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2021 Draft Prospects Thread

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People are underestimating how good Phillips can be.

He's not even 22 until next season.

I agree. He looked better when played MLB too for that one game. I think he is our future MLB maybe as early as next year. I think we need to take a day 2 OLB, and day 1 DE, but that is my opinion. Where do you see Phillips playing inside or out?
 
He could definitely play that left defensive end role. Woods liked dropping Gustin and Vernon back in coverage in blitz packages.

He is a blur off the edge, but I'm most impressed with his skills as a spy linebacker who suddenly attacks on a delayed blitz. I see him as the Browns answer to Lamar Jackson in the way he controls the middle of the field in all three phases - delayed blitz, shutting down rushing QBs, dropping back in zone.

He can set an egde, also.

Will have a few more pounds to add, but to me he looks like a longer, lankier Adalius Thomas.
 
He can set an egde, also.

Will have a few more pounds to add, but to me he looks like a longer, lankier Adalius Thomas.

The more I watch, the less likely he seems to be there at #26. This is a bad draft for edge help, and the only knock I'm coming up with is his level of competition.
 
I understand the logic behind not ascribing value at LB, but when the defense is as riddled with holes as is the case, isn’t there an argument to be made for just plugging one of the most obvious holes with the best plug available?

I think with a first round pick, the biggest consideration is positional value.

Sometimes positional value and board align, like last year.......but if they don't, I really think it is a huge missed opportunity from a team building standpoint if you merely chase a need.

The cap realities start to kick in in a few years (with a franchise QB, CB and DE already here) and anything you can do to mitigate those largely determines how long your window stays open.

For example chasing LB need via reaching......and potentially passing on a situation like Dallas had last year, where they took Lamb and have a borderline #1 receiver for 4 years, at $3.5 million per year, is really a tough sell for me.

What the Browns really need to balance is effectively plugging holes like LB in the most economical way possible (with the Goodsen's, etc of the world) and then having an eye on the future and a plan for how we cycle out expensive positional contracts in favor of players capable of being high performers on rookie deals.

I like a player like Collins, who has EDGE flexibility......as that is an inherently expensive position in free agency. With Myles already here, there's just less to go around on the front, so that makes sense to me (as to why we would like him).

The guys who make a lot less sense to me are pure LB prospects at #26. I just don't see the value relative to say, a corner at that same spot. I'd rather over pay a little in the short term for certainty at LB and spend draft capital on positions that are more expensive to acquire by other means.
 
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I'm by no means an expert on draft value and the workings of the NFL salary cap, so I'm interested in everyone's opinion.

The Browns window for contention is open now. My thought being, lets load up on talent to help us win in the next couple years. What are the chances, value, and implications of trying to buy a late first or second rounder using future picks?

For example, there are a few teams (notably NO, PHI, ATL, GB, HOU, LAR, etc. **) that are in cap hell and may (?) be interested in punting picks into the future. Would you be willing to trade a future 1st or 2nd for a 1st or 2nd now if there is a guy we love that falls to the right spot?

What is the general cost? Would a late first this year cost just a 1st next year? If so, I'd probably make that move hoping we're trading a late first for a late first.



** Don't quote me on these team's salary cap situation, I have no idea how this shit works. I'm just reading that they're all way above the cap.
 
I'm by no means an expert on draft value and the workings of the NFL salary cap, so I'm interested in everyone's opinion.

The Browns window for contention is open now. My thought being, lets load up on talent to help us win in the next couple years. What are the chances, value, and implications of trying to buy a late first or second rounder using future picks?

For example, there are a few teams (notably NO, PHI, ATL, GB, HOU, LAR, etc. **) that are in cap hell and may (?) be interested in punting picks into the future. Would you be willing to trade a future 1st or 2nd for a 1st or 2nd now if there is a guy we love that falls to the right spot?

What is the general cost? Would a late first this year cost just a 1st next year? If so, I'd probably make that move hoping we're trading a late first for a late first.



** Don't quote me on these team's salary cap situation, I have no idea how this shit works. I'm just reading that they're all way above the cap.
My instinct is actually to do the opposite: trade down, acquire more picks in rounds 2/3 to fill out our roster cheaply going forward, because the extensions of Baker, Ward, Chubb, Teller are gonna be expensive. Even contracts like Goodson and Sendejo and Joseph are gonna be too expensive as depth pieces moving forward.

edit - to expound on your point though, a team trading down from the 1st to the 2nd isn't going to do much to save them from current cap problems. Cutting/restructuring current contracts is how you do that.

double edit - your strategy would work better for a team that is near the cap. Maybe a team like Baltimore after they re-sign Ngakoue. Saving a couple 100k might make a big difference to them.
 
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Trade down those high-priced draft picks, cut out entire position groups, scour the waiver wire, coach up retreads.
Basically, we're the Patriots now.
 
My instinct is actually to do the opposite: trade down, acquire more picks in rounds 2/3 to fill out our roster cheaply going forward, because the extensions of Baker, Ward, Chubb, Teller are gonna be expensive. Even contracts like Goodson and Sendejo and Joseph are gonna be too expensive as depth pieces moving forward.

edit - to expound on your point though, a team trading down from the 1st to the 2nd isn't going to do much to save them from current cap problems. Cutting/restructuring current contracts is how you do that.

The cap hit for the 26th pick in 2020 was 2.25 million, Jordan Love to the Packers. That's a pretty good deal, as long as you draft a player who will project as a starter.

Maybe the Browns will trade down, but the cap hit shouldn't be the motivating factor. If they think somebody can hold down a starting defensive spot for 80+ percent of the snaps, take him.
 
The cap hit for the 26th pick in 2020 was 2.25 million, Jordan Love to the Packers. That's a pretty good deal, as long as you draft a player who will project as a starter.

Maybe the Browns will trade down, but the cap hit shouldn't be the motivating factor. If they think somebody can hold down a starting defensive spot for 80+ percent of the snaps, take him.
Might be more of a quantity thing as well. Instead, for example, of a 2nd rounder and a vet as backups, trade down for 2 3rds, and those 2 3rds make a lot less than a 2nd and a vet. Or, at least a lot for a team that is starting to get squeezed.
 

Werner is the type of player the Browns should be looking for. Fast, great in coverage and a good tackler.

So who is a better pro in your opinion, Werner or Browning?
 
My instinct is actually to do the opposite: trade down, acquire more picks in rounds 2/3 to fill out our roster cheaply going forward, because the extensions of Baker, Ward, Chubb, Teller are gonna be expensive. Even contracts like Goodson and Sendejo and Joseph are gonna be too expensive as depth pieces moving forward.

edit - to expound on your point though, a team trading down from the 1st to the 2nd isn't going to do much to save them from current cap problems. Cutting/restructuring current contracts is how you do that.

So, probably not much of a market for it - makes sense.

Obviously it's a different beast, but I was thinking along the lines of how NBA teams are often willing to sell a late first for future picks.

The whole LeBron era gave me a passable understanding of NBA cap economics. I've not had a good enough reason to read up on the NFL and MLB, but they seem overwhelming (maybe not once you get into it).

I appreciate the insight. Despite us being eliminated, as a consolation, I'm enjoying reading these threads, and I'm really looking forward to how we build for next year.
 
So, probably not much of a market for it - makes sense.

Obviously it's a different beast, but I was thinking along the lines of how NBA teams are often willing to sell a late first for future picks.

The whole LeBron era gave me a passable understanding of NBA cap economics. I've not had a good enough reason to read up on the NFL and MLB, but they seem overwhelming (maybe not once you get into it).

I appreciate the insight. Despite us being eliminated, as a consolation, I'm enjoying reading these threads, and I'm really looking forward to how we build for next year.
Biggest difference between NBA and NFL salary cap stuff

In the NBA, most of the money on a contract is guaranteed, and usually the only way to get rid of a contract is to trade the player.

In the NFL, there's a lot less guaranteed money. A team always has players they can cut to save a good chunk of money.
 
The cap hit for the 26th pick in 2020 was 2.25 million, Jordan Love to the Packers. That's a pretty good deal, as long as you draft a player who will project as a starter.

Maybe the Browns will trade down, but the cap hit shouldn't be the motivating factor. If they think somebody can hold down a starting defensive spot for 80+ percent of the snaps, take him.

I agree.

It isn't a great deal for all positions......but for a premium position, that really is a sweet spot. The Browns have landed in that zone where a few guys unexpectedly slide every year. And if it is a corner, edge or even a swing tackle, getting a player who projects as a starter on that kind of money, at an expensive position, is a huge win from a cap standpoint.

If the Browns want a LB or even a safety in that range, I personally would advocate for trading back. Just acquire more picks that can be used for cheap developmental depth and then address those need positions like safety, where it is potentially a better value relative to the available talent.
 

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