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Tankapalooza - let us never speak of this again.

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How many wins will the Cavs have at the end of the season?

  • 27 or less wins

    Votes: 18 43.9%
  • 28 wins

    Votes: 8 19.5%
  • 29 wins

    Votes: 6 14.6%
  • 30 wins

    Votes: 6 14.6%
  • 31 wins

    Votes: 2 4.9%
  • 32 or more wins

    Votes: 1 2.4%

  • Total voters
    41
  • Poll closed .
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Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

This is really, truly tank-threatening...not only did we instantly get a lot better with the trade, our schedule gets a lot easier than it has been.

I just did some really high level, important type mathematical analysis. If every other team goes at their current winning pace in the East, the Cavs will make the playoffs if they win 70% of their remaining games. I think that's before tonight's win, too.

What seed? 8?
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Me tank not impressed!
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Tank+Carder+Browns.jpg


Before Tank was Brown, he was Horned Frog!
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Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Yep, just enough to squeek into the playoffs.

Current pace would put Boston (current 8th seed) at 37.2 wins, .700 pace for Cavs would be 37.5 wins.

Of course usually the record is indicated in whole games, so that's give-or-take a few % points either way, but you get the drift.

In February we play Detroit, Orlando 2x, Charlotte, and New Orleans...also Denver, Minny, Chicago, San Antonio, OKC, and Miami. So about half and half in terms of "teams we could beat" and "teams we shouldn't beat". 8/12 at home though.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Oh man, I feel like we're back post Clippers victory or post Lakers victory.

This team is not going to win 70% of our remaining games. We will still end up in the high lottery. We will still play poorly and lose games. Relax
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!


Seriously though, it's nice to see our young core kick ass and take names, but what really irks me is when we would've lost the game if it weren't for some short-term players like Speights and Ellington. Their absence would've likely allowed for Kyrie, Dion, and whoever else to go off and still allow for us to lose. This reminds me of last season when Jamison, Sessions, and what's his face who signed with Memphis (forget his name) where they won us some games, then left. Baron Davis goes on that list as well. If we were to win these games SOLELY on the merits of our core, then I'd be a little more OK with it (although I'd still be pissed about the tank), but when short-term guys like Speights and Ellington are dropping 17 and 12 points on hot shooting and in little minutes while playing good defense, only to leave after this season or next season or get traded, thus causing us to win games, that does upset me. I really do hope that they get traded for picks because I really do believe that a higher pick will serve us better than winning a few extra games this season.

Get fucking CJ back out there in all honesty. I can handle the rest of the season in terms of losing. I'm a very patient man. What I can't handle is missing out on a game-changer in the draft because of too many feel-good wins in a meaningless season that served no purpose other than development and getting a high pick. I don't want to become the Atlanta Hawks where we're good, but never great let alone the best. We can still see development without winning a ton of games.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

There are, quite literally, 0 game-changers in this draft, except maybe Shabazz, and we're 100% not getting the #1 pick, so, yeah...
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

There are, quite literally, 0 game-changers in this draft, except maybe Shabazz, and we're 100% not getting the #1 pick, so, yeah...

None of us know that quite yet. No one on this board thought that Kyrie would be this good before we drafted him. We merely thought his ceiling was all-star level, and some were even doubting that. He was just underhyped. The same could happen this year. Also, since we literally, mathematically have a chance of getting the number 1 pick unless we make the payoffs, it's immediately a faulty statement to say that we "100%" won't be getting the number one pick.

Gotta stay positive for the tank. :thumbup:
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Seriously though, it's nice to see our young core kick ass and take names, but what really irks me is when we would've lost the game if it weren't for some short-term players like Speights and Ellington. Their absence would've likely allowed for Kyrie, Dion, and whoever else to go off and still allow for us to lose. This reminds me of last season when Jamison, Sessions, and what's his face who signed with Memphis (forget his name) where they won us some games, then left. Baron Davis goes on that list as well. If we were to win these games SOLELY on the merits of our core, then I'd be a little more OK with it (although I'd still be pissed about the tank), but when short-term guys like Speights and Ellington are dropping 17 and 12 points on hot shooting and in little minutes while playing good defense, only to leave after this season or next season or get traded, thus causing us to win games, that does upset me. I really do hope that they get traded for picks because I really do believe that a higher pick will serve us better than winning a few extra games this season.

Get fucking CJ back out there in all honesty. I can handle the rest of the season in terms of losing. I'm a very patient man. What I can't handle is missing out on a game-changer in the draft because of too many feel-good wins in a meaningless season that served no purpose other than development and getting a high pick. I don't want to become the Atlanta Hawks where we're good, but never great let alone the best. We can still see development without winning a ton of games.

You people are totally missing it. We aren't going to be the Atlanta Hawks. You know why? Because we have something they never did. A superstar.

If our young guys improving ends up leading to wins, so be it. It's a lot better than our young guys sucking and continuing to lose. Because if thats the case, what good does another draft pick do? The rebuild would already be over because we would have blown it in the last two drafts.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

There are, quite literally, 0 game-changers in this draft, except maybe Shabazz, and we're 100% not getting the #1 pick, so, yeah...

I honestly can't believe i'm agreeing with corey but I'm willing to take these wins that help us develop. Kyrie isn't going to just randomly learn how to win these types of games, he needs to be in these types of situations every once and a while at least to learn how perform how he has performed so far. And along with that as we've seen in the past the highest odds in the lottery has by no means meant that we will get the first pick in the draft so why gun for the loses when we can improve as well still keep decent draft position because I believe that as long as we stay within the first couple of picks which I still believe can, we can still acquire a piece that can put us in just as good of position. Just my opinion flame me if you want.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Oh man, I feel like we're back post Clippers victory or post Lakers victory.

This team is not going to win 70% of our remaining games. We will still end up in the high lottery. We will still play poorly and lose games. Relax

I'd be incredibly surprised if we went .500 to finish the season. I like that we've been winning some games, especially in the manner we've been winning them, but our defense is still godawful, and that's definitely going to cost us quite a few games before this season is done. The reason we're on a three game losing streak is that we've played two pretenders and another bottom dweller, not because we've magically cracked the secret to being an elite team.

That said, it's great that we're now capable of beating teams that we should beat. We've got a star player on our roster. We should beat shitty teams like Toronto, Milwaukee, and Boston (now that Boston's two former stars are basically walking cadavers and Rondo is wildly overrated). Beating shitty teams is the first baby step toward becoming a playoff team. But it's not like we're magically going to become a playoff team this season. We're not winning 70% of our remaining games. That's a fucking pipe dream.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

None of us know that quite yet. No one on this board thought that Kyrie would be this good before we drafted him. We merely thought his ceiling was all-star level, and some were even doubting that. He was just underhyped. The same could happen this year. Also, since we literally, mathematically have a chance of getting the number 1 pick unless we make the payoffs, it's immediately a faulty statement to say that we "100%" won't be getting the number one pick.

Gotta stay positive for the tank. :thumbup:

we spent the entire season targeting Kyrie on this board
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

we spent the entire season targeting Kyrie on this board

Even so, I think it's safe to say that Kyrie Irving has literally surpassed the expectations anyone here had for him already. I was totally in favor of the Cavs taking Irving, but I had no idea that kid was going to be this fucking good this soon, and I know I'm not alone.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

I'd be incredibly surprised if we went .500 to finish the season. I like that we've been winning some games, especially in the manner we've been winning them, but our defense is still godawful, and that's definitely going to cost us quite a few games before this season is done. The reason we're on a three game losing streak is that we've played two pretenders and another bottom dweller, not because we've magically cracked the secret to being an elite team.

That said, it's great that we're now capable of beating teams that we should beat. We've got a star player on our roster. We should beat shitty teams like Toronto, Milwaukee, and Boston (now that Boston's two former stars are basically walking cadavers and Rondo is wildly overrated). Beating shitty teams is the first baby step toward becoming a playoff team. But it's not like we're magically going to become a playoff team this season. We're not winning 70% of our remaining games. That's a fucking pipe dream.

win tuesday and we will be .500 not just for January, but since Dec 22nd. As it is, we've gone 8-9 (47%) over a stretch where 65% of our games were on the road. The rest of the season 62% of our games are at home.

and we may not need to win 70% of our games to make the playoffs. The #9 seed, Philly, is on pace for 34 wins. The current number 8 seed is rumored to blow it up. If they do (and thus finish 14-25 or worse), we need to finish 21-16 to hit 34 wins, which is 58% of our remaining games.

If Boston doesn't blow it up and maintains their current pace, we'd have to win 68% of our games to tie them. Thus far we've split with both Boston and Philly with two games left against each. So it's still possible to get the tiebreaker advantage.

Certainly there is no margin for error left, but the door isn't completely shut on the playoffs just yet.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

we spent the entire season targeting Kyrie on this board

You people are totally missing it. We aren't going to be the Atlanta Hawks. You know why? Because we have something they never did. A superstar.

If our young guys improving ends up leading to wins, so be it. It's a lot better than our young guys sucking and continuing to lose. Because if thats the case, what good does another draft pick do? The rebuild would already be over because we would have blown it in the last two drafts.

There have been plenty of teams with a superstar that didn't win it all and were Atlanta Hawks-esque in how far they progressed in the playoffs. My point isn't to say that we don't have a superstar, but that we could end up being a team that never wins a championship because we don't have the overall talent to do it, and and that includes the fact that we already have a future MVP candidate.

And if the young guys keep on winning, then that's fine, but only if they get Speights and Ellington the fuck outta here. If Scott is throwing out the tank brigade in the 2nd unit like he's done before and genuinely making it hard for our core to win games, and our young core is still winning us games, then I guess there's not much you can do and just enjoy it, but when you're throwing out short-term players out there who are going to win us games only this season and no seasons past this one, then I see that as counterproductive.

Let me put it this way. Let's say in situation A, the Cavs never made the Memphis trade, and we end up with the worst record in the league and win the overall 1st pick because we have no bench and are usually in too much of a hole for our core to crawl out of for a win. In situation B, we do the Memphis trade (like we did), end up with the 3rd worst record and end up with the 3rd pick because we won some extra games because of Speights and Ellington. There's likely no way we could even trade our 3rd pick plus the Memphis pick in order to pick 1st in the 2013 draft because the value between the 3rd and 1st pick is often pretty large (as we've seen). Even if we could, that's a completely wasted asset (the Memphis pick) and a waste of a trade because we could've ended up with the 1st overall pick (or at least the 1st overall seed coming into the lottery) if we didn't make that trade. Now I know that there's a lottery, and I'm not saying that we will or would end up with the worst record, but I'm just making an example to show how, statistically speaking, if Speights and Ellington are truly going to win us more games than if we didn't have them, then these extra wins could offset the value of what we really wanted in the trade, the Memphis pick, because our own pick will be worse this year.

Feel free to have us getting the 4th pick in situation A and the 7th pick in situation B or whatever. My point still stands that we could miss out on our guy because of some short-term players winning us games, not to mention off-set the value of the Memphis trade. That's why I loved the Sessions trade--we got future picks, AND we lost more games because of his absence. It was a double whammy.

Long story short, get Speights and Ellington out of here, and, if we are still winning despite putting out a 2nd unit of Livingston, CJ, Boobie, Kevin Jones, etc., then so be it. I wouldn't like it, but I would know that it's solely because of our young core and not some rent-a-bench-players.

we spent the entire season targeting Kyrie on this board

Even so, that doesn't mean that anyone thought that Kyrie would be as good as he is or is going to be. It only means that we thought he was the best player in the draft.

I hope the rumors are true that other teams are interested in Speights.

Even so, I think it's safe to say that Kyrie Irving has literally surpassed the expectations anyone here had for him already. I was totally in favor of the Cavs taking Irving, but I had no idea that kid was going to be this fucking good this soon, and I know I'm not alone.

Exactly.
 
Re: Tankapalooza 2012-2013 Edition!

Even so, I think it's safe to say that Kyrie Irving has literally surpassed the expectations anyone here had for him already. I was totally in favor of the Cavs taking Irving, but I had no idea that kid was going to be this fucking good this soon, and I know I'm not alone.

sure, I can agree with that. It's just incredible that we got a guy this good so soon after losing LeBron. After tonight, Kyrie should have the 2nd best PER by a 20 year old in NBA history, 2nd only to LeBron.
 
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