Tristan Thompson

[Birdy89]

I am not sure if it is a byproduct of Mike Brown, but while TT's averages are OK it feels like he has no effect on the game anymore.

There was a time at the end of pre-season and the first few games it felt like he was making a noticeable impact out there, and of late it is like he is just in the background looking on.

What is the problem, and what can be done to get him more involved?

 

[Tornicade]

I am not sure if it is a byproduct of Mike Brown, but while TT's averages are OK it feels like he has no effect on the game anymore.

There was a time at the end of pre-season and the first few games it felt like he was making a noticeable impact out there, and of late it is like he is just in the background looking on.

What is the problem, and what can be done to get him more involved?

put bynum on the bench

 

[Los216]

put bynum on the bench

Not gonna happen

 

[EdMonix11]

I am not sure if it is a byproduct of Mike Brown, but while TT's averages are OK it feels like he has no effect on the game anymore.

There was a time at the end of pre-season and the first few games it felt like he was making a noticeable impact out there, and of late it is like he is just in the background looking on.

What is the problem, and what can be done to get him more involved?

He was successful at the beginning of the season because nobody was paying attention to him. Now, teams aren't helping off TT anymore, which makes it much more difficult for him to muscle to the basket because he still has very limited range, but it doesn't help teams don't need to guard our SG or SF, either.

 

[Shack]

Working out the cobwebs production wise is fine, even by a 3rd season. But the pick feels to me like hitting a single and not more.

 

[RchfldCavRaised]

Working out the cobwebs production wise is fine, even by a 3rd season. But the pick feels to me like hitting a single and not more.

That is what I said about both Thompson and Waiters the last two drafts. You simply cant settle for safe but low ceiling with those high picks.

Either way...

Some here are going to get pissed the more Clark takes minutes away from him, but its obvious that he doesnt space the floor well and alongside Andy defenses just sit back and make them shoot jumpers.

Last night Duncan played off TT in the high post about 5 feet and dared him to put up a shot or put the ball on the floor. Now San Antonio is a special team with a disciplined defense for sure, but the book is out and its up to Tristan to at least get back to where he was trusting his jumper enough to make defenses come out on him. He's back to looking scared and ready to pass as soon as he touches it in the high post.

Teams are not playing defensive 7 footers with great length who play like this on offense unless it is situational, and here we are trying to force a smaller and not as long guy in the same position.

I dont like his minutes dwindling, just like I dont like Waiters minutes dwindling. If for no other reason than, it is devaluing our most precious assets. Young lottery players on rookie deals. I get why Clark is playing more, for the same reason that I am totally patient with Bennett as he recovers from the head on collision with Brown's total neglect of the offensive end of the court, but I have to say that instead of worrying about winning games, the primary objective should be raising the value of our assets for one more summer of roster restructuring.

This is not a team that is just waiting for a player to be plugged in.

We are still in set the foundation mode for this season, I feel. Better to recognize it right now and coach accordingly.

 

[BRInQ]

That is what I said about both Thompson and Waiters the last two drafts. You simply cant settle for safe but low ceiling with those high picks.

Either way...

Some here are going to get pissed the more Clark takes minutes away from him, but its obvious that he doesnt space the floor well and alongside Andy defenses just sit back and make them shoot jumpers.

Last night Duncan played off TT in the high post about 5 feet and dared him to put up a shot or put the ball on the floor. Now San Antonio is a special team with a disciplined defense for sure, but the book is out and its up to Tristan to at least get back to where he was trusting his jumper enough to make defenses come out on him. He's back to looking scared and ready to pass as soon as he touches it in the high post.

Teams are not playing defensive 7 footers with great length who play like this on offense unless it is situational, and here we are trying to force a smaller and not as long guy in the same position.

I dont like his minutes dwindling, just like I dont like Waiters minutes dwindling. If for no other reason than, it is devaluing our most precious assets. Young lottery players on rookie deals. I get why Clark is playing more, for the same reason that I am totally patient with Bennett as he recovers from the head on collision with Brown's total neglect of the offensive end of the court, but I have to say that instead of worrying about winning games, the primary objective should be raising the value of our assets for one more summer of roster restructuring.

This is not a team that is just waiting for a player to be plugged in.

We are still in set the foundation mode for this season, I feel. Better to recognize it right now and coach accordingly.

That is your opinion.

TT played a lot better with Waiters and AV. Bynum is taking up a lot of space and for all of Delly's grit, he aint Waiters. The players lineups, rotations, minutes played have been awful.

You can use the struggles all you want to continue telling us how picks shouldn't have been used on this player or that player, but TT and Dion have talent. We've all seen it. They're young, they will struggle, but they have talent and they are special players.

It doesn't help that Brown is jerking them around like he is.

 

[RchfldCavRaised]

That is your opinion.

No shit.

Not much on this board is not opinion. I'm not frustrated, not in regard to Tristan. Every person in the NBA has talent, that's unquestionable, but what is debatable is "value". As a lockeroom guy, as a intangible guy, as a boyscout around the community, as a guy who will stop his car on Prospect and 9th and make sure all of the pedestrians cross the street in midday traffic, Tristan is invaluable. Top 5 in the league.

But in this high post offense that Igor and Brown are starting to show game by game as their preference to attack teams, he does not. At least not beside our current bigs.

All I am saying is it's in our best interest to feature the younger guys as opposed to the older guys like Clark, Jack, Andy... seeing whereas they already are defined and their value is pretty set by other GMs in this league. I see where things are trending and I dont like it. Tristan and Dion are being undervalued while Brown is going back to his rely on veterans to bail him out on offense, mode that he always has had.

TT played a lot better with Waiters and AV.

This is false. TT and AV took turns having their favorite spots on the offensive side of the floor. And ultimately, Andy still showed he's better at passing, and shooting from the high post that he and TT were both asked to operate from. Bynum gets the primary touches there now, but Andy and TT did not play well together by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Shack]

That is what I said about both Thompson and Waiters the last two drafts. You simply cant settle for safe but low ceiling with those high picks.

I believe in Waiters' upside. I think at best he could be a dynamic slasher. The biggest thing he needs is to be an outside shooter, which he's not far off from being.

Judging the TT pick is hard. On one hand compared to the rest of the top 10 he looks pretty good. Williams, Vesely, Bismack, Knight, Jimmer are producing nothing. Valanciunas, Kanter, Kemba aren't doing more than TT. And looking at upside, maybe Williams can break out on a new team and Kanter has upside, but there's nobody like Harrison Barnes who looks like he could explode.

The "consensus" top 10 that year was pure garbage. Scouts pulled a John Carter that year.

Ironically, non Cavs fans can't stop bashing Chris Grant for reaching with the TT pick, but making the apparent right pick would've actually required reaching - by taking player like Kawhi, Klay, Vuc, etc. It just looks like Grant may have taken the wrong reach.

 

[Rich]

Who has a high ceiling from that draft? People can keep saying Jonas, but that's a belief not based on actual play.

The only guy from that draft who was taken after TT that looks like he can be consistent all-star is Klay Thompson. That's it. Maybe Vucevic makes a few...MAYBE Kawhi (doubt it). But it seriously looks like that draft will be totally devoid of all-star talent.

 

[Hydroponic3385]

Seems like Grant wanted to "reach" for a big with TT in 2011, and then "reach" for a dynamic wing/scorer in 2012. Hindsight is 20/20, but damn, if only he would've reversed those 2 reaches. Could've reached on Klay or Kawhi, and then on Drummond the next year. I think his decision to draft TT 100% prevented him (in his mind) from going for Drummond the next year.

I'm not whining about what Grant did/didn't do with those picks, nor am I making up excuses for him. Just sucks that this is how it all went down for us.

 

[Rich]

Seems like Grant wanted to "reach" for a big with TT in 2011, and then "reach" for a dynamic wing/scorer in 2012. Hindsight is 20/20, but damn, if only he would've reversed those 2 reaches. Could've reached on Klay or Kawhi, and then on Drummond the next year. I think his decision to draft TT 100% prevented him (in his mind) from going for Drummond the next year.

I'm not whining about what Grant did/didn't do with those picks, nor am I making up excuses for him. Just sucks that this is how it all went down for us.

Kawhi Leonard was taken 15th. Lets at least try and keep it in the ballpark of fairness. He's also no closer to stardom than TT is. He currently looks like a role player. I think he can be more, but right now he isn't.

As for keeping him from taking Drummond, I would have agreed if he didn't then take Bennett in 2013. Thompson didn't keep him from doing that. I think he was just worried about the big bust potential in Drummond that a lot of other GMs were worried about.

 

[Hydroponic3385]

Kawhi Leonard was taken 15th. Lets at least try and keep it in the ballpark of fairness.

I'm not being unfair. And like I said, I'm not blaming Grant. But Tristan, Klay and Kawhi were all projected around the lower part of the top 10. They were all "reaches" at #4, it's just that we decided to reach on TT a bit and Kawhi happened to fall a bit. But if you wanna get hung up on this, then just take out Kawhi and only include Klay in my scenario.

As for keeping him from taking Drummond, I would have agreed if he didn't then take Bennett in 2013. Thompson didn't keep him from doing that. I think he was just worried about the big bust potential in Drummond that a lot of other GMs were worried about.

Bennett was supposed to be a scorer/shooter, unlike TT/Drummond who were primarily viewed as defense/rebounding/garbage points. Would have been hard to envision Grant drafting Drummond and forming a front court that would have been horrendous shooting the ball (this is way before any of Tristan's switching of hands, improving at the free throw line, etc.).

 

[Fuggles]

Kawhi Leonard was taken 15th. Lets at least try and keep it in the ballpark of fairness. He's also no closer to stardom than TT is. He currently looks like a role player. I think he can be more, but right now he isn't.

As for keeping him from taking Drummond, I would have agreed if he didn't then take Bennett in 2013. Thompson didn't keep him from doing that. I think he was just worried about the big bust potential in Drummond that a lot of other GMs were worried about.

You are being too nice.

When people complain about passing on Jonas for TT I can't get too riled because everyone and their mother had him projected to us. When someone goes and points out those bizzare hidden gems that get taken later I just want to toss large heavy things at them instead of talking to them.

 

[Shack]

I consider Kawhi to be that all-star talent. And I don't think it'd have been a bigger shock to go 4th than it was for TT. Nobody had Leonard going top 5, but starting at 6 with the Wizards he was in play. Falling to 15 was a surprise.

I'm not saying you can completely pick on Grant for not landing one of Kawhi, Klay or Vucevic in a field of landmines. The problem with the tanking strategy is that its success depends on hitting that bullseye.

The "consensus mock order" has never been accurate enough for a team in the top 10 or top 5 to guarantee themselves success. Just look at the Wolves - Flynn, Johnson, Williams, Bobcats - Kemba, Biyombo, MKG, Zeller, Kings - Evans, Cousins, Jimmer, Robinson, Raptors - Valanciunas, Ross, etc. There are many teams who end up with ok picks not because they reached like the Cavs, but because took the player they were supposed to and it still didn't work.

To take an "OKC strategy" you can't be like a sports better who wins 57% of the time and gets rich. There aren't enough picks. You have to be draft gawd or you get fired like Rich Cho and Chris Grant will likely be.