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2023 Season | Series #24 | A's @ Guardians | June 20-22, 2023

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DCTribefan said:
Is getting swept by a vastly superior team in the playoffs really the endgame?
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The end game in my mind is always winning the division and being healthy come playoff time. At that point, anything can happen.

The Indians were the vastly superior team in 2017 and it meant nothing. Baseball is too random, too unpredictable, and too wild to predict series far out in the future or have confidence in what will happen over a given 3, 5 or 7 games.
 
22 game win streak for what... sigh

Bullpen better get in gear though.
 
Cassity14 said:
The end game in my mind is always winning the division and being healthy come playoff time. At that point, anything can happen.

The Indians were the vastly superior team in 2017 and it meant nothing. Baseball is too random, too unpredictable, and too wild to predict series far out in the future or have confidence in what will happen over a given 3, 5 or 7 games.
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You seriously can't say with a straight face this team is a World Series contender. Whether we end up winning the division or not, we won't stand a chance to make noise.
 
33Y0 said:
You seriously can't say with a straight face this team is a World Series contender. Whether we end up winning the division or not, we won't stand a chance to make noise.
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I didn’t say they were or weren’t. I just said that personally, my end game is always winning the division and seeing where things fall once that happens.

Seeing as the Guardians are not even in first place and it’s merely June, I have no idea where you got the idea that I said they’re a World Series contender from.
 
Cassity14 said:
I didn’t say they were or weren’t. I just said that personally, my end game is always winning the division and seeing where things fall once that happens.

Seeing as the Guardians are not even in first place and it’s merely June, I have no idea where you got the idea that I said they’re a World Series contender from.
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"At that point, anything can happen."
 
33Y0 said:
"At that point, anything can happen."
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Yeah man, those words don’t include World Series contender at all and the word end game doesn’t apply to a June baseball team.

I’d ask you to reply to the words actually typed than argue against a straw man you haphazardly built yourself, but that’s often too much for the Indians section. I’ll go back to lurking.
 
Cassity14 said:
Yeah man, those words don’t include World Series contender at all and the word end game doesn’t apply to a June baseball team.

I’d ask you to reply to the words actually typed than argue against a straw man you haphazardly built yourself, but that’s often too much for the Indians section. I’ll go back to lurking.
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You literally typed the words yourself. What do you think that implies?
 
33Y0 said:
You seriously can't say with a straight face this team is a World Series contender. Whether we end up winning the division or not, we won't stand a chance to make noise.
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I'll say it seriously, any team that wins a division is a World Series contender. Not only because of the randomness of baseball but by per definition once you're in you have X more wins to get and you're in the World Series, hence contender...not favorites, maybe not likely but 100% contender. The 97 Indians were probably the worst of those great teams and they got the closet to winning the whole damn thing of all of them.
 
smalls1129 said:
I'll say it seriously, any team that wins a division is a World Series contender. Not only because of the randomness of baseball but by per definition once you're in you have X more wins to get and you're in the World Series, hence contender...not favorites, maybe not likely but 100% contender. The 97 Indians were probably the worst of those great teams and they got the closet to winning the whole damn thing of all of them.
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Few differences with the '97 team..

1. They still finished 9 games above .500.
2a. They also still had the likes of Hall of Famer Jim Thome, borderline Hall of Famer Omar Vizquel, should be Hall of Famer Manny Ramirez, as well as David Justice, Matt Williams, Sandy Alomar Jr., Tony Fernandez, and others in that lineup.
2b. The Indians in 97 ranked 4th in MLB in BA, 2nd in OBP, 3rd in SLG, 3rd in OPS, 3rd in HR, and 4th in R. Contrast that with this year's team... 16th in BA, 22nd in OBP, 28th in SLG, 25th in OPS, 30th in HR, and 27th in R.
 
33Y0 said:
Few differences with the '97 team..

1. They still finished 9 games above .500.
2a. They also still had the likes of Hall of Famer Jim Thome, borderline Hall of Famer Omar Vizquel, should be Hall of Famer Manny Ramirez, as well as David Justice, Matt Williams, Sandy Alomar Jr., Tony Fernandez, and others in that lineup.
2b. The Indians in 97 ranked 4th in MLB in BA, 2nd in OBP, 3rd in SLG, 3rd in OPS, 3rd in HR, and 4th in R. Contrast that with this year's team... 16th in BA, 22nd in OBP, 28th in SLG, 25th in OPS, 30th in HR, and 27th in R.
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Fair enough, my point was dominating the regular season doesn't guarantee anything come post season. Get in and you're a contender.
 
smalls1129 said:
Fair enough, my point was dominating the regular season doesn't guarantee anything come post season. Get in and you're a contender.
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Show me a team that advanced in the playoffs(if one even made it) that matches this team's offensive rankings please. Yes, anything can happen, but I don't think it's as random as you are suggesting. The good news is that we haven't even reached the break yet, we have some fantastic young pitching and we have assets to possibly upgrade this lineup. All is not lost and there is good reason to follow this team. This division is shitty enough that we can win it even if Bieber and a few others are traded. I'm anxious to see what happens.
 
CDAV45 said:
Show me a team that advanced in the playoffs(if one even made it) that matches this team's offensive rankings please. Yes, anything can happen, but I don't think it's as random as you are suggesting. The good news is that we haven't even reached the break yet, we have some fantastic young pitching and we have assets to possibly upgrade this lineup. All is not lost and there is good reason to follow this team. This division is shitty enough that we can win it even if Bieber and a few others are traded. I'm anxious to see what happens.
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I went through the worst teams, by record, according to MLB.com to reach the playoffs and here are how they ranked that year per Baseball Reference:
*Note Wildcard Era

2005 Padres - NLDS Loss

26th R/G, 25th HR, 24th BA, 26th SLG, 22nd OPS

2017 Twins- Wildcard Loss

7th R/G, 16th HR, 9th BA, 11th SLG, 9th OPS

2007 Cubs- NLDS Loss

18th R/G, 20th HR, 13th BA, 15th SLG, 16th OPS

1997 Astros- NLDS Loss

14th R/G, 25th HR, 22nd BA, 22nd SLG, 17th OPS

2006 Cardinals - WS Champs

14th R/G, 12th HR, 15th BA, 15th SLG, 14th OPS

2008 Dodgers- NLCS Loss

23rd R/G, 21st HR, 14th BA, 22nd SLG, 20th OPS

Edit- I went and looked at the 2015 WS and it's an interesting contrast.

KC- W

7th R/G, 23rd HR, 3rd BA, 11th SLG, 10th OPS

NYM- L

17th R/G, 9th HR, 27th BA, 17th SLG, 20th OPS
 
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33Y0 said:
You seriously can't say with a straight face this team is a World Series contender. Whether we end up winning the division or not, we won't stand a chance to make noise.
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It's so much better to wallow in self pity than it is to have any glimmer of optimism. That's how I like to enjoy my sports teams. /s
 
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