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2023 Guardians Offseason Thread!

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How Do You Feel About the 2022 Season?

  • Ended too soon!

    Votes: 8 8.9%

  • Great job! The Boys did good!

    Votes: 45 50.0%

  • Good start and promising future

    Votes: 26 28.9%

  • Lousy Bums choked!

    Votes: 1 1.1%

  • Meh, regression coming

    Votes: 3 3.3%

  • Gonna go all the way next year!

    Votes: 2 2.2%

  • Herbert Perry

    Votes: 5 5.6%
  • Total voters
    90
petes999 said:
Another way to read the tea leaves is they may just think highly of Noel but want to give him a 1-2 years to finalize his development. Thus, just like pitching, a Walker on 2 year remaining contract works, but a Yepez or other with 4+ years may just be blocking the prospects that they are really interested in. They are not going after a 4+ yr vs 2 yr pitcher due to costs ... maybe the same is here.
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There are no tea leaves here.

They've got to wade through Naylor, Arias, Brennan, Benson, Freeman, Rocchio, Lavastida, Noel, Tena, Palacios, and Valera in the next 2 seasons. Some of those names may be scratched off this winter, but it's not a guarantee and that's more than 1/4th of your 40 man. And no one in that front office should be 100% sold on Gonzalez and big Naylor either. Adding another unproven name to that group, while trying to compete, makes little sense when it comes to roster building at this stage.

I get the obsession with wanting to stock your roster full of young, team-controlled talents you think will blossom into something. But you can only fit so many of those on your roster while you are trying to also compete for a World Series.

Also, it's great if you are interested in trading for a player. The team they are on has to be open to trading said player though. From all accounts, St Louis isn't looking to move him just yet. They anticipate him helping to replace some of Pujols' missing production from the lineup heading into 2023.
 
If possible, I would like to see them move a few MIFs for guys at other spots even if they are just AA prospect for AA prospect deals. It feels like the balance could be better.
 
BimboColesHair said:
There are no tea leaves here.

They've got to wade through Naylor, Arias, Brennan, Benson, Freeman, Rocchio, Lavastida, Noel, Tena, Palacios, and Valera in the next 2 seasons. Some of those names may be scratched off this winter, but it's not a guarantee and that's more than 1/4th of your 40 man. And no one in that front office should be 100% sold on Gonzalez and big Naylor either. Adding another unproven name to that group, while trying to compete, makes little sense when it comes to roster building at this stage.

I get the obsession with wanting to stock your roster full of young, team-controlled talents you think will blossom into something. But you can only fit so many of those on your roster while you are trying to also compete for a World Series.

Also, it's great if you are interested in trading for a player. The team they are on has to be open to trading said player though. From all accounts, St Louis isn't looking to move him just yet. They anticipate him helping to replace some of Pujols' missing production from the lineup heading into 2023.
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As long as Kwan is playing, how could we continue to keep Palacios on the 40 man for much longer? I have always liked him, but as of now he is blocked as he can get. I don't think Kwan in RF is an answer and we probably won't see him in CF until Straw, Brennan and even Benson have been exhausted. Just too much in Richie's way as a LF only to force himself into the mix IMO and I also was surprisingly unimpressed in his SSS this season.

We might just end up selling/PTBNL'ing Palacios IMO. Not a giveaway/Bauers trade either, decent cash or lotto I think.

I like Noel and think his stock could skyrocket next season.. Thought that could happen this year too though. I think I try to keep him or attach a premium in a trade. He won't break a trade for Walker/Murphy.. Obviously the whole package would need to be considered...

I know Lavastida was injured and chewed up a bit in 2022, but he definitely took a dip based on previous results at least at the plate. Also he doesn't seem to throw out runners well (20% in 2022) and had 11 PBs in 76 games.. Hedgie had like what, 2 all year? Were injuries his undoing in 2022? If not, tick tick tick on that 40 man spot.
 
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Criznit said:
As long as Kwan is playing, how could we continue to keep Palacios on the 40 man for much longer? I have always liked him, but as of now he is blocked as he can get. I don't think Kwan in RF is an answer and we probably won't see him in CF until Straw, Brennan and even Benson have been exhausted. Just too much in Richie's way as a LF only to force himself into the mix IMO and I also was surprisingly unimpressed in his SSS this season.

We might just end up selling/PTBNL'ing Palacios IMO. Not a giveaway/Bauers trade either, decent cash or lotto I think.

I like Noel and think his stock could skyrocket next season.. Thought that could happen this year too though. I think I try to keep him or attach a premium in a trade. He won't break a trade for Walker/Murphy.. Obviously the whole package would need to be considered...

I know Lavastida was injured and chewed up a bit in 2022, but he definitely took a dip based on previous results at least at the plate. Also he doesn't seem to throw out runners well (20% in 2022) and had 11 PBs in 76 games.. Hedgie had like what, 2 all year? Were injuries his undoing in 2022? If not, tick tick tick on that 40 man spot.
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with the FA and trade market all but void of ML CF'ers (not RF/LF'ers moved to cover a spot, temporarily).. any one of those three guys can be dealt.. We would prefer to keep at least two, but it comes down to:

If a CF'er (one of these three) is sent away (one for one.. part of a larger deal).. Does the return to the Guardians make them better now and into the future in the aggregate.. IOW.. Straw can be traded if it's believed by CleFO that Brennan/Benson/Kwan plus the return for Straw makes the club better.. Brennan's ability to put the bat on the ball.. along with growing confidence and power makes him a ready replacement... An approach like this works.. The statement that the CleFO has signed a guy to a long term deal equates to he's untouchable in trade.. is wrong, again and there's a LOT of lame excuses why something doesn't happen.. until it does....

IDK what to tell you about Palacios.. tries to hard.. fails too often.. needs more chances.. sort of a conflict in and of itself..

Lavas may have a bounce back..he desperately needs it..

Thoughts..
 
Gson said:
with the FA and trade market all but void of ML CF'ers (not RF/LF'ers moved to cover a spot, temporarily).. any one of those three guys can be dealt.. We would prefer to keep at least two, but it comes down to:

If a CF'er (one of these three) is sent away (one for one.. part of a larger deal).. Does the return to the Guardians make them better now and into the future in the aggregate.. IOW.. Straw can be traded if it's believed by CleFO that Brennan/Benson/Kwan plus the return for Straw makes the club better.. Brennan's ability to put the bat on the ball.. along with growing confidence and power makes him a ready replacement... An approach like this works.. The statement that the CleFO has signed a guy to a long term deal equates to he's untouchable in trade.. is wrong, again and there's a LOT of lame excuses why something doesn't happen.. until it does....

IDK what to tell you about Palacios.. tries to hard.. fails too often.. needs more chances.. sort of a conflict in and of itself..

Lavas may have a bounce back..he desperately needs it..

Thoughts..
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I really doubt Straw is going anywhere... We are going to be stuck with him until at least the trade deadline if not way longer... Benson wouldn't be worth anything in a trade and no way Kwan is going anywhere. Brennan likely isn't going anywhere as well...
 
sportscoach said:
I really doubt Straw is going anywhere... We are going to be stuck with him until at least the trade deadline if not way longer... Benson wouldn't be worth anything in a trade and no way Kwan is going anywhere. Brennan likely isn't going anywhere as well...
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doubt all you want.. the comment is valid..
 
sportscoach said:
I really doubt Straw is going anywhere... We are going to be stuck with him until at least the trade deadline if not way longer... Benson wouldn't be worth anything in a trade and no way Kwan is going anywhere. Brennan likely isn't going anywhere as well...
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We'll listen but they'll all likely stay for now, though Brennan is a good trade chip. Benson could very well be a GG at 3 if not 4 positions, runs well, has pop and cheap. Basically his toolbox is still full enough to still be worth something. He's worth as much/more than Palacios.

An internal outfield of Straw, Kwan, Ogonz, Brennan and Benson for 2023 is more than acceptable for me, though if you want to add a thumper to the RF mix, I won't complain. That leaves Valera, Noel amongst others on deck, and that works pretty well.

And back to my original point in regards to Palacios - he doesn't really fit in that mix unless it's Kwan taking the hit. Days should be numbered, not squandered... Wonder where he'll (Richie) ends up.
 
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Gson said:
Gabriel Arias?

Josh Naylor?

Jhonkensy Noel? If half the season shows results/performance that is unacceptable?

then.. after the above is given appropriate consideration (3 guys play, don't play, are deemed not ready for prime time).. then, and only then.. will resources be expended to fill the perceived or real hole..

If Jose Abreu says I'll take a 3 year Jose Contract.. he might alter this thinking?.. There are other 1B's who could be in similar circumstances that CleFO can exploit..
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Naylor is currently this team's 1B already.

It's just my preference, but I don't want to see Arias or Miller at 1B anymore. Arias' value will come from being a slick fielding SS with a power bat(for the position).

I'm not confident in Abreu's bat being as powerful as it once was so I'd rather go young instead of signing him. Now, if they want to pursue someone like Walker then count me in.
petes999 said:
Another way to read the tea leaves is they may just think highly of Noel but want to give him a 1-2 years to finalize his development. Thus, just like pitching, a Walker on 2 year remaining contract works, but a Yepez or other with 4+ years may just be blocking the prospects that they are really interested in. They are not going after a 4+ yr vs 2 yr pitcher due to costs ... maybe the same is here.
Click to expand...
He's probably 2 yrs away at least, and further if he doesn't cut down his swings and misses. We have plenty of discussions here talking about prospects that are likely to bust. He screams it to me, but what the hell do I know.
 
Is everyone here good with an OF consisting of Kwan, Straw and OGon? If so, who gets the 4th OFer role, Brennan or Benson?

The biggest needs now are a part time C and 1B/DH. Seems to me a trade with the Dbacks could resolve both if they're open to such a deal. The deal could even expand to add a veteran SP. What would Kelly, Kelly and Walker cost?
 
CDAV45 said:
Is everyone here good with an OF consisting of Kwan, Straw and OGon? If so, who gets the 4th OFer role, Brennan or Benson?

The biggest needs now are a part time C and 1B/DH. Seems to me a trade with the Dbacks could resolve both if they're open to such a deal. The deal could even expand to add a veteran SP. What would Kelly, Kelly and Walker cost?
Click to expand...
With DH wide open I don't think an acquisition means the end of ABs for any of these guys. One would hope the team could find a way to give the BBs (Benson and Brennan) a good chance while making Straw into the outstanding 4th OFer we all know he can be. Also, Oscar rose to the challenge last year after being written off, I don't think he wilts in spring training if he has veiled 'competition'.
 
CDAV45 said:
Is everyone here good with an OF consisting of Kwan, Straw and OGon? If so, who gets the 4th OFer role, Brennan or Benson?

The biggest needs now are a part time C and 1B/DH. Seems to me a trade with the Dbacks could resolve both if they're open to such a deal. The deal could even expand to add a veteran SP. What would Kelly, Kelly and Walker cost?
Click to expand...
We'll have a 5 OFer mix next year IMO, with OGonz seeing time (a lot?) at DH without additions.
It's Kwan, Straw, OGonz on paper with Brennan as your 4th (with an opportunity to take a more primary role) and Benson provides the true bench option.

I really hope Ogonz commits to a program to improve in RF this off-season as it is pretty much RF or DH for him.
 
macbdog said:
With DH wide open I don't think an acquisition means the end of ABs for any of these guys. One would hope the team could find a way to give the BBs (Benson and Brennan) a good chance while making Straw into the outstanding 4th OFer we all know he can be. Also, Oscar rose to the challenge last year after being written off, I don't think he wilts in spring training if he has veiled 'competition'.
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I'd prefer to see Straw in the 4th OFer role. That way he could be a late inning defensive replacement for OGon too. That would make the OF consist of Kwan, Brennan/Benson and Straw. Doesn't get much better than that defensively speaking IMO.

OGon will never win a GG, but all he needs to do is make the routine plays. Well, that and continue to hit as he did. Should his bat slide then his lack of defensive prowess becomes an issue.
 
CDAV45 said:
Naylor is currently this team's 1B already.

It's just my preference, but I don't want to see Arias or Miller at 1B anymore. Arias' value will come from being a slick fielding SS with a power bat(for the position).

I'm not confident in Abreu's bat being as powerful as it once was so I'd rather go young instead of signing him. Now, if they want to pursue someone like Walker then count me in.

He's probably 2 yrs away at least, and further if he doesn't cut down his swings and misses. We have plenty of discussions here talking about prospects that are likely to bust. He screams it to me, but what the hell do I know.
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Naylor is considered the starter.. sure.. but is he set there?.. granite?.. or something a little less permanent?.. Same with Arias.. He's limited as far as rosterbation.. so he has to find more than just a single preferred spot (SS). That could be 3B for days off for JRam.. 1B.. because he can.. etc..

As far as Miller goes.. you, more than anyone else on this forum sang his praises as a hitter first.. Well, he's no Greg Nettles with the leather.. but, given the right circumstances, he's shown, in streaks he can hit.. More of those circumstances need to be engineered so that Miller can contribute.. Also, Miller was bad learning 1B.. and no savant at 2B.. he won't ever be that bad again.. At least I can dream on it..

Abreu is the most unlikely scenario.. so, we don't really disagree there.. but, there is that pet peeve: the idiotic unsupportable statement regarding the absolute zero chance of something happening or not happening.. without actually knowing.. sad when it has to be repeated again..
 
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