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2019 Series #3 | Indians vs. Blue Jays | April 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th

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Complaining about the offense when Stamets is going to turn into Lindor, one of Miller/Moroff is going to turn into Kipnis and one of Naquin/Allen/Luplow is going to turn into Gonzalez within the next couple of weeks is kind of silly.

Yes, the offense is poor right now, but they have at least three guys playing every day right now who most certainly won't even be on the team in the next few weeks. Maybe more than three if guys like Chang, Mercado or Zimmer force their way into the picture.

Looking beyond the offense, you have Clippard who is likely going to replace someone in the pen eventually too, whether it's Ramirez, Otero or Edwards, and that should be an upgrade.

Not to mention the Indians have been buyers at the deadline each of the last three years, bringing on Hand, Cimber, Donaldson in 2018, Smith and Bruce in 2017, Miller and Guyer in 2016.

I just wouldn't stress how the roster looks right now when several changes are clearly on the horizon and many others could be as well.
 
Complaining about the offense when Stamets is going to turn into Lindor, one of Miller/Moroff is going to turn into Kipnis and one of Naquin/Allen/Luplow is going to turn into Gonzalez within the next couple of weeks is kind of silly.

Yes, the offense is poor right now, but they have at least three guys playing every day right now who most certainly won't even be on the team in the next few weeks. Maybe more than three if guys like Chang, Mercado or Zimmer force their way into the picture.

Looking beyond the offense, you have Clippard who is likely going to replace someone in the pen eventually too, whether it's Ramirez, Otero or Edwards, and that should be an upgrade.

Not to mention the Indians have been buyers at the deadline each of the last three years, bringing on Hand, Cimber, Donaldson in 2018, Smith and Bruce in 2017, Miller and Guyer in 2016.

I just wouldn't stress how the roster looks right now when several changes are clearly on the horizon and many others could be as well.

Well, sure. My question about Kipnis was legitimate btw.
 
Dude. How many times must I say. If someone is being an ass, expect it back in kind. Very very simple here.

But it’s done at this point. Like I said, I get it. Cool stuff. I’ll speak more carefully next time.

I don't like the fact that you keep telling yourself that the only reason you're behaving poorly is because someone ELSE behaved poorly first. Stop trying to rationalize your behavior behind some made-up scenario.

1) You started this.
2) It doesn't matter who started anything--hold yourself to some sort of standard.
 
Complaining about the offense when Stamets is going to turn into Lindor, one of Miller/Moroff is going to turn into Kipnis and one of Naquin/Allen/Luplow is going to turn into Gonzalez within the next couple of weeks is kind of silly.

Yes, the offense is poor right now, but they have at least three guys playing every day right now who most certainly won't even be on the team in the next few weeks. Maybe more than three if guys like Chang, Mercado or Zimmer force their way into the picture.

Looking beyond the offense, you have Clippard who is likely going to replace someone in the pen eventually too, whether it's Ramirez, Otero or Edwards, and that should be an upgrade.

Not to mention the Indians have been buyers at the deadline each of the last three years, bringing on Hand, Cimber, Donaldson in 2018, Smith and Bruce in 2017, Miller and Guyer in 2016.

I just wouldn't stress how the roster looks right now when several changes are clearly on the horizon and many others could be as well.

I'm a bit more negative than you right now. I'm worried about Jose regaining form. I'm sure he'll put up some numbers this regular season, but it's possible that there's an effective book out there on how to pitch to him. He seems to struggle with the shift.

I don't think CarGo is going to be an upgrade. I don't think he's ever been very good. I hope he proves me wrong, but we'll see.

I'm not sure Tyler Clippard is going to be anything for us this year.

But, I think we still have a near infinite number of ways to improve the club. I really think we'll see one of Salazar or Cody Anderson in the bullpen by the end of the season. I think Oscar Mercado could come up if need be. I'm excited to get Zimmer back at some point. I think we have a ton of minor league ammo to trade for veterans around the deadline.
 
I don't like the fact that you keep telling yourself that the only reason you're behaving poorly is because someone ELSE behaved poorly first. Stop trying to rationalize your behavior behind some made-up scenario.

1) You started this.
2) It doesn't matter who started anything--hold yourself to some sort of standard.

Nah, I’m good. If AZ wants to act a fool I’ll call him on it. I didn’t start shit. Made a statement he disagreed with.
 
I swear we go through literally the same shit every year in here. And the sad thing about it is this same stuff is going on outside of this board all throughout the fan base. Shit is ass cancer every year.

This Indians group gets no benefit of the doubt in the city, and it's the strangest thing. They've been consistently good for going on 7 years now, are by far the most well run organization from top to bottom in town, and are most likely heading towards their 4th consecutive trip to the playoffs, one shy of what the beloved 90s group was able to do.

But they aren't spoken about in nearly the same light as that group and aren't nearly supported the same as that group was. And that group had the innate flaw of never being able to find competent pitching to go with their lineup, but they are still looked back upon with a twinkle in the eye.

Are they a flawed team right now? Abso-fucking-lutely. Will it stay that way? If their past 3 years at the trade deadline while they know they have a title window have told us anything, no, it won't stay that way. Their front office has even said as much, about utilizing the deadline to plug some holes as being more cost effective than free agency.

But what will it take for this fanbase to legit enjoy this team? Off to their best start under Tito, even after all the consistent bitching on all outlets that cover the team after their offseason and first few games. And it's not like this team hasn't faced bad teams to start their seasons in years past.

When all is said and done, they may roll out the most valued starting pitching rotation in baseball history, a group which may do something no one could ever match in baseball again (all 5 starters with 200+ strikeouts). And that alone could be enough to win a title, never mind their offense.

I'm not singling anyone out here, but holy shit the feelings towards the Indians are weird. They have an all-time position group with their starting rotation, an all-time manager, 2 MVP candidate position players, a great farm system...but half the fanbase seems to be laboring through watching them or supporting them. It literally makes no sense to me.

Take a page out of Dolan's misquoted book and "enjoy them" every once in a while.
 
Nah, I’m good. If AZ wants to act a fool I’ll call him on it. I didn’t start shit. Made a statement he disagreed with.

:conf (5)::conf (5):You realize this forum's posts are displayed in the order they occurred, right?

Even disregarding your hot takes of

I need to see Lindor snd Ramirez at mvp form in this lineup to believe we have any sort of chance.
Yes, I heard this last year before the Tribe got blasted out of the playoffs.
you know the Indians wouldn’t be facing the White Sox and Blue Jays in October.

The first incendiary post I see is

It’d do you well to engage instead of flipping your shit every time somebody isn’t pissing rainbows about the Indians... it’s trigger material for you if it’s uttered here. Stop.
 
Ah yeah, the World Series expectations of a team with, as you put it, remote chances of winning the World Series.

Makes perfect sense. I can't imagine why people think fans are batshit insane with regards to how they view this team.

Go Browns!

I think we have a great chance of winning, pitching is everything plus we are going to replace 3 awful hitters with a MVP level hitter in Lindor and 2 very good hitters a bit past their prime but still good in CarGo and Kipnis.

And we haven't even counted on Zimmer of Salazar, but both could come back in a month or two and really help our team in some capacity.

I know not everyone is high on Carlos, but he hit .276 last year and I cant believe that Coors Field has some magic that he suddenly wont be able to make contact. I get he wont have that type of power away from Coors, but he will still be able to hit about .250 away from Coors. And people keep sleeping on Kipnis, he had one beyond bad first half last year and everyone acts like the guy cant play.

What is really crazy is there is allot to be excited and we will add a hitter this year at trade deadline, we always do.
 
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:conf (5)::conf (5):You realize this forum's posts are displayed in the order they occurred, right?

Even disregarding your hot takes of





The first incendiary post I see is

So quoting someone and saying “Jesus Christ...” is in no way condescending or insulting?

Got it...
 
I think we have a great chance of winning, pitching is everything plus we are going to replace 3 awful hitters with a MVP level hitter in Lindor and 2 very good hitters a bit past their prime but still good in CarGo and Kipnis.

And we haven't even counted on Zimmer of Salazar, but both could come back in a month or two and really help our team in some capacity.

I know not everyone is high on Carlos, but he hit .276 last year and I cant believe that Coors Field has some magic that he suddenly wont be able to make contact. I get he wont have that type of power away from Coors, but he will still be able to hit about .250 away from Coors. And people keep sleeping on Kipnis, he had one beyond bad first half last year and everyone acts like the guy cant play.

What is really crazy is there is allot to be excited and we will add a hitter this year at trade deadline, we always do.

I think everyone's forgetting about Cody Anderson. I really see his stuff playing well out of the pen.

I really don't see what CarGo can bring to this lineup that someone like Luplow, Bauers or Mercado can't bring. But hey, let's hope there's some magic in that bottle. It can't hurt to see.
 
So quoting someone and saying “Jesus Christ...” is in no way condescending or insulting?

Got it...

I mean, do you think the things you said to open this can of worms deserved more? It always requires more effort to respond to bullshit than it does to just slap it down and walk away. The asymmetry of bullshit is a problem, and it's why you have people calling it out as soon as it begins.

You slapped down bullshit that this team has zero chance if both Jose AND Lindor aren't playing at an MVP level. This is a take you yourself disagree with.

When called out, you followed it up with a straw man.
Damn, people think the lineup is good? We’ll see I guess. Wonder if Kipnis has any juice left.

When it was explained to you that we have a chance without both Lindor and Jose playing at an MVP level (again, something YOU AGREE WITH) you came back with these hot takes:
Yes, I heard this last year before the Tribe got blasted out of the playoffs.
But you know the Indians wouldn’t be facing the White Sox and Blue Jays in October.

Seriously, what do you expect? Just dismissing your bullshit with a "Jesus Christ" is pretty damn amicable.

And, if you want more of an explanation to why someone's dismissing your post, a measured response would be to ask what that person takes offense to. Instead, you began with the ad hominem garbage.

Stop expecting people to treat you like an adult when you fling your poo around like a child.

(btw, I'm pretty sure you'll continue to be a good sport in here after this. Otherwise I would've just ignored this whole thing)
 
I swear we go through literally the same shit every year in here. And the sad thing about it is this same stuff is going on outside of this board all throughout the fan base. Shit is ass cancer every year.

This Indians group gets no benefit of the doubt in the city, and it's the strangest thing. They've been consistently good for going on 7 years now, are by far the most well run organization from top to bottom in town, and are most likely heading towards their 4th consecutive trip to the playoffs, one shy of what the beloved 90s group was able to do.

But they aren't spoken about in nearly the same light as that group and aren't nearly supported the same as that group was. And that group had the innate flaw of never being able to find competent pitching to go with their lineup, but they are still looked back upon with a twinkle in the eye.

Are they a flawed team right now? Abso-fucking-lutely. Will it stay that way? If their past 3 years at the trade deadline while they know they have a title window have told us anything, no, it won't stay that way. Their front office has even said as much, about utilizing the deadline to plug some holes as being more cost effective than free agency.

But what will it take for this fanbase to legit enjoy this team? Off to their best start under Tito, even after all the consistent bitching on all outlets that cover the team after their offseason and first few games. And it's not like this team hasn't faced bad teams to start their seasons in years past.

When all is said and done, they may roll out the most valued starting pitching rotation in baseball history, a group which may do something no one could ever match in baseball again (all 5 starters with 200+ strikeouts). And that alone could be enough to win a title, never mind their offense.

I'm not singling anyone out here, but holy shit the feelings towards the Indians are weird. They have an all-time position group with their starting rotation, an all-time manager, 2 MVP candidate position players, a great farm system...but half the fanbase seems to be laboring through watching them or supporting them. It literally makes no sense to me.

Take a page out of Dolan's misquoted book and "enjoy them" every once in a while.

There is two ways to look at it.

One our lineup is awful, the 6-9 hitter aren't even major league hitters. This is a fact, 6-9 is really really really bad.

Or, and this might sound crazy, we are 6-3 with insanely good starting pitching (which is the biggest thing in winning a World Series) and we have 3 all star level players including a MVP candidate coming back in a month to replace those awful hitters. Further we have Zimmer, Salazar and others who might come back to add further depth. Then we have proven to make atleast 2 big acquisitions every year to get ready for the playoffs.

I think it has been crazy how many minor injuries we have already, but that stuff happens. We can whine Lindor has 2 minor injuries, or see he has never had an injury history and if you take time to rehab, sprained ankles are not chronic issues typically. This start of the year is very encouraging.

I expected to struggle for about a month because of the lineup. And yes the lineup has been as bad as I thought, but fuck is our starting pitching good and its so good we are 3 games above .500 9 games into the year. Now that is crazy considering what is coming back soon that is on our DL.

I mean did anyone even the most positive people expect to be on a 108 win pace with this lineup before 3 of our best hitters return to replace the AA players there now? How is that not encouraging?
 
Well, sure. My question about Kipnis was legitimate btw.

I get the concerns with Kipnis. His production has fallen off the past 2 years, he's another year older, he's missed the first two weeks of the season, etc.

But after a painful first 2 months, he was a solid bat in the lineup. June 1 - Sept 30 he slashed .251 / .336 / .445 with 15 homers

Again, I get the concerns but he is better than Brad Miller at literally everything.
 
I think everyone's forgetting about Cody Anderson. I really see his stuff playing well out of the pen.

I really don't see what CarGo can bring to this lineup that someone like Luplow, Bauers or Mercado can't bring. But hey, let's hope there's some magic in that bottle. It can't hurt to see.

I looked at his splits, I don't think CarGo is an improvement over Bauers, but for sure Luplow and Mercado he is an improvement on in my opinion if nothing else he provides experience and leadership.

But if Mercado or Luplow can hit like they did in minors this year, heck watch out even more.
 
I mean, do you think the things you said to open this can of worms deserved more? It always requires more effort to respond to bullshit than it does to just slap it down and walk away. The asymmetry of bullshit is a problem, and it's why you have people calling it out as soon as it begins.

You slapped down bullshit that this team has zero chance if both Jose AND Lindor aren't playing at an MVP level. This is a take you yourself disagree with.

When called out, you followed it up with a straw man.


When it was explained to you that we have a chance without both Lindor and Jose playing at an MVP level (again, something YOU AGREE WITH) you came back with these hot takes:



Seriously, what do you expect? Just dismissing your bullshit with a "Jesus Christ" is pretty damn amicable.

And, if you want more of an explanation to why someone's dismissing your post, a measured response would be to ask what that person takes offense to. Instead, you began with the ad hominem garbage.

Stop expecting people to treat you like an adult when you fling your poo around like a child.

(btw, I'm pretty sure you'll continue to be a good sport in here after this. Otherwise I would've just ignored this whole thing)

Whatever man. I said sorry for my vague take. I’ll be more clear next time. What more can I do for you? I dont like arguing with people I generally enjoy.
 

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