Dion Waiters Traded

CosmoKramer said:

How the fuck can people not enjoy a buzzer-beater to beat our bitter rival? He had 3 seconds to get a clean shot off, and he did it with time to spare. I understand the bitching about long 2s early in the shot clock but this was a game winning dagger as time expired.

Come on, what's the point of being a Cavs fan if you're going to complain after a 16 point 4th quarter comeback that ends on a shot like that?

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It astounds me. Makes me wonder why some people are fans. Like if that didn't make you happy, you simply aint built to be a fan of basketball, period

I don't see how anybody could hate Waiters. He fought through that totally media fabricated rift with Kyrie and didn't shun Kyrie or the fans or ask for a trade. He fought through injury, he fought through a retarded coach who would rather start an undrafted rookie over him, and what does Waiters do? He balls out HARDER.

You cant buy the shit that guys like Waiters, and Joakim Noah have. You cant buy heart. Waiters has that in bunches. You can sign a guy to a 5 year 100 million dollar contract and still wont get what Waiters has. I have so much more to say but I wont.......good GW from my favorite player

CavsFaninNJ said:

true

Complain about losing, complain about winning, complain that players are injury prone, complain that we haven't had enough injuries (yes, it happens), complain that we couldn't get players picked before us, complain that Lebron left, complain that he may come back

these people will complain about literally everything, even after a buzzer beater they say it wasn't a high percentage shot.

If buzzer beaters after inbounding the ball with a few seconds left were ever truly high percentage shots, there would be a lot more of them. All things considered it was a good look.

They weren't going to call a foul if he threw himself into the lane with a second left, either. That would just be one more things for these fans to complain about.

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Complain that we pick number 1, complain we didn't draft someone, then complain that we did draft someone, complain that we cant win, then turn around and complain because we won, complain that Dion took the shot over Jack, then next game complain that Jack is taking shots.......so much more lol

I see it on here and I mentally note when ppl just say 2 inconsistent things in different threads. ALOT of people do it.

I don't believe the long 2 stuff at all. I regularly see guys win playoff games with that shot because it IS THE ONE THEY GIVE UP. Because of its inefficiency. Contrary to popular belief, hitting that shot as well as Dion does is an asset when everyone else gets shut down.

Saying he has shown no growth is not only doing doing a disservice to what we are seeing, but also to what people around the league are saying, what other coaches are saying, what our coach is saying, what the other players are saying, what Dion is saying, etc etc etc. This dude is a hoss

KI4MVP said:

we only needed 2 points, there was no need to take a shot further away. eFG% is meaningless in that situation.

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I wasn't talking about that last shot, I said his shot selection is terrible.. Nothing you, or anyone else has said, changes that fact. He takes low efficiency shots.

With regards to the last shot he took, great, it's what he found so take it -- it's not the point. Watch his highlights from the last several games; he KEEPS taking these types of shots, and that's not sustainable long-term. I don't know how anyone could argue Dion should be taking long fadeaway 2's...

He takes a lot of mid range jumpers, more than he should, but not all of them are bad shots, not for him anyway. There are a few every game that are the fadeaway shots that he does need to cut out, and with some coaching and experience I'm sure he will. Other times he take a jumper off the pick and roll when they back way off of him. That's an open jumper and he is never to going to pass those up, and he probably shouldn't most of the time. Those aren't bad shots, especially come playoff time when those are the only open looks you get.

gourimoko said:

I wasn't talking about that last shot, I said his shot selection is terrible.. Nothing you, or anyone else has said, changes that fact. He takes low efficiency shots.

With regards to the last shot he took, great, it's what he found so take it -- it's not the point. Watch his highlights from the last several games; he KEEPS taking these types of shots, and that's not sustainable long-term. I don't know how anyone could argue Dion should be taking long fadeaway 2's...

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Since Kyrie went down, he's shooting 34% of his shots from mid-range as opposed to 38% of them on the year. His attempts in the restricted area or paint are up from 37% to 40%.

Kyrie is shooting 36% of his shots from mid-range on the year and 36% from the restricted area / paint. So Dion is actually taking mroe high-percentage shots than Kyrie was.

Jarett Jack's %s skew way more in favor of mid-range, too.

Seems to be a symptom of the offense moreso than a Dion Waiters problem. Last year, Waiters shot 30% of his attempts from mid-range and 45% from restricted area/paint. Dion is also shooting 43% from mid-range, so it hasn't been a terrible shot for him to take most of the year.

(This post is not meant to bash Kyrie - Kyrie is awesome - I want Dion to be more like Kyrie)

AllforOne said:

RBA, appreciate your memory (or at least your Google ability) and your desire for accountability. The Internet never forgets.

I think we give far too much credence to the opinions of writers for national publications/sites. My guess is that Mr. Kang has watched maybe two Cavs games all season, and took that bit of observation, plugged in the narrative that "Kyrie and Dion don't get along," and called it a day. I'm not blaming him; the Cavs have often been unwatchable this season (especially around the time that piece was written), and it's impossible to be an in-depth expert on each of the 30 teams. But I also don't think his opinion carries much weight.

Maybe we don't forgive, and maybe we don't forget. But maybe we shouldn't give a damn about some outsider's opinion in the first place.

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We also live in a world where everyone is so quick to declare someone/something a finished product. I don't know if it's impatience, or more voices being heard, but it is ridiculous.

The whole long 2 vs. 3 argument is by far my least favorite thing to come out of the analytics movement. The debate doesn't need to be rehashed every other day.

Czvosec said:

We also live in a world where everyone is so quick to declare someone/something a finished product. I don't know if it's impatience, or more voices being heard, but it is ridiculous.

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Impatience is exactly what it is. One of, if not the biggest change the world has seen in the last decade or so is how fast it has become to obtain information, entertainment, social interaction and physical goods.

It has helped lead to the development of an instant gratification mindstate with-in society, at least for most things.

Czvosec said:

The whole long 2 vs. 3 argument is by far my least favorite thing to come out of the analytics movement. The debate doesn't need to be rehashed every other day.

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It's another area where advanced stats either mean very little or don't mean what you think they do. Even though a guy like Waiters is shooting 37% from 3, it doesn't mean if he is coming off the pick and roll that he should dribble backwards behind the line and shoot 3 over shooting the long 2. That would take him out of his rhythm and he wouldn't hit that shot 37% of the time.

Now does it mean that an offense in general should be more geared toward drive and kicks and getting guys open spot up 3s? Yeah I would say that. I wouldn't say it is a good idea to force either a 3 or a layup every time down the floor though because the high percentage looks won't always be there, and sometimes an open mid range jumper will be a better look than a contested 3 or Tristan getting raped at the rim again.

Ball hard D Waiters, shitting on these haters... Dion is showing tremendous growth, and no one can deny that. He was handed the starting role when Kyrie went down and has showed he is now ready to start and has matured also. So not just growth on the court, but also off the court. Remember when Lloyd said Dion went to Mike Brown's office after the loss against OKC and said he needs to do a better job rebounding and that it was his fault or something along those lines? Dion would have never done that at the beginning of the season or last year. Hopefully Kyrie and Dion are starting together now next year and we will start seeing the crazy-talented back-court we have in Cleveland.

Last 30 days: 19.3 PPG while shooting 45% from the field, 4.3 APG, and 3.1 RPG

Dion's clearly capable of playing with a lot of heart, but it's becoming increasingly clear to me that he plays up or down to the level of his teammates in that regard. At the start of the game (and coming out of halftime) he was really just going through the motions, and that's something he's done for stretches thoughout the season. When Delly checks in all of that changes. All of a sudden Dion looks like a linebacker, a bigger Eric Bledsoe on defense. Instead of just trying to do "enough" on defense he's playing with purpose, relishing the opportunity to be a difference maker on every possession. Instead of looking for opportunities to save energy on defense he's looking for opportunities to unleash more energy on defense, in spite of the fact that it was the 4th game in 5 nights and he played 40+ minutes in each of the first 3.

Some national guys like to characterize Dion as a guy who's only good for putting up big numbers on a bad team. But I think he's really the opposite of that. Put him on a winning team with a positive culture and he morphs into a vastly more dynamic player, who's not only a scorer, but also an excellent facilitator and defender who plays winning basketball.

Dion always had the potential to be a game changer like this...he just needed a spark, and that spark came from an undrafted rookie point guard called Delly.

CosmoKramer said:

How the fuck can people not enjoy a buzzer-beater to beat our bitter rival? He had 3 seconds to get a clean shot off, and he did it with time to spare. I understand the bitching about long 2s early in the shot clock but this was a game winning dagger as time expired.

Come on, what's the point of being a Cavs fan if you're going to complain after a 16 point 4th quarter comeback that ends on a shot like that?

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To get people thanks. Like this. ^

Ever mid-range jumper, regardless of how it's created or defended, is going to be called a long fadeaway 2 now I guess #moneyball