• Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.

Should Vaccination be Mandatory

Do Not Sell My Personal Information
But Ohdang's argument loses scientific merit when he talks mandating vaccinations, about taking pleasure in "trampling on their rights," about rounding people up, about not being able to get an FHA loan, not being able to go to the mall, that a person is an infection risk to himself, or the grave risks of not getting a chickenpox vaccine that wasn't widely used until the mid-90s.

This is what I'm talking about with your debating style. You just blatantly misrepresented what I said in order to fit an argument you wanted to have. I never said anything about taking pleasure in trampling people rights. I said in the case of an unprecedented epidemic, I would support quarantining those refusing vaccinations to protect the rest of the population.

I also said that I misunderstood what you meant by FHA and I didn't actually disagree with you. You either missed that, or more likely, disregarded it because you wanted something else to use to try and win the argument.

These points are frankly ridiculous and certainly irrational and unscientific. I think a reasonable objective individual would agree these positions go too far.

You're right, they are irrational and unscientific. Which is why I didn't say them in the first place, you decided to twist what I actually said into that to try and make your argument look stronger because it can't stand on its own.
 
Last edited:
Did you even pay attention to the context into which he specifically placed that remark?

He expressly referred to how he would feel in a future situation if we were faced with a disease "so bad that it makes cholera and bubonic plague look like amateur hour", and there were still people advocating against vaccinations.

No remotely fair minded person could possibly take that comment as advocating that people be rounded up now for vaccination. He was expressly referring to an absolute worst case scenario in the future.

No, he didn't. Which is why I'm ignoring him. He's either intentionally manipulating what I'm saying or he's really, really stupid. Either way, not worth the reply.
 
http://www.globalresearch.ca/mandat...n-increases-disease-rates-study-shows/5424265

Mandatory Chickenpox Vaccination Increases Disease Rates, Study Shows

Once again, the completely illogical debacle concerning the world of vaccinations has surfaced.
By now, you know they’ve come under fire by those who are adamant that they do more harm than good. Countless people have developed irreversible health problems and even died shortly after receiving a vaccination, which the medical community chalks up to “coincidence” or cleverly crafted wording that a patient should have known about.
Take, for example, the young Florida girl who made headlines last year when she received the flu vaccine. Marysue Grivna, now 10 years old, experienced paralysis and vision loss within a few short days of receiving the shot. She was ultimately diagnosed with a debilitating brain disease called acute disseminated encephalomyelitis (ADEM). Today, she’s confined to a wheelchair or bed and is almost entirely nonverbal.(1)
There’s also the disturbing discovery of elderly people who lived at a senior care facility in Georgia. After all received the flu shot in 2014, five of them died the next week.(2)
Time and again, stories like this abound. Most recently, however, additional news comes from South Korea, where researchers have demonstrated what people have known in their heart to be true all along: that vaccinations not only are unhealthy but also aren’t effective.(3)
Surprise, surprise.
Reported cases of chickenpox have more than tripled since vaccinations became mandatory in South Korea

What spurred the researchers to engage in their studies in the first place was the fact that, despite the amount of people receiving chickenpox vaccinations, the rate of the illness in the nation hasn’t diminished. Instead, it’s increased. The question then becomes a matter of why something designed to keep an illness at bay is actually boosting its activity, creating the opposite of the desired (and often applauded) effect.
For example, the researchers note that, in 2005, varicella (chickenpox) vaccination was mandated in South Korea for infants between the ages of 12 and 15 months. Although there was 97 percent uptake by 2011, no decreases in the illness were found nationwide. The Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (KCDC) has reported an increase of varicella patients; in 2006, there were 22.6 cases per 100,000, while in 2011, that number more than tripled to 71.6 cases per 100,000.(3)
To better understand why the vaccine was failing, the research team conducted a case-based study, a case-control study and an immunogenicity and safety study. The latter study involved a total of 126 healthy children who were vaccinated with a single dose of Suduvax, which researchers discovered “may not be immunogenic enough to be effective in preventing varicella in South Korea.”(4)
Chickenpox vaccination “has not been effective,” say researchers

The study, titled “Varicella and Varicella Vaccination in South Korea,” was published in the journal Clinical and Vaccine Immunology. The study acknowledges that the increase in varicella vaccinations is likely due to the fact that getting them is mandatory; however, the article addresses serious flaws in that cases have surged, not declined in spite of that. The study notes:
Although the increase in reported cases of varicella to KCDC may be due to the fact that mandatory varicella notification began in 2005, no decrease in the number of varicella patients does not harmonize with the fact that the varicella vaccine coverage increased to above 97% in 2011. Although it can be asserted that the annual number of cases of varicella might have been higher with greater morbidity in the prevaccine era, the high vaccine uptake, the lack of upward age shift in the peak incidence, and the high proportion of breakthrough disease, with almost no amelioration in disease presentation among vaccinated patients, strongly suggest that varicella vaccination has not been effective in preventing varicella in South Korea and is in great need of improvement.(4)
Once again, their findings reinforce that vaccinations have done more in the way of sparking great debate, illness and death than they are actually controlling, or altogether ridding, certain diseases from the population.
 
http://www.globalresearch.ca/mcdona...lf-of-the-department-of-public-health/5431115

McDonald's Gives Free Vaccines with Happy Meals in Texas on Behalf of the Department of Public Health


Natural Society
Region: USA
Theme: Science and Medicine
14 6 0 47
mcdo-vaccine
Would you like a side of hepatitis A shot with your Happy Meal? As it turns out, your child may just be able to receive a number of significant vaccinations at your local McDonald’s on behalf of the Department of Public Health.
I was just as shocked as you are when I heard news from an email tip that one reader’s local McDonald’s was launching a ‘free vaccination’ program alongside their fast food marketing campaign, and I was reasonably skeptical that even McDonald’s would launch such a strange combination. Especially when we consider the extreme financial downfall that the company is experiencing as millions abandon their fake food amid public knowledge over the true extent of their synthetic ingredient list.
As it turns out, however, numerous Texas newspapers and outlets have documented the ‘free McDonald’s vaccine’ events that have popped up in Amarillo. It was, and is, very real. Amarillo.com details the event that first occurred years ago, writing:
“The city of Amarillo’s Department of Public Health and the Caring for Children Foundation of Texas will offer free vaccinations for children from 9 a.m. to 2 p.m. Saturday at McDonald’s restaurant, 1815 S. Grand St.

The vaccinations will include meningococcal vaccine, which is required for seventh- and eighth-graders and for college students residing in campus housing; the varicella vaccine, which is required for kindergarten and first grade and for seventh- and eighth-graders; the Tdap vaccine booster required for seventh- and eighth-graders; MMR vaccine for kindergarten and first grade; and hepatitis A, required for kindergarten and first grade.

Parents and guardians are asked to bring immunization records, and children under 17 must be accompanied by a parent or guardian.”

And that is one of the older reports detailing the events. There is not much press coverage on the programs that are reportedly being rolled out in 2015. Various sites have already been reporting on the new McDonald’s vaccine campaigns that readers say are popping up around the Amarillo area.
Would you get your child a round of booster shots with your next Happy Meal?
 
This is what I'm talking about with your debating style.

Wait, what are you saying about my debating style? When did that come up?

You just blatantly misrepresented what I said in order to fit an argument you wanted to have. I never said anything about taking pleasure in trampling people rights. I said in the case of an unprecedented epidemic, I would support quarantining those refusing vaccinations to protect the rest of the population.

You said you personally would "go round people up" and "could care less about how bad (you) were trampling on their rights."

I'm not misrepresenting what you said, I'm quoting you. I'm telling you how that reads to me.

I also said that I misunderstood what you meant by FHA and I didn't actually disagree with you. You either missed that, or more likely, disregarded it because you wanted something else to use to try and win the argument.

I missed it, and I'm not trying to win an argument with you. I'm just trying to refocus the discussion on individual liberties.

You're right, they are irrational and unscientific. Which is why I didn't say them in the first place, you decided to twist what I actually said into that to try and make your argument look stronger because it can't stand on its own.

Ohdang, what is my argument? Because if you actually know what it is, and you don't think it's valid, then I'd be very interested to hear why.
 
This is what you said that I specifically responded to:
And I responded directly to that statement with herd immunity being the reason why your statement was false.

This was addressed in post #228. I've pointed this out to you 2 or 3 times already.

It has everything to do with your statement, because it is critically important to our society not being susceptible to outbreaks of deadly diseases like smallpox, polio, diphtheria, malaria, measles, pertussis, typhoid, I could go on and on. We don't even need vaccinations for some of these anymore because previous generations did such a good job with vaccinating that they were eradicated from this part of the world. Unfortunately we're starting to see herd immunity fail with pertussis and measles as a result of a significant number people deciding to forgo vaccines for them.

Which is not a point of disagreement.

Just because you can't understand why it directly relates to your statement doesn't mean its irrelevant to your statement. I'm trying to help you understand but you're pulling your typical bullshit that you do when you can't figure out how to win an argument. But I'm not trying to win an argument with you, I want you to understand why you're wrong so you can learn because its better for everyone if this is a universally understood and accepted concept. Stop trying to win and actually listen to what I'm saying, this is important.

Ohdang, not only have I listened to you. Based on your argument I went out and did some research of my own to see if what you were saying has merit. I don't see how anything you've said would change or even address my point.

What am I missing?

No, it isn't anything like that at all. Stop twisting what I'm saying because you're trying to win a debate. I'm not even arguing whether they should be mandatory at this point,

Exactly.

I'm only trying to explain why they're a good idea and why they're effective, and how the current public opinion toward them is threatening the herd immunity we've built up over several generations.

Ohdang, you realize I don't disagree with you on this, right?

The only argument you could have with my position would be based on wanting mandatory vaccinations; because my only point is that we should not go down that road.

I am not arguing about the efficacy of vaccinations themselves. I've said this numerous times now.
 
I am not arguing about the efficacy of vaccinations themselves. I've said this numerous times now.

I, however, am arguing this. And I've supported my stance with a few articles as well as documentation from the manufacturer of a flu vaccine that stated their vaccine was NOT successful in preventing influenza - not to mention the potentially dangerous side effects of said vaccine.

In addition, Ohdang himself has stated several times that the flu vaccine was unsuccessful this year, which would support my arguement.

Here is the FDA info on another commonly used flu vaccine for 2014-2015:

Package Insert - AFLURIA - Food and Drug Administration - http://www.fda.gov/downloads/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/UCM263239.pdf
 
Last edited:
Flu vaccine has seemed like bullshit to me from the beginning.


@Ohdang, thoughts?
 
I just find people with the flu, and drink their mucous. That's how you vaccinate.
 
The science is not perfect. As Laura Blue noted in a piece exploring the autism-pollution link for Time magazine, the studies do not imply causation, which “ultimately raise as many questions as they answer,” she writes. “It’s not clear how or why the chemicals we breathe may affect development and autism risk, for example, although the researchers suggest that pollutants may impact both neurological development and inflammation, which can damage the lining of blood vessels in the brain and compromise the blood-brain barrier.”

Still, the body of research linking autism risk to air pollution is astoundingly more robust than the literal non-body of research linking it to vaccines. And PM2.5 — the tiny particles found in smoke and haze and emitted from power plants, cars, and other industries — is already known to be harmful in many other ways. Because the particles are so small, the EPA says they can penetrate the deepest parts of the lungs, triggering respiratory and cardiopulmonary problems. PM2.5 also contributes to visible pollution haze and acid rain.

So if you really want to fight something that might increase children’s risk of autism, fight for tighter regulation on power plant emissions. Rally for ozone and smog reductions, buy an electric car, advocate for renewable energy and clean infrastructure. Become an environmentalist.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/20...Feed:+climateprogress/lCrX+(Climate+Progress)
 
^Obvious pro vaccine propaganda based on the last line of the article. But you'll have that.
 
I just find people with the flu, and drink their mucous. That's how you vaccinate.

Just steer clear of @QuadrupleDouble . You never know where his mucus is going to cum from.

Cervical_mucus1%5B1%5D.jpg
 
http://www.naturalnews.com/048599_measles_MMR_vaccine_mainstream_media.html

Measles fear mongering by mainstream media reaches absured level

NaturalNews) The corporate media machine is really showing its true (malevolent) colors with this latest measles outbreak delirium, openly announcing to the world that it hates personal freedom and individual choice, and would like for nothing more than federal and state governments to start rounding up and punishing those who choose not to vaccinate as if they're terrorists.

Headlines and op-ed rants are replete with calls for "anti-vaxxers" to be prosecuted, thrown in prison, have their children taken away, and other such draconian tripe meant to rile up anger and hatred towards dissenters of the official vaccine narrative. The following quotes pulled from mainstream sources (which we won't identify here; you can search for them yourself if you wish) represent just a few chilling examples of this:

"Vaccines only work as protection if almost everyone uses them," claims one openly pro-vaccine news rag.

"Certainly we need the government to take this matter up," suggests another, calling for more centralized control over people's personal medical choices.

"Parents who do not vaccinate their children should go to jail," reads another deranged op-ed rant from a major news source.

"Vaccines should be restored to their status as mandatory," suggests another.

And on and on goes the propaganda blitz with one unequivocal goal in mind: to demonize anyone who thinks for himself and conducts independent research on vaccines apart from the system. Such individuals are increasingly being portrayed with disdain by the media overlords, who continue to spread lies about vaccines providing unmatched protection with minimal risk.

No other viewpoints on vaccines, even from doctors, are recognized as valid

Missing from the national conversation on vaccines, which is escalating due to media-driven hysteria over measles, are any viewpoints that deviate from the official story. Reporters, columnists, doctors, scientists and others who agree with the myth that vaccines are safe and effective are the only ones being given a voice.

Brave dissenters like cardiologist Dr. Jack Wolfson, an outspoken vaccine skeptic, is right now experiencing the fury of the media for his unpopular, but accurate, viewpoints on vaccines. Dr. Wolfson recognizes that injecting chemicals into children's bodies isn't helping them avoid disease, but rather making them more susceptible to it.

Chastising all the "sheeple" out there who are blindly accepting what the media is serving them concerning the measles outbreak -- it's all the unvaccinated people's fault! -- Dr. Wolfson says a lack of critical thinking and honest inquiry into the history of vaccines, including what ingredients they contain, are what's truly responsible for causing disease outbreaks.

"Be angry with yourself for not opening your eyes to the snow job and brainwashing which have taken over your mind," he wrote in a rebuttal to hate mail he received following a recent interview with NBC Phoenix, which intentionally skewed his pre-recorded statements to portray him as callous and unconcerned about public health, which couldn't be further from the truth.

"You NEVER asked the doctor any questions. You NEVER asked what is in the vaccines. You NEVER learned about these benign infections," he added, outlining many of the things accepted in our society as normal that are legitimate public health threats: the processed food industry, fast food restaurants, drug companies and closed-minded doctors are listed among these.

The truth of the matter is that childhood measles isn't much of a threat, especially when a child is given proper nutrition. Mild measles infection, like childhood chickenpox, is essential for establishing lifelong immunity to the disease, something that the measles vaccines not only can't accomplish but prevents from ever occurring.
 

Rubber Rim Job Podcast Video

Episode 3-13: "Backup Bash Brothers"

Rubber Rim Job Podcast Spotify

Episode 3:11: "Clipping Bucks."
Top