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Kevin Love - Miami Ground Machine

Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Is Kevin Love a Hero for Saving a Dog?

  • Yes

    Votes: 28 48.3%
  • Too Right!

    Votes: 2 3.4%
  • Hotter than Jimmy G

    Votes: 15 25.9%
  • Jim Chones

    Votes: 13 22.4%

  • Total voters
    58
I agree. Lowry and Horford are both 3 years older than Love, and are more likely to decline this year than is Love, and I don't see either as so clearly better than Love that we can predict who will be better this upcoming season.

I think Middleton is weirdly overrated in general.

Simmons is younger and better overall, but is game is so weird for a PG that it's tough to figure out how truly valuable he is. Vuc is one guy I do think is better, but it's not clear cut.

Siakam is the one guy I'd want over Love in a heartbeat, and that based on his history of rapid improvement, and projected improvement in the future..

Paskal Siakam is an interesting situation, and one that I kind of put on the same level as Jayson Tatum. They have both been in situations where they were third or fourth options most of the season but very successful in that role. In the playoffs, they both had a wide variance from their best games to their clunkers. Now that the stars have left their teams, they could end up bonafide NBA stars in the new role or find their efficiency take a nose dive. Since Tatum was expected to be an All Star type player someday since AAU ball, NBA writers expect him to make the adjustment easily to team leader and kind of forget about Siakam. I think they are both right there to make the jump and it wouldn't surprise me... but they actually have to do it rather than theoretically ease right into "franchise guy".

Simmons, on the other hand, kind of got exposed in the playoffs this year. The NBA was ready to crown him The Next Big Thing after a promising rookie year and having such an exciting young team around him... but never hitting a three pointer at this stage became a clear attack point for The Raptors defense. I absolutely believed the offseason trade rumors coming out of Philly. That glaring weakness has to be answered, or else forget the hype.

I think Khris Middleton deserves the respect he has earned around the NBA. He legitimately made the jump from a 3and D guy to a complimentary scoring option on a good team. His defensive advanced statistics took a little hit as he became a bigger part of the offensive load, but he played timely defense when needed last season. Consider that a valuable lesson to the Kevin Love critics, by the way... sometimes incredibly important offensive contributors don't go all out on defense every play and still make All Star teams.
 
I'm going to change three words on your post, Ozone....

Love's value on these boards is pretty deflated by comparison to opinions around the league.
He was injury prone, paid reasonably and has a lot to prove before the Cavs can expect to get any real value moving him , I think he stays in a Cavs jersey until he retires, unless he turns back the clock this season and draws some legitimate offers
 
The difference for me is the level of arrogance that Simmons and Tatum play with in terms of evolving their games. I’m not even certain Simmons is shooting with the correct hand and Tatum went from a super promising player to pulling a poor mans Kobe routine. Siakam was amazing for some games and absolutely destroyed certain matchups using his length. This stopped being the case when he himself was presented with supreme length when he got matched up with Giannis and Embiid but can you really blames him lol.

Despite that how many GM’s in the league including Koby would take Love over these three playing going into the season without factoring in age or value? Purely based on ability in order to even it out
 
The difference for me is the level of arrogance that Simmons and Tatum play with in terms of evolving their games. I’m not even certain Simmons is shooting with the correct hand and Tatum went from a super promising player to pulling a poor mans Kobe routine. Siakam was amazing for some games and absolutely destroyed certain matchups using his length. This stopped being the case when he himself was presented with supreme length when he got matched up with Giannis and Embiid but can you really blames him lol.

Despite that how many GM’s in the league including Koby would take Love over these three playing going into the season without factoring in age or value? Purely based on ability in order to even it out

Guys on the upshot are just valued differently. All three are great values on their rookie deals too. Too hard to compare.
 
Guys on the upshot are just valued differently. All three are great values on their rookie deals too. Too hard to compare.

That is why the conversation was "who makes the All Star team in 2019" not "who has higher trade value." Kind of tough when half of the posters in the thread are talking about apples and the other are talking oranges.
 
I think I said this numerous times on the all Cavs studio thread and it seems like I am right.
There is an avalanche of difference from what the cavs would want back for love vs what other teams are willing to give up, hence a trade is very unlikely at this point or even at any time this season. The older he gets the less you probably get back as he is not getting younger.
No problem with him being on the team, but I think people really over estimate the chances he gets traded unless the Cavs significantly reduce their asking price.
 
I think I said this numerous times on the all Cavs studio thread and it seems like I am right.
There is an avalanche of difference from what the cavs would want back for love vs what other teams are willing to give up, hence a trade is very unlikely at this point or even at any time this season. The older he gets the less you probably get back as he is not getting younger.
No problem with him being on the team, but I think people really over estimate the chances he gets traded unless the Cavs significantly reduce their asking price.

Well, I'd say this thread stopped being about "What will the Cavaliers do with Kevin Love" a long time ago. I'd argue the thread stopped being about that when he signed his contract.

The past year of the thread has really been about "How do fans react to what the Cavaliers are doing with Kevin Love."

There is a difference, and that small change in theme changes the readability of this thread significantly.
 
Well, I'd say this thread stopped being about "What will the Cavaliers do with Kevin Love" a long time ago. I'd argue the thread stopped being about that when he signed his contract.

The past year of the thread has really been about "How do fans react to what the Cavaliers are doing with Kevin Love."

There is a difference, and that small change in theme changes the readability of this thread significantly.
If the Cavs wanted to trade love this summer it seems like they def miscalculated his value. This is something Altman seems to be struggling with ( knowing the market) Perfect example is the JR Smith situation.
 
If the Cavs wanted to trade love this summer it seems like they def miscalculated his value. This is something Altman seems to be struggling with ( gushing the market. Perfect example is the JR Smith situation.

Love's trade value is kind of diminished mostly because of circumstances of how the landscape of the league changed via free agency this summer. For the first time in a long time it is fairly wide open and most of the projected contenders are made up of 2 all stars.

I think Koby allowed himself the luxury of picking the right time to trade Love by giving him the extension. He wasn't under any pressure to do it at the trade deadline last year or this summer. He can stick to getting good value back for him.

Right now, I think teams are willing to stay in a holding pattern to see how their team actually plays together with new additions. All it might take is one team to land a 3rd all star for another arms race to start and Love's value jump up alot. Teams are looking for bargains right now and Koby doesn't need to dump Love so the rest of the league is saying he is over valuing him.
 
If the Cavs wanted to trade love this summer it seems like they def miscalculated his value. This is something Altman seems to be struggling with ( knowing the market) Perfect example is the JR Smith situation.

I disagree. The fact you and I can read all the articles available about the Kevin Love situation in one summer and arrive in different places illustrates just how complex the NBA offseason has become. This is much more convoluted than the NFL and MLB web of press leaks combined. Not only do different franchises get journalists to take stances as favors, but players and their agents do the same. So, one player and his value/attitudes can be spun in several different lights.

The Cavaliers signed Love to a four year contract at fair market price, or at least that is what Love's people and the Cavs people believed a year ago. Some would say otherwise, frankly that's the manipulation noise. This offseason, it would be a very aggressive play for Love's reps to force a trade with three years left. Not an unprecedented move, but very rare. If Love wanted options in 2019, the four year contract was the wrong play, and his people know it. So, what is appropriate is dipping a toe into the trade market to understand trade value, certainly not taking the highest offer no matter what.

Will there be journalists claiming the Cavs HAVE to trade Love this offseason? Sure, they probably represent the teams and players who would benefit most from Love available cheap. However, this isn't Irving with a bad knee and one year left on the deal. That was a case for the Cavs to chug the cheap whiskey and take 75¢.

And are there fans who want Love moved for three quarters on the dollar this offseason? Certainly. They will pick and choose the articles that match their preconceived bias. Some fans don't see where Love has value for the young roster around him. They want asset accumulation and nothing but asset accumulation. However, again, the Cavaliers front office see how a healthy Kevin Love makes young players develop properly. All the fans and journalists who disagree with the front office get to have a opinion, but in the end it's just an opinion not a controlling voice.
 
happy to keep him around if no team is going to make a good enough offer, if we get Wiseman it could be a solid big man combo
 
If the Cavs wanted to trade love this summer it seems like they def miscalculated his value. This is something Altman seems to be struggling with ( knowing the market) Perfect example is the JR Smith situation.

I think the Cavs are fine with keeping Kevin. I think they plan to trade him at some point , but I don't think it was limited to this summer. They were never trading him last year, this is just the first time I think they may start to be getting more receptive to the idea. The timing isn't quite right yet. Plus he's been so beneficial to the young guys that it's hard to want to mess that up.


I'm not directing this part at you, but I find it funny how some media guys once Horford went to Boston and still to this day and people on this board as well think his old ass on that contract is somehow significantly better/more valuable than Love...something about he's a better playoff guy? Better defense? Lol. I think we all need to remember that Al Horford will be forever the dude that got his lunch money stolen and his ass beat by Tristan Thompson, WHILE HORFORD WAS IN HIS PRIME!!!!! And TT is someone a lot of people on this board continually mock/make fun of as some kind of scrub...yet he dominated Horford in every way imaginable basically every time they matched up. Horford is no playoff performer. He's not on Kevin Love's level, I'll tell you that much. Just because Kev had a hard time sometimes defensively against the 73 win Warriors and then the KD Warriors shouldn't make him less valuable. Guess what? That team is dead for now. Kev had some absolutely monstrous playoff games/stretches for us over the years. Al fucking Horford, lol.
 
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I disagree. The fact you and I can read all the articles available about the Kevin Love situation in one summer and arrive in different places illustrates just how complex the NBA offseason has become. This is much more convoluted than the NFL and MLB web of press leaks combined. Not only do different franchises get journalists to take stances as favors, but players and their agents do the same. So, one player and his value/attitudes can be spun in several different lights.

The Cavaliers signed Love to a four year contract at fair market price, or at least that is what Love's people and the Cavs people believed a year ago. Some would say otherwise, frankly that's the manipulation noise. This offseason, it would be a very aggressive play for Love's reps to force a trade with three years left. Not an unprecedented move, but very rare. If Love wanted options in 2019, the four year contract was the wrong play, and his people know it. So, what is appropriate is dipping a toe into the trade market to understand trade value, certainly not taking the highest offer no matter what.

Will there be journalists claiming the Cavs HAVE to trade Love this offseason? Sure, they probably represent the teams and players who would benefit most from Love available cheap. However, this isn't Irving with a bad knee and one year left on the deal. That was a case for the Cavs to chug the cheap whiskey and take 75¢.

And are there fans who want Love moved for three quarters on the dollar this offseason? Certainly. They will pick and choose the articles that match their preconceived bias. Some fans don't see where Love has value for the young roster around him. They want asset accumulation and nothing but asset accumulation. However, again, the Cavaliers front office see how a healthy Kevin Love makes young players develop properly. All the fans and journalists who disagree with the front office get to have a opinion, but in the end it's just an opinion not a controlling voice.
The thing is there is a huge ocean between what the Cavs want for him and what other teams are willing to give. Hence I said” if they were trying to trade him” they had a poor view on his value . I still maintain it is unlikely he gets traded unless the Cavs really back down thier expectations in a return . The posters on here that expect a package for atop 20 player in his prime in my opinion are living in a theme park in Orlando. I don’t see a love trade any time soon.
 
The thing is there is a huge ocean between what the Cavs want for him and what other teams are willing to give. Hence I said” if they were trying to trade him” they had a poor view on his value . I still maintain it is unlikely he gets traded unless the Cavs really back down thier expectations in a return . The posters on here that expect a package for atop 20 player in his prime in my opinion are living in a theme park in Orlando. I don’t see a love trade any time soon.

I took your previous post as a criticism of Altman for failing to trade Love this offseason. If that was not your intention, my mistake. I've been consistent since the toe surgery on Love: Without a doubt my biggest hurdle in getting behind a Love trade in the past calendar year is "selling low". The Cavs tanked 2/3rds of the year which expedited the surgery. Terrible time to shop Love, if you are a believer in "selling high".
 
If the Cavs wanted to trade love this summer it seems like they def miscalculated his value. This is something Altman seems to be struggling with ( knowing the market) Perfect example is the JR Smith situation.

I tend to agree. I think Love made a soft trade demand (ie a request to be moved to a contender). However, just as they overestimated the value of JR’s contract, they seem to have overestimated Love’s value. I think he will be moved eventually, once they come to grips with how the league views & values Love. In a league that values cap flexibility, Love’s contract, along with his injury history, will not make him easy to move, at least for what the Cavs are looking for in return.
 

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