league so good and already so polished.

I would say it may be slightly his best offensively. But defensively he's much improved over previous years. Overall he has improved quite a bit imo.

 

[amil99]

Kyrie most definitely has room to improve. He's already a 22/6 47/40/87 player. Now just imagine him becoming a true floor general, consistent good defender while slightly increasing his volume. Your talking about a potential 26/7 on 45+/40/90 type of player WHILE being a big time clutch player and plus defender. That would easily be a top 5 player in the league and most certainly the best point guard in the NBA. Just because he's a polished scorer from the jump doesnt mean has no room for improvement intangibles wise. Answer this question...if there was no Lebron and we still had a player in the caliber of Love, do people have any doubt that Kyrie could average 27 this year? He's averaging 22+ while playing with a ball dominant 27 ppg scorer in LBJ so I have no doubt Irving with 20 fga per game could average 28 the way he has been scoring this year

 

[6kiss]

I'm not going to wage into the Kyrie vs. Steph debate, but man if this isn't the same line I kept hearing when people would argue Carmelo was the best "pure scorer" in the league. Despite the fact that every meaningful stat showed LeBron was better at scoring the basketball, Carmelo still got the nod from so many analysts because he could "score in more ways." As if that mattered.

It was this same sentiment. Stats be damned, Carmelo is the better scorer!

Before Melo got fat, he was a better pure scorer. He could score in every way but Lebron was a more efficient scorer bc of his size and speed.

 

[KI4MVP]

Kyrie vs Curry (Jan 15 through today, 26 games for both players)

24.0 points on .460/.436/.890 splits, +/- of 9.6, ORtg 112.5
23.8 points on .484/.459/.902 splits, +/- of 10.9, ORtg 115.3

Both are outstanding, shooting edge over the past two months goes to the 2nd player.

That 2nd player is Kyrie.

 

[KI4MVP]

Is it crazy to possibly put Kyrie in the MVP discussion?

Or, wait a couple of years to put him in that discussion?

He's not a candidate to win it this year, but I'd expect him to finish in the top 10.

 

[randymoss1881]

Kyrie isn't better than paul, westbrook, and curry period. That's not an insult to him. Also cp3 as much as I dispose him has been on a tear since Blake got hurt.

 

[Ohio]

Kyrie isn't better than paul, westbrook, and curry period. That's not an insult to him. Also cp3 as much as I dispose him has been on a tear since Blake got hurt.

You dispose CP3? Damn that's crazy

 

[Jscc]

Kyrie's improvement will come in two areas. Developing the genuine psychology of a winner and improving his athleticism/developing his body. With LeBron here, all of that will come. In fact it has already started because Kyrie's experiencing winning in the NBA firsthand.

Give him one good offseason. I fully expect him to be Russell Westbrook/Stephen Curry level or better in 1-3 years.

 

[Spencer Hawes]

You realize Curry has a better percentage at the rim than Kyrie, right?

And pretty much every NBA analyst puts Curry's handles T-1 with Kyrie's soooo.

No reason to be a homer. Curry has carried a meh team to the playoffs. Kyrie had his worst season last year trying to carry a team to the playoffs. Curry at this point is a better player.

Hands down, Kyrie has the better handles. Steph's handles are pretty nice but Kyrie can do things with the ball in game that I have not seen Steph do. That's not taking anything away from Steph, it just shows how impressive Kyrie is. He looks smooth, natural and is extremely shifty...like he's not even trying, just reacting. Steph isn't on that level imo but that doesn't take away from his pg skills. I mean, Kyrie has better handles than Magic. Is that a knock on Magic? Magic doesn't need great handles when he can see over other PG and use his body and ass to protect the ball.

When you say "pretty much every NBA analyst", I call bullshit. Matter of fact, I hear analyst raving about Kyrie's handles more so than Steph's.

Saying that Steph is a better finisher at the rim because he has the better percentage is very misleading. That's like saying Andre Drummond and DeAndre Jordan are great post players because they have a higher FG% over Zach Randolph. Steph finishes well when he has the opportunity but Kyrie has the ability to create more variety of shots at the rim. He can sense what the defender is doing (or trying to anticipate) and do something else. Those that play a lot of basketball know what I'm talking about. But Kyrie does it at NBA level game speed and it's incredible to watch. The layup against John Wall is a prime example. That was a thing of beauty. Also, his ability to spin the ball off the backboard is uncanny. I don't know if there are anyone better in the NBA. The game winner in Denver is a prime example. Watch how he spins the ball.

 

[Baseline Runner]

He is so good at finishing off drives (one of the best I've ever seen) that he sometimes has tunnel vision. If he can work on dishing the ball more when defensive collapses on him in the paint he will be a much better play maker and an even more efficient scorer than he already is. We all know he can make some very difficult layups over 2 or 3 guys. But in general he needs to try to set up other players when in that situation for easier shots because that means there are 1 or 2 players on the court open at that moment.

 

[All4One1ForAll]

This may sound crazy, but honestly I think part of the reason why Kyrie sometimes gets that "tunnel vision" when driving like @Baseline Runner mentioned is because of the players he had around him his rookie year and to a lesser extent, his second year. I mean in high school, he was known as an all-around player. The draft reports compared him to Chris Paul, arguably the best passer/runner of an offense in the game today. He averaged 6.5 assists per 36 minutes as a rookie with absolute garbage around him, which isn't bad at all for a 19/20 year old. In fact, rookie CP3 only averaged 1.3 more per 36. But Kyrie's assists have only gone down on a per minute basis since then and I honestly believe it's because he's so used to having to do it all from playing with garbage teammates. It's not like he doesn't have the ability to pass. He just needs to get accustomed to trusting his teammates and passing up a good shot for a better shot by making the right play.

 

[chrisrich91]

People mention Kyrie's age and room for development in comparison to a guy like Curry. It's absolutely true and very exciting stuff.

But where I disagree is the notion that as he develops he'll "become more of a floor general" type point guard. I don't think this is the likely path that Kyrie's development follows. And that's not a knock on him in the slightest. He is a cold blooded scorer and an assassin. That's what makes him Kyrie Irving. To become a floor general would be a pretty significant transformation from that, and I don't think it's a necessary transformation.

I think Kyrie will continue to develop as a scorer and defender as he continues his growth. And along the way he will continue to learn ways to get his teammates easy buckets as a result of his own offensive game and scoring opportunities. The assists can go up, but not because he transitions into a floor general role a la CP3.

My two cents

 

[amil99]

People mention Kyrie's age and room for development in comparison to a guy like Curry. It's absolutely true and very exciting stuff.

But where I disagree is the notion that as he develops he'll "become more of a floor general" type point guard. I don't think this is the likely path that Kyrie's development follows. And that's not a knock on him in the slightest. He is a cold blooded scorer and an assassin. That's what makes him Kyrie Irving. To become a floor general would be a pretty significant transformation from that, and I don't think it's a necessary transformation.

I think Kyrie will continue to develop as a scorer and defender as he continues his growth. And along the way he will continue to learn ways to get his teammates easy buckets as a result of his own offensive game and scoring opportunities. The assists can go up, but not because he transitions into a floor general role a la CP3.

My two cents

A floor general doesn't necessarily mean racking up assist. He can become a better floor general by being more of a leader, coach on the floor and becoming a better pace setter(ala what Conley does for the Grizz).