2019 NFL Regular Season Thread

AZ_ said:

Zero percent chance you even bothered to check where the stats came from, so there is nothing to gain by conversing with you here.

Both of his INTs came during that garbage time, fwiw.

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Ok then don’t reply? For someone who thinks they’re so smart you make a lot of claims that are obviously false.

his last touchdown was a 50 yard pass with 47 seconds left in the game down 25. Know how I knew that? Because I checked before I replied to you. Man that 0% was such an iron clad lock too

The Wizard of Moz said:

Ok then don’t reply? For someone who thinks they’re so smart you make a lot of claims that are obviously false.

his last touchdown was a 50 yard pass with 47 seconds left in the game down 25. Know how I knew that? Because I checked before I replied to you. Man that 0% was such an iron clad lock too

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So he had 200 yards and 2TD before garbage time?

I suppose you think this helped you make a point but...yeah.

Lamar is good.

Jackson is Michael Vick....
...in an alternate reality where the Atlanta Falcons had someone better than Dan Reeves and a front office ran by one of the greatest of all time.

Jack Brickman said:

Division games have a tendency to be wonky. The Falcons pasted the Saints and Panthers in back to back weeks, then got waxed by the Bucs. You never know what is going to happen.

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Any given Sunday

Jack Brickman said:

We didn't just beat them. We curb stomped them.

And it makes no goddamn sense.

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We have the blueprint to beat Baltimore, I'm not surprised at all we won game one and I was talking crazy shit to my Ravens fan neighbor all week.

You essentially need to have 4 guys on the line able to control the line of scrimmage well enough to keep offensive lineman from blocking downfield while having 7 guys behind them who are able to anticipate and react quickly to whether they need to drop into coverage or converge on Lamar on "pass" plays. It was very similar to how the Chargers played them in the playoffs last year, we just had better personnel to do it. At full health, our defense is a handful for them. Myles, Richardson, Ogunjobi, and Vernon are a tough assignment for any offensive line and Schobert/Wilson are good in coverage and can fly around in open space. Ward and Greedy are good in coverage and pretty decent in run support and playing 3 safeties provides a good mix of run support and coverage ability. Essentially you can honor the pass and still contain Lamar's running on passing plays that break down. What you concede with this strategy is letting Mark Ingram pick up decent yards in run formations. He didn't get the ball a lot in game 1 as they were behind early and forced to pass more than they like to, but when he did get carries he was pretty effective. Since we were able to put up some points on them this strategy was effective as Lamar isn't leading any comebacks with his arm.

The problem I see with game 2 is how much different our defensive personnel will be due to suspension and injuries and how that will impact our ability to pull off a similar strategy to one we employed in the first game. We won't have Myles for sure and Vernon has been banged up, hopefully he'll play. If we're going to see a significant amount of snaps from guys like Bryan Cox and Eli Ankou on the line, that worries me. Joe Schobert and Mack Wilson will be huge for us against the Ravens with their ability to cover and get sideline to sideline if the defensive line can control the trenches. But given the woes we have right now on the defensive line, I'm not confident as neither of these guys excels at shedding blocks from offensive lineman. If they don't get freedom, I expect Lamar to gash us repeatedly. We will have Ward and Greedy healthy this time, hopefully, which will help limit any passing attack the Ravens attempt to get going. I'm very concerned about our safeties though, the loss of Morgan Burnett is huge against the Ravens as his skill set is ideal against them and he was playing well. We're gonna need better games out of Demarious Randall, Justin Burris, and Sheldrick Redwine (yikes) than we've seen this year, and we don't know if Eric Murray will be back and I don't actually know if I want him back to be honest.

If Baltimore's defense can keep our offense in check there's just no way I see us winning this game. We're too depleted on defense with guys that are useful against what Baltimore tries to do on offense. We can scheme extremely well for Lamar and the Ravens and still get gashed by just lacking the personnel to pull it off. I think that's where we're at right now. We're going to have to put up some big points early and force them to pass, and let Ingram do his thing. But I think I'll remain quiet this time and maybe not put a Browns flag up next to the fence...

You guys remember when Jared Goff was proclaimed as elite?

AZ_ said:

So he had 200 yards and 2TD before garbage time?

I suppose you think this helped you make a point but...yeah.

Lamar is good.

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You fixated on such a small part of my post that didn’t even get at the main point. Go back and read the exchange. It was just combating the point that he was cold when we played him.
It’s hilarious how hard you go to bat for Lamar. You’ll make excuses for him you wouldn’t dare make for baker. Like you actually hyped him predraft or something. You didn’t.

he played poorly against the Browns. They put up 18 points if you don’t count garbage time and if you do he had 2 picks

you just ignore any and all context with Lamar and just throw out stats but if ANYONE does that with Baker you immediately get on them about the situation. You’re smart enough to know better so it’s just dishonest.

And there you go being dishonest and arguing in bad faith again. He didn’t have 200 yards and 2 touchdowns before garbage time (I’m sure you knew this)

he had 94 yards passing on his last drive.He had 21 yards passing on his drive with his first interception (which, by your standard was garbage time)

so before garbage time he had 132 yards and 2 touchdowns. On 24 attempts. 5.5 Y/A

to anyone else that’s a poor start. Even to you it is. Except when you’re arguing in bad faith which is often the case when you talk about Lamar

The Wizard of Moz said:

You fixated on such a small part of my post that didn’t even get at the main point. Go back and read the exchange. It was just combating the point that he was cold when we played him.
It’s hilarious how hard you go to bat for Lamar. You’ll make excuses for him you wouldn’t dare make for baker. Like you actually hyped him predraft or something. You didn’t.

he played poorly against the Browns. They put up 18 points if you don’t count garbage time and if you do he had 2 picks

you just ignore any and all context with Lamar and just throw out stats but if ANYONE does that with Baker you immediately get on them about the situation. You’re smart enough to know better so it’s just dishonest.

And there you go being dishonest and arguing in bad faith again. He didn’t have 200 yards and 2 touchdowns before garbage time (I’m sure you knew this)

he had 94 yards passing on his last drive.He had 21 yards passing on his drive with his first interception (which, by your standard was garbage time)

so before garbage time he had 132 yards and 2 touchdowns. On 24 attempts. 5.5 Y/A

to anyone else that’s a poor start. Even to you it is. Except when you’re arguing in bad faith which is often the case when you talk about Lamar

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I appreciate you telling me about bad faith arguments in a thread in which I've said this was the Browns best performance of the season.

But hey, you know, keep on keepin on....

Triplethreat said:

You guys remember when Jared Goff was proclaimed as elite?

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You mean when he nearly won a Super Bowl and finished around the top of every major statistical category?

Sure, its a shame he's regressed to the level of Baker Mayfield, but that's really for a multitude of reasons which folks like you won't make the same excuses for.

Including the Ravens themselves.

To me it's fucking lame to dickride him and go "I told you so.". I again, wanted him, liked his style of play in college. We didn't get him. He plays for a team I completely and utterly despise.

I would take no joy in celebrating his success much in the way that if James Washington Jr. is successful. (another player I liked in college). It blows. I have to deal with the one of the most obnoxious fanbases rub this in everyone's face while they do their whole "YOU KNOW ART SHOULD BE IN THE HALL" song and dance due to their continued relevance.

It's annoying.

Triple-S said:

Including the Ravens themselves.

To me it's fucking lame to dickride him and go "I told you so.". I again, wanted him, liked his style of play in college. We didn't get him. He plays for a team I completely and utterly despise.

I would take no joy in celebrating his success much in the way that if James Washington Jr. is successful. (another player I liked in college). It blows. I have to deal with the one of the most obnoxious fanbases rub this in everyone's face while they do their whole "YOU KNOW ART SHOULD BE IN THE HALL" song and dance due to their continued relevance.

It's annoying.

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Certainly no more annoying than people calling him a WR because he's a black, athletic QB that doesn't jive with the standard football cliche of what people think a QB should be.

I liked Lamar as well as a development prospect...

But the problem with the "I told you so" folks is that Lamar's success and progression is very situational. He landed in the perfect organization for him with rock solid coaching.

Other organizations with a near-term need at QB that would also potentially be capable of unleashing his potential like the Ravens have so far: Pittsburgh, New England

In hindsight with Trubisky's implosion you could MAYBE add Chicago to that list only because I respect Nagy's offensive ability. But that's hindsight...Trubisky seemed like an adequate QB last season.

Most other teams with needs at QBs would have completely botched the Lamar Jackson project including Cleveland, New York(s), Cincinnati, Denver, Washington, and others. That's obviously an indictment on these organizations, but not all franchises are created equal. That's simply something you have to take into account.

This is my opinion, of course. But I'm extremely confident in it.

chrisrich91 said:

I liked Lamar as well as a development prospect...

But the problem with the "I told you so" folks is that Lamar's success and progression is very situational. He landed in the perfect organization for him with rock solid coaching.

Other organizations with a near-term need at QB that would also potentially be capable of unleashing his potential like the Ravens have so far: Pittsburgh, New England

In hindsight with Trubisky's implosion you could MAYBE add Chicago to that list only because I respect Nagy's offensive ability. But that's hindsight...Trubisky seemed like an adequate QB last season.

Most other teams with needs at QBs would have completely botched the Lamar Jackson project including Cleveland, New York(s), Cincinnati, Denver, Washington, and others. That's obviously an indictment on these organizations, but not all franchises are created equal. That's simply something you have to take into account.

This is my opinion, of course. But I'm extremely confident in it.

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Its not a secret or hidden advantage that bad teams don't develop talent.

Shitty organizational structure is what it is. Some guys, like Trubisky, just aren't talented enough (who was still bad last year).

Lamar is good. And yes, he does have an advantage of being drafted into a team who has historically developed talent at an acceptable level.


They're good at drafting TALENT that fits what their coaching staff aims to do.

AZ_ said:

Its not a secret or hidden advantage that bad teams don't develop talent.

Shitty organizational structure is what it is. Some guys, like Trubisky, just aren't talented enough (who was still bad last year).

Lamar is good. And yes, he does have an advantage of being drafted into a team who has historically developed talent at an acceptable level.


They're good at drafting TALENT that fits what their coaching staff aims to do.

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Absolutely. But it's also a little more than that in the case of Jackson, imo. The last few years have shown a new direction for the NFL that could potentially unlock a new crop of college QBs that are now "NFL-viable".

But it takes really good organizations who are ahead of the curve to pioneer changes like that.

Unfortunately beating my head against a wall wishing the Browns were one of those organizations is futile. A more realistic short term goal is for Cleveland to simply become non-self destructive.

My only beef is with fans who say "I told you the Browns should have taken Lamar". Hell no they shouldn't have.

But if you're of the opinion "I told you Lamar could be good", no qualms. Same here, actually.

chrisrich91 said:

Absolutely. But it's also a little more than that in the case of Jackson, imo. The last few years have shown a new direction for the NFL that could potentially unlock a new crop of college QBs that are now "NFL-viable".

But it takes really good organizations who are ahead of the curve to pioneer changes like that.

Unfortunately beating my head against a wall wishing the Browns were one of those organizations is futile. A more realistic short term goal is for Cleveland to simply become non-self destructive.

My only beef is with fans who say "I told you the Browns should have taken Lamar". Hell no they shouldn't have.

But if you're of the opinion "I told you Lamar could be good", no qualms. Same here, actually.

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These guys were on the verge of losing their jobs under Joe Flacco, and ushered out a Super Bowl winning QB because they couldn't make it work.

Its not like their system is plug and play for just any average QB.

That's like saying take Andy Reid away from Patrick Mahomes and he'd be a JAG, that's not fair to the superior talent each brings. Blended together is when you get greatness, and that shouldn't be used as a "Yeah but..." when trying to knock a great QB.

But we're on the same page, Cleveland just isn't there yet in this regard....

Its a frustrating reality to deal with in the midst of a season which presented some hope for change. Even if they're able to win out or slide into that last post-season slot, this team doesn't exactly exude any confidence of being able to take a step into the tier of top organizations.

But at least its not a step backward, so for the first time in a while, there may actually be some shred of hope.