Making a murderer (spoilers)

[czvo]

I'm not really a reddit reader, but the reddit on Making a Murder has TONS of information:

https://m.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer

 

[David.]

I'm not really a reddit reader, but the reddit on Making a Murder has TONS of information:

https://m.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer

Lots of info, but watch your step and wear some boots Bc it's a gigantic circle jerk..

There's no way he did it, over there. And to raise any questions that don't go along with their mob mentality will result in a bombardment of insults.

 

[czvo]

Lots of info, but watch your step and wear some boots Bc it's a gigantic circle jerk..

There's no way he did it, over there. And to raise any questions that don't go along with their mob mentality will result in a bombardment of insults.

From what I've seen over there, it seems most posters just want people to avoid hard "YES HE DID IT" and "NO HE DIDN'T" statements. Sure you have those people that post things like, "there's no way he did it because of x, y, and z," you just have to ignore.

The useful part is the information posted from the trial, other news outlets, etc.


(Long story short, I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you.)

 

[kosis]

Was I the only one that thought the victim's ex boyfriend seemed guilty as hell?

Also, the key was surely a plant by Lenk. He shouldn't have been in there in the first place, but then only finds a key by a cabinet after the 4th (IIRC) trip through the trailer. None of her DNA, mind you, is on the key somehow. That whole department absolutely stinks and I have such little doubt that he was framed. The chances of him doing this right after announcing his lawsuit and finally being free (with no offenses like this in the past) seems unfathomable to me. There was absolutely reasonable doubt here. Can't imagine how you return a guilty verdict for Steven and especially for Brendan. So disappointing.

 

[Phills14]

Yea I had/have my suspicions with the ex boyfriend and the male roommate.

 

[MD13]

It's a completely split-personality crime. There's no way a guy can be meticulous enough to clean away every bit of DNA evidence in the garage and his room, then leave most of the bones in his pit while scattering only a few of them.

Whether he did it or not, the prosecution's case doesn't make any sense given the evidence and I don't think it was beyond reasonable doubt.

 

[spydy13]

I know that the doc is very much on Avery's side, but did they show anything about him leaving a voice mail? Or is that why they spent so much time on the stuff about who had access to her voice mail box and if messages were deleted?

I guess what I'm asking is did Teresa's brother or roommate testify that they heard a message from Avery about why she never came by but there is no actual record of that message left?

Edit: Along the same lines, I guess this is why I was confused that the prosecution made such a big deal about the magazine and bill of sale being in the trailer when it sounds all along like his story is that she came by and left.

 

[KI4MVP]

This is the transcript of the voice mail she left for Steven that day

"Hello. This is Teresa with AutoTrader Magazine. I'm the photographer, and just giving you a call to let you know that I could come out there today, urn, in the afternoon. It would will probably be around two o'clock or even a little later. But, urn, if you could please give me a call back and let me know if that will work for you, because I don't have your address or anything, so I can't stop by without getting the -- a call back from you. And my cell phone is 737-4731. Again, it's Teresa, 920-737-4731. Thank you."​

Reading some more on this case, I see the appointment was under his sister's name because it was her van being sold, so that's why she didn't have the address.

Also, where is the reference to his leaving her a message at 4:35? I found where he made a 13 second call, but can't find anything about a message.

 

[Brandname]

This is the transcript of the voice mail she left for Steven that day

"Hello. This is Teresa with AutoTrader Magazine. I'm the photographer, and just giving you a call to let you know that I could come out there today, urn, in the afternoon. It would will probably be around two o'clock or even a little later. But, urn, if you could please give me a call back and let me know if that will work for you, because I don't have your address or anything, so I can't stop by without getting the -- a call back from you. And my cell phone is 737-4731. Again, it's Teresa, 920-737-4731. Thank you."​

Where did the part about she had been there before, that he met her only wearing a towel, and was scared to go back come from?

Also, where is the reference to his leaving her a message at 4:35?

Interesting. I had not seen this transcript before. Thanks.

 

[KI4MVP]

someone collected and organized a bunch of the stuff here

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ehw9macgELE79GAMzRqb9We5uv-YhYHoMxeowYIrX1E/pub

 

[czvo]

You know, everyone points to the towel thing as some kind of evidence that the guy is a perverted creeper hellbent on sexually abusing Halbach, but why? The only evidence we have of that encounter is the conversation she had with the receptionist, in which she told her the incident, laughed about it, and said "eww." She willingly went back the Avery salvage yard. If she felt that uncomfortable, could she not have asked her boss to send someone else? (This is not to put the onus or blame on the victim, but if the prosecution's argument that Halbach was uncomfortable around Avery is true, I find it hard to believe she wouldn't try and get out of an appointment.) It's also been pointed out by the defense that Avery showed up in a towel because he was coming from his splash pool. Not that he had gotten out of the shower, or was even nude under the towel.

They talk about Avery calling and specifically asking for Halbach, and the prosecution uses this as evidence that he wanted to do "something" to her. Could it be that a man who was wrongfully accused of a serious crime, and spent 18 years in jail for it, was a deeply suspicious person? We know that Halbach had photographed the yard before. Maybe there was a sense of trust on Avery's side because she didn't do anything to screw him over in the past?

The *67 thing... I don't know. I can see how its viewed as suspicious. But I can also see how Avery is just an odd guy. It doesn't necessarily strike me as sinister. I would like to have a more detailed timeline of the phone calls/messages and the bus driver spotting her. Those two things being side by side would help.


Something else that needed to be looked into, and never was, were all the "threatening" phone calls Halbach was receiving in the weeks leading up to her murder. There is evidence that someone was harassing her, with one of those calls happening in front of her boss. I believe it was determined that it was not Avery. So someone is making suspicious and threatening calls to this woman for some time before her disappearance, but it all gets dropped? Why?


I will say that Avery, even if he didn't do it, is no saint. The guy has a history of beating both Jodi and Lori, at least from reports filed with the police. I don't know that he was charged. As for the cat thing... who hasn't wanted to burn a cat alive. Cats suck... (but in all seriousness, that's fucked up. Don't burn people or animals alive.)


I think it's unusual that the police didn't look more into Bobby Dassey and Scott Tadych. The defense tried to float the theory that those two were involved, but the judge ruled they couldn't. Tadych was trying to sell a .22 rifle (the same gun used to shoot Halbach) in the period after her disappearance and before Avery was arrested. Dassey was physically examined the week of her disappearance and found to have fresh scratches on his back. The only alibi for Dassey? Tadych. The only alibi for Tadych? Dassey. And even those stories couldn't be kept straight.

 

[KI4MVP]

Yea I had/have my suspicions with the ex boyfriend and the male roommate.

the ex boyfriend had a scratches on his hands

 

[Jack Brickman]

Even if Avery did do it, the fact that the police seemed wholly uninterested in investigating anyone else seemed really suspicious. The ex-boyfriend and roommate were obviously suspects, but the police never treated them as such or even seemed to look into them, to the point where they actually let both of them help them search for her car. That's fucked up.

 

[MD13]

I still don't get the bones in the burn pit. First of all, the defense got an expert to testify that those bones couldn't achieve that condition with an open flame like in the bonfire described. Then who only takes a small fraction of the bones and dumps it in two different locations while keeping the majority right in front of your own home?

No matter how stupid you are, if you realize that you should hide the evidence, you wouldn't just hide a tiny portion of it, right?

 

[KI4MVP]

apparently these shots are from footage the day before the car was found with the location of the car highlighted.

The car was found here the next morning

Avery was out of town.