2020-21 Offseason Discussion

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Urban

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I just don't see him as an every day player. He got a shot this year to play almost every day for a spurt and he did nothing with it.

.128/.277/.308/.584 in 47 PA against RHP in 2020.

.194/.276/.316/.594 in 272 career PA.

Maybe it happens and I hope I'm wrong, but what would lead us to believe he'll ever hit RHP?

Because his splits were very similar in the minor leagues. He was terrible vs. LHP and RHP in the first month of the season but hit both sides well in September. In 2019 he was terrible for the first half of the season vs. RHP and then had an 86 wRC+ from June 1 onward. But ultimately, you probably expect (or hope) that Naquin and Naylor can outproduce vs. RHP
 

DerekG123

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There is a lot of players that get an OPS of .860 at A ball. Santander wasn't even ready for the pros that season either. He played 13 games because he was injured then the next two seasons he spent a fair amount of time in the minors. Yes he would have been better than who we have now in a sense, but his first 4 seasons with the tribe, he had injuries and the season he got 128 games, he got hurt, and was hurt when Baltimore grabbed him.

All your words say hindsight and not taking into account at that time. @BimboColesHair was pissed beyond belief that someone actually snagged Santander (who barely made our top 30 prospects). But at the times of the moves we made, Wendle for Moss, Castro for Martin, etc they all seemed to make sense.

I mean I wasn't really "outraged" at the time but I won't say it was all hindsight for me because I did look at the move with a side eye. Still think it's their job to protect a good prospect and determine his value/potential over some of the guys we had like Daniel Robertson or Mike Martinez. To me you protect a good prospect on the 40 as long as you can unless it significantly impacts the major league roster
 

daddywags

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Because his splits were very similar in the minor leagues. He was terrible vs. LHP and RHP in the first month of the season but hit both sides well in September. In 2019 he was terrible for the first half of the season vs. RHP and then had an 86 wRC+ from June 1 onward. But ultimately, you probably expect (or hope) that Naquin and Naylor can outproduce vs. RHP

I may be just biased toward Luplow but I like his swing and have seen what I think is growth against RH pitching in minimal opportunities. I know his overall numbers are awful but I believe it's tough for a guy who sees a righty maybe once or twice a week to get into any sort of groove. Personally I've seen enough of Naquin swinging over balls in the dirt and not being able to catch up to any fastball thrown above his waist. So, given the alternatives, I would prefer to see Luplow play regularly for three months and see where we're at.
 

Criznit

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If we are hindsighting...

1. Trading Yandy was a mistake... But it came across that he was not happy here. We gambled on that one and so far we got crushed.
2. It is too bad we desperately needed a CF and Martin managed to put it all together long enough to get traded. We also got a decent lotto ticket in Dowdy but in hindsight I think we don't make that deal with Castro.

I mean we can go on and on.... But we certainly have some young unproven guys who may up being quite good sooner than later.. Johnson, Jones, Freeman and even Chang could end up producing.. We will have to see.

We are not the top dog in the division anymore. Next years line up will be green. Plus side of that is... Can it be much worse than our 2020 lineup?
 

CDAV45

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Johnson didn't look ready at the plate when he was out there. Zimmer had a chance and blew it. Mercado struggled. Who did they block this season? Who did they take ABs from? Naquin was going to be the starter in one of the OF spots.

Johnson is a corner OF, not a CF, so DeShields isn't take ABs from him. Naquin bats from the left side and has been best in a platoon (19 before he got hurt he was disproving that).

I am all for letting the young guys play and we dont know how much everyone will progress, but at the same time, in a 60 game season, we cannot just go hey, its your position so go play.

Now when it comes to 21, they will keep Naquin, but in my mind, if Johnson is as good as everyone thinks he is, then he can take the spot from Naquin. Johnson has to earn that spot not be given it.

Johnson is a CFer with one of the strongest OF arms in professional baseball. I've already explained this to you. Tito says he's a good CFer. Scouts say he's a good CFer. I've watched him play and I'm telling you he is a good CFer. In fact, he's a better CFer than Mercado.

You can tell "Johnson didn't look ready" by 15 AB? Well I guess everyone in the Indian's lineup outside of Ramirez, Lindor(at times), Reyes, and Hernandez didn't look "ready". Naquin sucked. DeShields is filler/4th OFer. Mercado struggled. Zimmer continued looking bad. If you're holding everyone to same standards then Luplow should have been sent packing with Domingo.

So are you good with Naylor in LF or 1B?
 

CDAV45

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I call it the "shiny new prospect" syndrome

Having guys who've done it at the MLB level means something. Maybe not to fans who think every prospect with a nice Minor League slash line is going to be a Major League star but it does matter to front offices. It's hard to stick in the bigs.... It's also why I don't think there's gonna be a ton of changes to this lineup.

I call it "don't know players/prospects" and expecting a rotten egg to turn to gold. In one hand you give no credence to a young players performance and athletic ability, and in the other you think that an average at best player that had a good stretch 4 f'n yrs ago and often injured is the answer. Just say something that makes sense will ya. According to you, Domingo should have remained on the team and penciled in the lineup everyday. After all, he's "done it" better than Naquin, Luplow, or any other OFer they trotted out there this season.
 

Urban

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If we are hindsighting...

1. Trading Yandy was a mistake... But it came across that he was not happy here. We gambled on that one and so far we got crushed.
2. It is too bad we desperately needed a CF and Martin managed to put it all together long enough to get traded. We also got a decent lotto ticket in Dowdy but in hindsight I think we don't make that deal with Castro.

I mean we can go on and on.... But we certainly have some young unproven guys who may up being quite good sooner than later.. Johnson, Jones, Freeman and even Chang could end up producing.. We will have to see.

We are not the top dog in the division anymore. Next years line up will be green. Plus side of that is... Can it be much worse than our 2020 lineup?

I think it is important for everyone to remember that part of this trade was turning 1 year of Edwin into 2 years of Carlos Santana. That part of the trade is seemingly always ignored and it's treated as a straight Yandy for Bauers swap.

It's also worth mentioning that Yandy has not been a beacon of health with Tampa. He's only played in 51% of Tampa's regular season games the past 2 seasons.
 

Urban

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Johnson is a CFer with one of the strongest OF arms in professional baseball. I've already explained this to you. Tito says he's a good CFer. Scouts say he's a good CFer. I've watched him play and I'm telling you he is a good CFer. In fact, he's a better CFer than Mercado.

If he were as good as a CFer as you'd suggesting, why has he only played 38% of his innings in center?
 

TxBuckeye

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I think it is important for everyone to remember that part of this trade was turning 1 year of Edwin into 2 years of Carlos Santana. That part of the trade is seemingly always ignored and it's treated as a straight Yandy for Bauers swap.

It's also worth mentioning that Yandy has not been a beacon of health with Tampa. He's only played in 51% of Tampa's regular season games the past 2 seasons.
And quite honestly outside of April 2019 has been largely unproductive.
 

sportscoach

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Johnson is a CFer with one of the strongest OF arms in professional baseball. I've already explained this to you. Tito says he's a good CFer. Scouts say he's a good CFer. I've watched him play and I'm telling you he is a good CFer. In fact, he's a better CFer than Mercado.

You can tell "Johnson didn't look ready" by 15 AB? Well I guess everyone in the Indian's lineup outside of Ramirez, Lindor(at times), Reyes, and Hernandez didn't look "ready". Naquin sucked. DeShields is filler/4th OFer. Mercado struggled. Zimmer continued looking bad. If you're holding everyone to same standards then Luplow should have been sent packing with Domingo.

So are you good with Naylor in LF or 1B?

If he looked ready they wouldn't have sent him down to be honest. He's okay in CF, he can play there, but that will not be his main position.

I am okay with the winner for LF and 1B. I think Bauers, Naylor etc will be a nice competition.
 

Urban

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And quite honestly outside of April 2019 has been largely unproductive.

.272 / .356 / .410 since with a 111 wRC+ is pretty good.

But that's pretty much the type of line you'd expect from Yandy. High OBP but somewhat disappointing SLG number for a guy of his statue and his exit velocity

Edit- His exit velocity numbers were top 10% of the league this year but are now below average this year. 5.82 GB/FB ratio this year which is really, really bad. The fact that he hit over .300 is pretty amazing

Screen Shot 2020-10-12 at 5.56.09 PM.png
 
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