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Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Class

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It’s interesting that DMB would constitute a relatively progressive choice of musicians who remain relevant. Sort of an underdog in a category where how can you ignore superstars like Mariah Carey (even if she would never call herself rock and roll). Not the worst list they have generated although the recency bias for fallen figures like o’Connor seems in play.
 
At the insistence of some female friends, I saw DMB a couple of times in Charlottesville at a local bar called Trax before they broke. Girls loved that band because they'd just dance the whole time. DMB himself was a waiter at a place my roommate and I used to go to fairly regularly for dinner. They had a version of Cincinnati Chili that actually had good chile instead of that crap that passes for chili in Cinci.
 
Per the discussion a couple years back about DMB. @Randolphkeys

I guess they ran out of Boomer Bands.

It sounds like time for me to go on a R&R HOF nomination rant. I'm thrilled RCF is the unofficial home of Clevelanders who are way too competitive about the Rock Hall. I bring some of this up with peers in California and they are only slightly aware the Rock Hall exists.

So to start my rant, last year had a fantastic class and great nominations. I respect that if you get nominated, you have to sit out a year. I'd happily lobby for Joy Division/New Order, Soundgarden, White Stripes and Warren Zevon to get in over most of the nominees this year. Those are some memorable rock acts.

I will make this rant hyper-competitive in format because of it.

Rap category: I think Tribe Called Quest gets in while Eric B. and Rakim have to wait. Tribe are the only nominees to carry over from 2023, just like Kate Bush had two in a row in 2022 and 2023. In other words, they know they fucked up.

Time is Ticking Category: Ozzy Osborne and Cher get in, Sinead O'Conner is out. This matches up with Ozzy's farewell tour in 2024. Sometimes you can tell who is in by tracking upcoming concert tours. Cher announced that she recorded new music, and like Tina Turner & Stevie Nicks she deserves to be in without her former partner. O'Conner has the nostalgia but not the legion of fans or cred. She's in the happy to be nominated category.

Pop Diva Category: We can argue this shouldn't be a category, but the committee keeps letting at least one per year in ever since the ownership change. I have Mary J. Blige definitely in, Mariah Carey as a 50/50, Sade is out. Mary J Blige is a national treasure for the more soulful side of hip hop, really one of the no-brainers here. Her version of U2's One is a great crossover. Will they double down with Mariah in the same year? I just don't know, and I hope they save Mariah for another year. Sade is just to slow, jazzy and not at all rock and roll to topple the other two.

For fun, here's a great rock cover of Mary J. Blige's Real Love:


Rock and Roll Lives Category: I have Dave Matthews Band and Lenny Kravitz in, and Foreigner as a 50/50. The DMB checks a lot of boxes, but had to wait their turn. They flat out destroyed a fan poll one year and then didn't get in. They represent a great diversity of influence, membership and fan base. You can say the same for Lenny. Some people thought Lenny was stuck in the 70s in his first two albums but then he pushed boundaries to really become an influencer. Now he's semi-retired but can dust it off whenever he wants. Maybe I am a little biased since I attended concerts for both, fully knowing they were chick approved rockers.

Foreigner is a first time nominee for a reason. They sold a ton of albums but don't carry a flag for industry respect. I've said it before in this thread, but they were hired guns assembled by a record company with almost no back story to latch onto, and when their hired gun keyboardist Thomas Dolby left, a lot of the creative force left with him. They will make it in someday just because of records sold and memorable ear worms.

So that means Peter Frampton, Oasis, Jane's Addiction, and Kool and the Gang are on the outs for me. I see Frampton has done a lot of guest duets in high profile places in the past year, including playing with Cheryl Crow in the last HOF Induction ceremony. He's still talented, but he had one great album in 1976 and has just been a nice British bloke who can wail outside of that album. He's an underdog this year because of it. Kool and the Gang are so much fun live, go see them. That said, they had one mega hit and a few solid songs. I want them in eventually, but I place a few acts above them this year. On the other hand, Oasis makes no sense to me, there are great British bands who got screwed in the past... but this group had one album and became obnoxious. Jane's Addiction had two good albums from the late 80s LA scene and then became influential behind the scenes and as B list celebrities. It doesn't feel like the right time for a group like that.
 
It sounds like time for me to go on a R&R HOF nomination rant. I'm thrilled RCF is the unofficial home of Clevelanders who are way too competitive about the Rock Hall. I bring some of this up with peers in California and they are only slightly aware the Rock Hall exists.

So to start my rant, last year had a fantastic class and great nominations. I respect that if you get nominated, you have to sit out a year. I'd happily lobby for Joy Division/New Order, Soundgarden, White Stripes and Warren Zevon to get in over most of the nominees this year. Those are some memorable rock acts.

I will make this rant hyper-competitive in format because of it.

Rap category: I think Tribe Called Quest gets in while Eric B. and Rakim have to wait. Tribe are the only nominees to carry over from 2023, just like Kate Bush had two in a row in 2022 and 2023. In other words, they know they fucked up.

Time is Ticking Category: Ozzy Osborne and Cher get in, Sinead O'Conner is out. This matches up with Ozzy's farewell tour in 2024. Sometimes you can tell who is in by tracking upcoming concert tours. Cher announced that she recorded new music, and like Tina Turner & Stevie Nicks she deserves to be in without her former partner. O'Conner has the nostalgia but not the legion of fans or cred. She's in the happy to be nominated category.

Pop Diva Category: We can argue this shouldn't be a category, but the committee keeps letting at least one per year in ever since the ownership change. I have Mary J. Blige definitely in, Mariah Carey as a 50/50, Sade is out. Mary J Blige is a national treasure for the more soulful side of hip hop, really one of the no-brainers here. Her version of U2's One is a great crossover. Will they double down with Mariah in the same year? I just don't know, and I hope they save Mariah for another year. Sade is just to slow, jazzy and not at all rock and roll to topple the other two.

For fun, here's a great rock cover of Mary J. Blige's Real Love:


Rock and Roll Lives Category: I have Dave Matthews Band and Lenny Kravitz in, and Foreigner as a 50/50. The DMB checks a lot of boxes, but had to wait their turn. They flat out destroyed a fan poll one year and then didn't get in. They represent a great diversity of influence, membership and fan base. You can say the same for Lenny. Some people thought Lenny was stuck in the 70s in his first two albums but then he pushed boundaries to really become an influencer. Now he's semi-retired but can dust it off whenever he wants. Maybe I am a little biased since I attended concerts for both, fully knowing they were chick approved rockers.

Foreigner is a first time nominee for a reason. They sold a ton of albums but don't carry a flag for industry respect. I've said it before in this thread, but they were hired guns assembled by a record company with almost no back story to latch onto, and when their hired gun keyboardist Thomas Dolby left, a lot of the creative force left with him. They will make it in someday just because of records sold and memorable ear worms.

So that means Peter Frampton, Oasis, Jane's Addiction, and Kool and the Gang are on the outs for me. I see Frampton has done a lot of guest duets in high profile places in the past year, including playing with Cheryl Crow in the last HOF Induction ceremony. He's still talented, but he had one great album in 1976 and has just been a nice British bloke who can wail outside of that album. He's an underdog this year because of it. Kool and the Gang are so much fun live, go see them. That said, they had one mega hit and a few solid songs. I want them in eventually, but I place a few acts above them this year. On the other hand, Oasis makes no sense to me, there are great British bands who got screwed in the past... but this group had one album and became obnoxious. Jane's Addiction had two good albums from the late 80s LA scene and then became influential behind the scenes and as B list celebrities. It doesn't feel like the right time for a group like that.
I would visit the HOF this year if this were the list.

Great rant
 
I find the Oasis, and more broadly the Britpop argument, interesting.

  • Huge in the 90’s, like grunge
  • Short lived, like grunge
  • The hits are still almost immediately recognizable today (I’m somewhat biased by being a kid in the 90s that was overfed the britpop movement via radio and MTV while my first memories were forming)
  • Relevance at the time was arguably, at least in part, media-driven British nationalism (hey, it worked)
  • Relevance was not always about the music, see Keys’ reference to Oasis being known for its obnoxiousness
  • I would imagine most of Coldplay, Ed Sheeran, the Killers, Maroon 5, etc. would list them as influential
I could see the argument go either way. But that’s what makes it an interesting argument to me. I could definitely maybe have a lively debate over a couple pints of ESB at a the local pub.
 

R&R HOF Inductee Brian Wilson is living through some serious health issues. I love the Beach Boys and it stings to see my favorite performers age. I am glad he seems to have a supportive family.
 

R&R HOF Inductee Brian Wilson is living through some serious health issues. I love the Beach Boys and it stings to see my favorite performers age. I am glad he seems to have a supportive family.
He's had supportive people keep him in a "conservatorship" lifestyle most of his life. Some of them screwed his life up more than he could on his own. He needs the help though, he's never been able to deal with real life.
 
He's had supportive people keep him in a "conservatorship" lifestyle most of his life. Some of them screwed his life up more than he could on his own. He needs the help though, he's never been able to deal with real life.
The person who tried to manipulate Brian's life and illegally force himself into Brian's will did not have a conservatorship over him. The family stepped in and obtained a conservatorship in the 90's to protect him from this individual.

Wilson has severe mental illness and has been living with a degenerative brain disease for some time as well. It's one of those difficult end of life decisions that so many families in America have to make everyday. I am sure they do not take puting him in a conservatorship lightly.
 
The person who tried to manipulate Brian's life and illegally force himself into Brian's will did not have a conservatorship over him. The family stepped in and obtained a conservatorship in the 90's to protect him from this individual.

Wilson has severe mental illness and has been living with a degenerative brain disease for some time as well. It's one of those difficult end of life decisions that so many families in America have to make everyday. I am sure they do not take puting him in a conservatorship lightly.

I feel like some naked woman should write a song about this.
 
The person who tried to manipulate Brian's life and illegally force himself into Brian's will did not have a conservatorship over him. The family stepped in and obtained a conservatorship in the 90's to protect him from this individual.

Wilson has severe mental illness and has been living with a degenerative brain disease for some time as well. It's one of those difficult end of life decisions that so many families in America have to make everyday. I am sure they do not take puting him in a conservatorship lightly.
Yep, Dr. Eugene Landry, his psychologist, wound up taking control of his business and personal dealings in the '80s, estranging Wilson from family and friends. There are good bio pics and books about the whole crazy situation. Brian started retreating from the world in the mid 60s and never really got fully back in. A shame. A real genius, still.
 
Ozzy Osborne and Cher get in, Sinead O'Conner is out. This matches up with Ozzy's farewell tour in 2024.

"Will", or "should"?

I'd defer to your analysis if it is "will", but I couldn't agree with "should". He had a couple of good solo albums, and a truly great single in Crazy Train. But he didn't really write much of it at all, with Randy Rhoades and Bob Daisley doing most of the writing in his first band, and Zack Wylde and various others writing most of the stuff later. He got some writing credits simply because it was his band and he insisted on it. I saw an interview where Geezer mocked Ozzie by saying he couldn't even read, so how could you expect him to write?

Anyway, I just don't see his individual contributions as a solo act being HOF worthy. Not really even close. I'm not a huge Foreigner fan, but as a collective band that wrote all their own stuff, I have them as much more worthy than Ozzy.
Rock and Roll Lives Category: I have Dave Matthews Band and Lenny Kravitz in, and Foreigner as a 50/50. The DMB checks a lot of boxes, but had to wait their turn. They flat out destroyed a fan poll one year and then didn't get in. They represent a great diversity of influence, membership and fan base.

I'm not doubting their worthiness to be inducted. They seem to be very popular in a certain genre, and a huge touring band so I wouldn't quibble about them getting in. But I do have an honest question about because I've truthfully never listened to much of their stuff.

What would you say is their "influence"? They seem a very popular but somewhat generic "jam band" to me, and I don't know them well enough to think of who/what they might have influenced. I mean, I'm not a Dead fan either, but I do get their influence as the quintessential jam/touring band. I'm just not aware of any important acts (not to say there aren't any) who were particularly influenced by DMB.

Again, there may be a great easy answer to this, and the question may well be more a comment on my ignorance than on DMB. But I truly don't know, and am just curious.

I don't really feel any stake in this year's nominations like I did in Kate Bush getting in last year. Feels like we've taken a real step down.
 
Halls of Fame are for the famous.

(And the only inductee I would ever want to see perform is Tom Waits, anyway. Or Frank Zappa.)
 
Its funny, I really liked INXS back in the day...but cant stand U2, i top 10 of all time band who i would say is a similar genre.
INXS should be in.

I have been on a big INXS kick lately.

It's an original sin they haven't really been considered.

They were really big for the better part of the 80s and into the 90s and merging New Wave and Rock.

Michael Hutchence was the archetypical front-man who lived and died the Rock Star life. One of the greatest era. Some might gig them for lacking longevity but that is hardly fair...

Kick alone should be grounds for consideration, but they also have a clutch of other good albums and loads of hit singles. Great live.

Kick had four Top Ten singles, including No. 1 (Need You Tonight), No. 2 (Devil Inside) and No. 3 (New Sensation), No. 7 (Never Tear Us Apart). They gave life to the phrase "Number One in Canada" with like six No. 1 hits there. And I will stand by saying "Never Tear Us Apart" is one of the greatest songs ever.

Certainly a much larger contribution and success than a lot of other marginal Boomer bands that are in.

 
I need people's thoughts:

What is INXS' best song?

Need You Tonight?
New Sensation?
Don't Change?
Suicide Blonde?
Never Tear Us Apart?
(the New Wave glory of) The One Thing?
Beautiful Girl?
Devil Inside?
What You Need?
And about 10 others.
 

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