2020-21 Offseason Discussion

[Wham with the Right Hand]

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Carrasco is dealt. The SP depth and need to trim payroll almost dictate that it's a possibility.

Hoynes has a column today saying he thinks Carrasco will be traded, especially after winning Comeback Player of the Year and finishing the season strong. He thinks there will be a market and it would shed $12 million this year and at least $3 million the year after. If it happens we will have traded Kluber, Bauer, Clevinger, and Carrasco within a year and a half.

 

[sportscoach]

Hoynes has a column today saying he thinks Carrasco will be traded, especially after winning Comeback Player of the Year and finishing the season strong. He thinks there will be a market and it would shed $12 million this year and at least $3 million the year after. If it happens we will have traded Kluber, Bauer, Clevinger, and Carrasco within a year and a half.

Carrasco would have to approve of any trade honestly... I really doubt he will be traded.

 

[CDAV45]

Carrasco would have to approve of any trade honestly... I really doubt he will be traded.

Why would Carrasco have to approve any trade? He doesn't have 10-5 rights yet which all the more reason to think he'll be traded before he acquires them.

 

[DerekG123]

Hoynes has a column today saying he thinks Carrasco will be traded, especially after winning Comeback Player of the Year and finishing the season strong. He thinks there will be a market and it would shed $12 million this year and at least $3 million the year after. If it happens we will have traded Kluber, Bauer, Clevinger, and Carrasco within a year and a half.

I expect Carrasco and Ramirez to be gone by the next deadline.... a real house cleaning of any significant salaries is upon us.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Good Lord! Now you're the one putting words in my mouth. I never said that Johnson would be better than Naquin. I said that his ceiling is much higher, that he is a better athlete, and that he stands a chance of out performing Naquin. Seeing how Naquin has performed, or not able to perform then I'm absolutely correct. If you think Naquin is in the same realm as Castellanos, Canha, Blackmon, Merrifield, and Kepler then whoever you coach for sure fire you immediately because you have no idea what you're talking about. I've said countless times that Naquin is average, mediocre, run of the mill because that's what he is and will always be. I've also stated that these average, mediocre, run of the mill types aren't going to put this team over the top. In fact, I stated that they will not win a division crown because the days of cruising through the AL Central are over bud. Even with this pitching staff.

I'm just going to say that you can win championship with some average players. You don't have to have a 1-9 roster of above average guys, because if you do...we're never going to win anything because we can't afford that. You need some average guys, and then some guys who are above-average/stars to take you the rest of the way. So we don't necessarily have to upgrade every position at which we have someone who is just "average".

The big problem for us this year was that we had a bunch of below-average hitters.

 

[sportscoach]

Why would Carrasco have to approve any trade? He doesn't have 10-5 rights yet which all the more reason to think he'll be traded before he acquires them.

Because of the gentlemans agreement that Carrasco essentially made when he resigned again at a hometown discount because he wants to retire an Indian. It would hurt the Indians organization's reputation really really bad in the eyes of a lot of people if we trade Carrasco without his approval.

 

[Huber.]

Because of the gentlemans agreement that Carrasco essentially made when he resigned again at a hometown discount because he wants to retire an Indian. It would hurt the Indians organization's reputation really really bad in the eyes of a lot of people if we trade Carrasco without his approval.

The gentleman's agreement was to pay him $47,000,000. I haven't heard they promised not to trade him. He doesn't even live in Cleveland in the offseason.

 

[CDAV45]

I'm just going to say that you can win championship with some average players. You don't have to have a 1-9 roster of above average guys, because if you do...we're never going to win anything because we can't afford that. You need some average guys, and then some guys who are above-average/stars to take you the rest of the way. So we don't necessarily have to upgrade every position at which we have someone who is just "average".

The big problem for us this year was that we had a bunch of below-average hitters.

Yeah, I don't think that you have to have an all-star at every position or even any at all. The problem lies when 4 or more spots in your lineup are not very productive. What makes teams like Cleveland successful is when young, talented players emerge and are still affordable. Look no further than the Rays and Marlins to name a couple. I think the Indians are on a good path, but I also think that they could benefit from fully committing to such a plan. They've basically done so with the rotation, and they should do the same with the position players too. IMO of course and it certainly isn't without risk.

 

[macbdog]

The gentleman's agreement was to pay him $47,000,000. I haven't heard they promised not to trade him. He doesn't even live in Cleveland in the offseason.

No one with 47 million should be spending the months of November-February in Cleveland.

 

[Huber.]

No one with 47 million should be spending the months of November-February in Cleveland.

Just pointing out that he isn't set on being stuck in Ohio. I doubt he would mind a trade if many of his teammates and Tito are no longer on the team next year.

 

[Gson]

Yeah, I don't think that you have to have an all-star at every position or even any at all. The problem lies when 4 or more spots in your lineup are not very productive. What makes teams like Cleveland successful is when young, talented players emerge and are still affordable. Look no further than the Rays and Marlins to name a couple. I think the Indians are on a good path, but I also think that they could benefit from fully committing to such a plan. They've basically done so with the rotation, and they should do the same with the position players too. IMO of course and it certainly isn't without risk.

A full blown rebuild in this environment is a risk that could be contemplated.. no doubt.. The lack of revenue streams in the form of fans in the stands or any idea if that is going to be a source for income going forward, the lack of a minority share buyer/buy in.. the pending loss of the best player this club has seen in years.. etc etc.. all point to your conclusion..

Fully committing might be the best choice.. but, it is the highest risk/highest return likelihood..

 

[DCTribefan]

A full blown rebuild in this environment is a risk that could be contemplated.. no doubt.. The lack of revenue streams in the form of fans in the stands or any idea if that is going to be a source for income going forward, the lack of a minority share buyer/buy in.. the pending loss of the best player this club has seen in years.. etc etc.. all point to your conclusion..

Fully committing might be the best choice.. but, it is the highest risk/highest return likelihood..

As long as the Tribe FO doesn’t post a white flag rebuild letter to the media as the Chicago Blackhawks just did.

 

[Kevalier]

I expect Carrasco and Ramirez to be gone by the next deadline.... a real house cleaning of any significant salaries is upon us.

Jose's contract:

2021	28	Cleveland Indians	$9,400,000
2022	29	Cleveland Indians	*$11,000,000		$11M Team Option, $2M Buyout
2023	30	Cleveland Indians	*$13,000,000		$13M Team Option

Even for the Indians, this doesn't really qualify as a significant salary. There is no reason to trade Jose this summer as long as this team remains in contention.

 

[CDAV45]

Jose's contract:

2021	28	Cleveland Indians	$9,400,000
2022	29	Cleveland Indians	*$11,000,000		$11M Team Option, $2M Buyout
2023	30	Cleveland Indians	*$13,000,000		$13M Team Option

Even for the Indians, this doesn't really qualify as a significant salary. There is no reason to trade Jose this summer as long as this team remains in contention.

I agree with this, but what if the return is extraordinary? I don't think it hurts to see what teams would offer.

 

[DCTribefan]

I agree with this, but what if the return is extraordinary? I don't think it hurts to see what teams would pay.

Extraordinary as in Lee, Phillips , and Sizemore as the return?