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  1. #16
    The Paterfamilias RedBlackAttack's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Quote Originally Posted by catfish View Post
    I saw a Knicks Cavs game at MSG during KJ's rookie year. He relieved Mark Price. This may be blashpemy in Cleveland but you could immediately tell who the real point guard was-it was not Mark Price. Moreover I was never a fan of Larry Soft Nance. I stll cant get over the stupid Ron Harper Danny Ferry deal. To this day I think there was a mistake and we were supposed to get the draft picks. The way I look at it Danny Ferry killed 2 generations of CAVS teams. Unfortunately I am starting to look at the Sessions trade with the same opinion. How do we give the Lakers who have been looking for a point guard forever a point guard and only get back a late first and we have to pay stiff walton's salary. The draft pick exchange is going to be a wash. Maybe Gilbert was just trying to reduce the cHeat's chances at a ring.
    Don't want to derail the thread, but the Sessions deal made all of the sense in the world. First of all, unlike the Harper/Ferry deal, we aren't taking a chance by possibly choosing the wrong guy. In retrospect, Harper was clearly the far superior player. Even at a young age, I remember being very confused as to why we traded Harper considering the way he was playing.

    Sessions, on the other hand, was the second best point guard on the team the moment that Kyrie was drafted and that gap was only going to widen. Furthermore, he was going to be a FA at the end of the season anyway, so we needed to get what we could for him while we could. Lastly, we needed to tank regardless and Sessions wasn't going to help that.

    Taking on Walton's salary is of no consequence. We still have plenty of cap space going forward.

    But, anyway... Different topic for different thread.



    As for KJ, he was a legitimately great player. So was Mark Price, though. Like I said, I'm sure we could have found a way to make it work. Or, at least get a hell of a lot more for a talent like that. While the Ferry/Harper deal gets most of the attention, that Kevin Johnson trade was even worse in my estimation.

    Harper was a very good player, but he was never prime Kevin Johnson level.

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  3. #17
    Team Player NoTitleTown's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Quote Originally Posted by RedBlackAttack View Post
    Don't want to derail the thread, but the Sessions deal made all of the sense in the world. First of all, unlike the Harper/Ferry deal, we aren't taking a chance by possibly choosing the wrong guy. In retrospect, Harper was clearly the far superior player. Even at a young age, I remember being very confused as to why we traded Harper considering the way he was playing.

    Sessions, on the other hand, was the second best point guard on the team the moment that Kyrie was drafted and that gap was only going to widen. Furthermore, he was going to be a FA at the end of the season anyway, so we needed to get what we could for him while we could. Lastly, we needed to tank regardless and Sessions wasn't going to help that.

    Taking on Walton's salary is of no consequence. We still have plenty of cap space going forward.
    Agreed entirely. Anyone questioning the Sessions trade is just not a very good fan of the NBA. I will add one more point -- HE WAS GOING TO BE A FA, AND WE WERE GOING TO LOSE HIM FOR NOTHING.

  4. #18
    I hate Florida rabman_gold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoTitleTown View Post
    I really like the idea of this thread working through Cavs history, but I'm not sure that the title is appropriate.
    Don't worry. You'll see why I gave it that title to begin with.
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    Magic Number Thread:
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  6. #19
    you wot m8? PosterTime's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Quote Originally Posted by rabman_gold View Post
    Don't worry. You'll see why I gave it that title to begin with.
    Ooooo lala tease us more. Cool thread though. I'm so excited for this draft because it will give us a fairly good idea of how Chris Grant is sculpting his masterpiece contending team.

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  8. #20
    Situational Stopper
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    I'll never forget the day Ron Harper got traded...

    Just disappointed. What were the management thinking? I remember saying to my father that time why do you trade a player who has already proven in the NBA and receive a player who could be a nobody "bust". And my father mentioned Gund didn't like the crowd that Ron was hanging out with. Just disgusted. I enjoyed watching Ron, Hod Rod, Brad, Larry, and Price. The way they played basketball was fun to watch as their execution was terrific. I thought Ron was the X factor in the team that can make it to the next level with another year or two of experience.

    In fact, look at 1986. We drafted Price, Brad, Ron, and Johnny Newman! I hate the what if... but seriously we would have won not once but twice during those times if we had all those guys. That really set us back and ruined the franchise.

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  10. #21
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Looking back you don't know if Harper gets injured with Cleveland if he stays. (Didn't he have a serious leg injury his first year in LA?) He wasn't the same player after that. He was really good that year the Cavs won 57 games, the year of the infamous Mahorn cheap shot to Mark Price.

    I always thought the key matchup problem for those Cavs teams against the Bulls was actually Horace Grant. They just couldn't keep him off the boards. They lacked interior toughness. Now if Weltman hadn't traded Chuck Oakley for Keith Lee...

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  12. #22
    I hate Florida rabman_gold's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    FYI, all of your memories and thoughts WILL be considered when I'm article posting. If you wanted to be credited or what not (quotes), or vice versa, please let me know. This is going to be quite the summer so be ready for this. I appreciate this from all of you.
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  13. #23
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    I always thought our key match-up problem .vs. the Bulls was the inability to influence the refs. No matter how much better we played, and how crappy Jordan was shooting ... by the end of the game he'd be running in to guys and the refs would be bailing him out.

    Wade didn't invent that...

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  15. #24
    I hate Florida rabman_gold's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Nice conversation we're having. Got a new bit up.
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  16. #25
    Team Player GreasySpread36's Avatar
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    Default Re: A Dawn of a New Era: The Kyrie Irving-led Cavs look to begin the New Dynasty

    Quote Originally Posted by Taiter View Post
    Looking back you don't know if Harper gets injured with Cleveland if he stays. (Didn't he have a serious leg injury his first year in LA?) He wasn't the same player after that. He was really good that year the Cavs won 57 games, the year of the infamous Mahorn cheap shot to Mark Price.

    I always thought the key matchup problem for those Cavs teams against the Bulls was actually Horace Grant. They just couldn't keep him off the boards. They lacked interior toughness. Now if Weltman hadn't traded Chuck Oakley for Keith Lee...
    Oak-Town would have been a perfect part on those teams. The only way to stop Mark Price was to beat the crap out of him, and that's exactly what teams did. They wouldn't have been so eager to knock Mark into the basket stantions and throw elbows at his head with Charles Oakley on hand, that's for sure. He could have been the bodyguard, just like he was MJ's bodyguard.

    It wasn't just Horace Grant, either. Chicago had other big bodies- Cliff Levingston, Scott Williams- and they beat the hell out of us on the offensive boards when we played them in the early '90s. It's bad enough to be going against Jordan and Pippen but we were also giving them two, three shots at the basket seemingly every time down. I always thought we were better than Chicago in '88 and '89; we just couldn't overcome MJ. By '92, though, the Bulls were better- deeper, more athletic, more physical- and they had the two best players on the floor. We just had no chance by then.

    The Harper trade was one of those deals you know is bad as soon as it happens. It wasn't this franchise's finest hour and not just because we got rooked in the deal. The implication that Harper was a bad seed, exiling him to the freaking Clippers- it was kind of a shabby way to treat a terrific young player who wanted to be here and who, as it turned out, was a good guy and a good character player. We may not have ever beaten Chicago even with Harper, but we just had no chance at all after we got rid of him.

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