Windhorst-WKNR

[Just Checkin]

Does an average NBA fan understand basic concepts of the salary cap better than Windy?

Considering how ESPN covers the NBA, I don't think they think the average fan know/cares about the CBA.

I wouldn't consider forum posters the average fan either, we're a bit hardcore/nerdy on this stuff.

Those guys who you think say crazy stuff about the NBA in the barbershop probably resemble the target demographic a little more than we do.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I think it'd be worse if he genuinely didn't know how the cap works, that seems like relevant information for a national writer whose been covering the NBA for over a decade to know.

We're not even talking about messy things like the stretch provision or bi-annual exceptions here too, we're talking about cap holds. Does an average NBA fan understand basic concepts of the salary cap better than Windy? That's hard to believe.

I just hated how he phrased it all. He made it sound as if the Heat had massive cap space to improve their roster, when in reality they would use almost all of it re-signing their three main players (assuming LeBron stayed). Meanwhile, he made it sound as if the Cavs were capped out and had no way of clearing enough money to sign LeBron, which was obviously total bullshit. All we had to do was clear Jack's deal, and we pretty clearly had the assets to do that, even if we had to overpay a bit to get it done.

 

[shoes22]

I just hated how he phrased it all. He made it sound as if the Heat had massive cap space to improve their roster, when in reality they would use almost all of it re-signing their three main players (assuming LeBron stayed).

It's also possible his phrasing was a deliberate directive on the part of his bosses/editors. You know how ESPN is...they want to make everything sound as dramatic as possible, even if it means stretching the truth a little bit.

I don't think it's a coincidence that the times when Windy sounds the most "normal" is when he's doing podcasts for us or WFNY...where he's free from his ESPN bosses and can just say whatever he wants.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Windy is a PR mouthpiece from the LeBron camp and he's there for smoke and mirrors. It's been obvious for quite awhile but I guess there's still people who haven't picked up on it yet.

If you go to ESPN right now he says he spoke with LeBron and that LeBron found Wade and Bosh's comments surprising. Why would he reveal that to Windhorst of all people if Windhorst was so wrong on everything else?

Windhorst is essentially LeBron's personal media reporter.

I think that's unfair. Yes, Windy may be the guy to whom the LBJ camp will leak something when they want it to get out, but I don't see why that's a negative. It's basically no different from having any other "source", and Windy is usually pretty upfront about where he got such information. The example you use just pointed to on ESPN has Windy openly stating he spoke with LBJ, and then stating LBJ's response. It's pure reporting. Why is that bad? And where are the "smoke and mirrors" when he is being so completely open about his source and what was said?

Now, if that was the only thing he was good for, that's a different issue. But he is apparently well-liked by a lot of people around the league, and so comes into other information that he also passes along. Sometimes it's correct, sometimes it is not. He was far from the only guy stating that it was very unlikely that LBJ was coming back, although every time I read his column or heard him on the radio he was upfront about saying he didn't have any inside information on that, and it was just his opinion.

Reports of LBJ and KI not getting along may or may not be true, or it may have been true at one point, but less true as time went on. Maybe there was some wariness on one side or the other that went away.

Just seems to me that some folks are being a bit hypersensitive about anything perceived as "anti-Cleveland", and taking it out on Windy. Sure, he's not Woj, but there's only one of those guys. The rest of them, like Windy, are hit or miss.

 

[CosmoKramer]

Considering how ESPN covers the NBA, I don't think they think the average fan know/cares about the CBA.

I wouldn't consider forum posters the average fan either, we're a bit hardcore/nerdy on this stuff.

Those guys who you think say crazy stuff about the NBA in the barbershop probably resemble the target demographic a little more than we do.

I don't think you're giving ESPN credit, they cater to casual NBA fans with Windy's simplistic fluff pieces on their own site while giving hardcore NBA fans more in-depth pieces on Grantland with Zach Lowe and Kirk Goldsberry.

My original point was I don't think it's stupid to think ESPN wants Windy to write easy to read, light on the facts columns to appease some fans.

I just hated how he phrased it all. He made it sound as if the Heat had massive cap space to improve their roster, when in reality they would use almost all of it re-signing their three main players (assuming LeBron stayed). Meanwhile, he made it sound as if the Cavs were capped out and had no way of clearing enough money to sign LeBron, which was obviously total bullshit. All we had to do was clear Jack's deal, and we pretty clearly had the assets to do that, even if we had to overpay a bit to get it done.

I'm not much of a Windy defender, completely agree he's left a lot to be desired in his writing since he's left Cleveland. I'm just saying I think some of the oversights he's made have been to increase his appeal to certain fans- ESPN loved running a 'Heat have record amount of cap space' article on their website this summer- regardless of its validity.

 

[theSTEREO.]

Not joining in on the Windhorst bashing, but this is just a general comment on NBA writers and reporters: When it is your job as a professional at the top of your field to report on player movement and free agency, you MUST have a firm grasp on how the CBA works. It's really embarrassing to see how many don't.

And yes, the casual fan may not know or care about the intricacies of the CBA, heck even some hosts like Rizzo and others have no clue, but it should be the job of the expert (in this case Windy, or whoever) to correct them where they are wrong. Doesn't have to be some long winded explanation, just a simple ”A lot of people thing (X) is possible, but due to the way salaries and trades work, (X) is not possible. however, (Y) is." Not that hard.

FWIW, Windy has a pretty decent understanding of the CBA. Listening to him try to explain the Bogans trade to Rizzo (who was convinced this was a cost cutting move by Gilbert cause he can't afford the team) was good and painful all at once. Windy had it down pat. Rizzo wasn't getting it at all, but at least the listeners got to hear the real explanation, whereas if all they did was listen to Rizzo, you'd suddenly have thousands of fans who now think Gilbert is already cheaping out.

 

[Jack Brickman]

That just makes it all the more frustrating that Windhorst knowingly twisted the cap situations of the Heat and Cavs over the summer, imo. If he knows the cap, he should never have written that the Heat would have record cap space because, obviously, that was nonsense in a world where cap holds exist.

 

[Steve_424]

"And the other thing is: if the Cavs ever dream of having LeBron, it’s not going to be with Kyrie there. LeBron and Kyrie have drifted apart in the last few years, even to the point that if the Cavs wanted to get LeBron they would maybe trade Kyrie for someone who would fit better with LeBron. And I’m not making that up. That line of thinking was not originated by me. That’s just the truth."

My problem with this whole interview is this part right here. This, coupled with the timing of the interview, rubbed me the wrong way.

There is one thing Windy was spot on about:

"I thought I knew Kyrie, but he’s just disappointed me this year with his immaturity. I really do think that if he will lock up for five that you have to do that."

You're correct Windy, you don't know him.

 

[Just Checkin]

I don't think you're giving ESPN credit, they cater to casual NBA fans with Windy's simplistic fluff pieces on their own site while giving hardcore NBA fans more in-depth pieces on Grantland with Zach Lowe and Kirk Goldsberry.

My original point was I don't think it's stupid to think ESPN wants Windy to write easy to read, light on the facts columns to appease some fans.

I thought the original post was referring to their TV coverage of the NBA...

 

[CosmoKramer]

I thought the original post was referring to their TV coverage of the NBA...

We're on two different pages here, because I was referring to Windy's written pieces. ESPN's TV coverage of anything is fucking terrible and slathered in bias.

 

[FairWeatherFan?]

Maybe Windy just played a role in one of the greatest heists ever pulled...

 

[AZCavs]

This makes no sense to me and never has.

It's not contradictory to want out but at the same time realize it may not be the best choice. Two thoughts could have easily been in Kyrie's mind. 1) I want out but 2) I'm an injury prone guard who hasn't won 40 games. This might be my only shot at getting this type of money.

I never thought he'd turn down the contract, but I was fully expecting him to start trying to force a trade if things didn't start to turn around quickly.

My statement was in response to the idea that Kyrie may still want out. As in currently. Which is just a little silly to me.

 

[mhi]

Damn, everytime I click this thread I think am gonna be reading one of those Windy on WKNR summaries from that one poster. But everytime, it's wood.

I say we salvage this thread by making it the home of those summaries.

 

[The Process God]

My statement was in response to the idea that Kyrie may still want out. As in currently. Which is just a little silly to me.

Rich made the same point I was going to make before he did. Just because he signed that contract didn't necessarily mean that he wanted to. It could have been because he felt like he had to lest he lose out on a lot of money. He could have wanted out, but he could have justified staying by signing a long-term contract instead of taking the qualifying offer because it would be too risky if he got injured or didn't take that next step and was no longer emitting that "new car" aura that would maximize his value.

I'm not saying that's what happened or that it was even remotely probably, but it still was/is possible that he felt/feels that way. Lots of people make decisions that go against their wishes because they feel like they have no other choice.

 

[e0y2e3]

Windhorst addressed his comments on the BS Report this summer re: Kyrie. Kyrie's dad was spitting fire at the Cavs because of Mike Brown and until Brown was dealt with the situation between the org and Kyrie's camp was tenuous at best. No idea why this is being discussed without bringing up what Windhorst had to say about the situation after the extension was signed, nor do I have any idea why this thread can't stop being terrible and just focus on Windhorst's reporting going forward.