• Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.

Why Larry Dolan Needs to Sell the Cleveland Indians

Do Not Sell My Personal Information
Right now the payroll is around 80 mill, which isn't terrible. Something around 90 million could work, or even at 85 million so I don't see the need to add $20-$30 mill more. Just 5 or 10 would be fine.

Not to mention that the team was apparently willing to give Beltran $10+ million a year, and Willingham something around there for 2 years, so they would have been around the 90 mill mark this year had one of those deals come to fruition. The problem the team has now is that nearly half of their payroll is being spent on dead weight (Hafner, Sizemore, Lowe, Ubaldo, Carmona). Now, lucky for them Hafner, Sizemore and Lowe are all coming off the books this year and they actually have a chance to add a significant piece in free agency. The question now is if they will actually do it, or just use the money in arbitration and sit on the rest.

You're right, they'll never sell out like they did before. The only way the attendance is going to come back is if they string together consecutive years of success (A couple of high 80 win seasons or more). Whether that's fair or not is an entirely different question, but that seems like the only way for it to happen.

The payroll is actually closer to $65 - the $78 number that is widely reported includes the full $15 for Lowe (Atlanta paid $10mil) and Carmona's full salary before he re-negotiated (from $7m to $2.5)

It doesn't help my argument - but wanted to at least be accurate.
 
The payroll is actually closer to $65 - the $78 number that is widely reported includes the full $15 for Lowe (Atlanta paid $10mil) and Carmona's full salary before he re-negotiated (from $7m to $2.5)

It doesn't help my argument - but wanted to at least be accurate.
In terms of what they were willing to spend, I would just slash the 10 million off for what Atlanta was paying, because the Indians were willing to pay Fausto that full 7 million, so I guess they probably would need to add around 15-20 million more, but again, if the offer to Beltran was actually 12 million annually like reported, it appears Dolan is willing to add salary. Although another season of really poor attendance could have changed his mind, so I guess we'll find out in the off-season.

If you take a figure at around $68 million, accounting for Fausto's full salary because up until he got arrested that was the plan for the payroll. Take off 13 mill for Hafner, 5 mill for Lowe, 5 mill for Sizemore, and 3 mill for Kotchman and the payroll sits at 42. So, realistically you're hoping they add 35-40 million more to the payroll through arbitration, salary escalators and free agency/trades this off-season because the 80 million dollar number does seem like a price Dolan is willing to sit at. And you're not losing much on field production from those 4 player losses.
 
Last edited:
When your internal investments work out well, you have so much more freedom to allocate your resources better.

Hopefully they're able to do that the second time around, or at least be luckier.
 
When your internal investments work out well, you have so much more freedom to allocate your resources better.

Hopefully they're able to do that the second time around, or at least be luckier.

You don't build a team through free agency, you augment your current CONTENDING team through free agency. Let me remind all of you that the starting rotation has pitched to the tune of a 12 ERA the last 10 games, also that we have 1 starter with an ERA under 5 (Masterson 4.78) and he wasn't on the roster to open the season. Now, if anyone asked any of you how the rotation was going to fare in 12', no one would have guessed they'd have the year they're having. Let's face it, this team goes as the rotation goes, i don't think last year was a fluke anymore than this year was. When variance evens itself out, i think you'll find that this rotation isn't nearly as bad as this years numbers have dictated.

Edit: Masterson was not the pitcher i was referring to, just wanted to disclose information to assure my arguments credibility, but 4.78 is close enough to 5 for the sake of the point im trying to make. Zach McAllister is the pitcher im referring to.
 
I think there are two spots in the rotation which are solidified in terms of next season:

Justin Masterson and Ubaldo Jimenez

The other in-house candidates for 3-5 include:

Carlos Carrasco
Josh Tomlin
Zach McAllister
Jeanmar Gomez
TJ McFarland
David Huff

Ideally, you'd like to sign 1-2 veteran starters this offseason in the hope they can augment rebound years from Masterson and Jimenez (who you're committed to financially).

Free agent options include:

Scott Baker (31) - $9.25MM club option
Erik Bedard (34)
Joe Blanton (32)
Bartolo Colon (40)
Aaron Cook (34)
Kevin Correia (32)
Doug Davis (37)
Jorge De La Rosa (32) - $11MM player option with a $1MM buyout
Ryan Dempster (36)
R.A. Dickey (38) - $5MM club option with a $300K buyout
Zach Duke (30)
Scott Feldman (29) - $9.25MM club option with a $600K buyout
Jeff Francis (32)
Gavin Floyd (30) - $9.5MM club option
Freddy Garcia (37)
Zack Greinke (28)
Jeremy Guthrie (34)
Rich Harden (31)
Dan Haren (32) - $15.5MM club option with a $3.5MM buyout
Livan Hernandez (38)
Roberto Hernandez (32) - $9MM club option
Tim Hudson (37) - $9MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Edwin Jackson (29)
Hiroki Kuroda (38)
Colby Lewis (33)
Francisco Liriano (29)
Kyle Lohse (34)
Rodrigo Lopez (37)
Derek Lowe (40)
Paul Maholm (31) - $6.5MM club option with a $500K buyout
Shaun Marcum (31)
Jason Marquis (34)
Daisuke Matsuzaka (32)
Brandon McCarthy (29)
Kevin Millwood (38)
Jamie Moyer (50)
Brett Myers (32) - $10MM vesting option with a $3MM buyout
Ramon Ortiz (40)
Roy Oswalt (35)
Carl Pavano (37)
Jake Peavy (31) - $22MM club option with a $4MM buyout
Brad Penny (35)
Joel Pineiro (34)
Anibal Sanchez (29)
Jonathan Sanchez (30)
Ervin Santana (30) - $13MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Joe Saunders (32)
James Shields (31) - $9MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Chien-Ming Wang (33)
Kip Wells (36)
Jake Westbrook (35) - $8.5MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout if club declines
Randy Wolf (36) - $10MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Chris Young (34)
Carlos Zambrano (32)




There are more than a few options in there who fit the Indians price range, so if they can get any sort of consistency from the top two guys they're committed two, this rotation could certainly rebound in 2013.
 
If anyone thinks that you can win by picking up guys like Damon, Lopez, Kotchman your mistaken! The Dolans AREN'T In It To Win It! They Are Trying To Strike Lightning In A Bottle And It's Not Happening! PLEASE SELL!
 
If anyone thinks that you can win by picking up guys like Damon, Lopez, Kotchman your mistaken! The Dolans AREN'T In It To Win It! They Are Trying To Strike Lightning In A Bottle And It's Not Happening! PLEASE SELL!

another very intelligent post.
 
Last edited:

Yes that was terrible and has been said how many times now? It contributed nothing.

I think there are two spots in the rotation which are solidified in terms of next season:

Justin Masterson and Ubaldo Jimenez

The other in-house candidates for 3-5 include:

Carlos Carrasco
Josh Tomlin
Zach McAllister
Jeanmar Gomez
TJ McFarland
David Huff

Ideally, you'd like to sign 1-2 veteran starters this offseason in the hope they can augment rebound years from Masterson and Jimenez (who you're committed to financially).

Free agent options include:

Scott Baker (31) - $9.25MM club option
Erik Bedard (34)
Joe Blanton (32)
Bartolo Colon (40)
Aaron Cook (34)
Kevin Correia (32)
Doug Davis (37)
Jorge De La Rosa (32) - $11MM player option with a $1MM buyout
Ryan Dempster (36)
R.A. Dickey (38) - $5MM club option with a $300K buyout
Zach Duke (30)
Scott Feldman (29) - $9.25MM club option with a $600K buyout
Jeff Francis (32)
Gavin Floyd (30) - $9.5MM club option
Freddy Garcia (37)
Zack Greinke (28)
Jeremy Guthrie (34)
Rich Harden (31)
Dan Haren (32) - $15.5MM club option with a $3.5MM buyout
Livan Hernandez (38)
Roberto Hernandez (32) - $9MM club option
Tim Hudson (37) - $9MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Edwin Jackson (29)
Hiroki Kuroda (38)
Colby Lewis (33)
Francisco Liriano (29)
Kyle Lohse (34)
Rodrigo Lopez (37)
Derek Lowe (40)
Paul Maholm (31) - $6.5MM club option with a $500K buyout
Shaun Marcum (31)
Jason Marquis (34)
Daisuke Matsuzaka (32)
Brandon McCarthy (29)
Kevin Millwood (38)
Jamie Moyer (50)
Brett Myers (32) - $10MM vesting option with a $3MM buyout
Ramon Ortiz (40)
Roy Oswalt (35)
Carl Pavano (37)
Jake Peavy (31) - $22MM club option with a $4MM buyout
Brad Penny (35)
Joel Pineiro (34)
Anibal Sanchez (29)
Jonathan Sanchez (30)
Ervin Santana (30) - $13MM club option with a $1MM buyout
Joe Saunders (32)
James Shields (31) - $9MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Chien-Ming Wang (33)
Kip Wells (36)
Jake Westbrook (35) - $8.5MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout if club declines
Randy Wolf (36) - $10MM club option with a $1.5MM buyout
Chris Young (34)
Carlos Zambrano (32)




There are more than a few options in there who fit the Indians price range, so if they can get any sort of consistency from the top two guys they're committed two, this rotation could certainly rebound in 2013.

I see a few guys on there that would be nice to have like Marcum, Maholm, Lohse and McCarthy and would probably be our ace but good luck getting them to play here.
 
Last edited:
I see a few guys on there that would be nice to have like Marcum, Maholm, Lohse and McCarthy and would probably be our ace but good luck getting them to play here.

We Will Sign Bartolo And Freddy Garcia lol
 
We Will Sign Bartolo And Freddy Garcia lol

Yeah, Colon has been a real disappointment for the playoff bound A's.

Do you put any thought into your posts?

Please stop already.
 
Yeah, Colon has been a real disappointment for the playoff bound A's.

Do you put any thought into your posts?

Please stop already.

He will be 40 Years old next year? and the A's will be lucky to get a wildcard! You should stop...If you think signing a 40 year old bum pitcher is a good idea maybe you should start putting more thought into yours! Bartolo is 8-8 and with our horrible offense he might win 8 games all year here next year...Your just in denial that the tribe is awful
 
Yeah, Colon has been a real disappointment for the playoff bound A's.

Do you put any thought into your posts?

Please stop already.

Keep Hatin boobie...but you know right now whos worse than the tribe in the al?
 

Rubber Rim Job Podcast Video

Episode 3-13: "Backup Bash Brothers"

Rubber Rim Job Podcast Spotify

Episode 3:11: "Clipping Bucks."
Top