2020 Buckeyes Football

[AZ_]

Well, yes.

So here's something that might shock most people in here. OSU's athletic department LOST money in 2018-19. Yes, despite making over $200 million in revenue, they spent more than they earned. This is the catch-22 for the college football and basketball programs across the country and the athletes calling for pay.

While they might be making a lot of money, they're re-investing literally all of it into coaching, staff, recruiting, travel, and building world-class facilities that allow the player to evolve as a student-athlete and the sport to generate money. Sports are a marketing tool for a university, and most lose money overall on sports. OSU didn't lose much, but it's still hard to believe that an athletics program that brings in as much money as OSU would still lose money.

This further illustrates the problems even for other Big 10 schools that don't bring in the same kind of money as OSU.

Ohio State athletics lost money in 2018-19: How much? Why two reports show different numbers

Ohio State's required Equity in Athletics Distributions Act report to the NCAA showed a $10 million deficit between revenue and expenses. The school says that is due to an interpretation of how funds are accounted only on that report.

www.cleveland.com

These are the athletic numbers from OSU for 18-19 from USA Today:

USA TODAY

sports.usatoday.com

Ticket Sales: $59,847,907
Contributions: $29,681,048
Rights/Licensing: $93,919,737 (TV Money, apparel, etc.)
School Funds: $41,472
Other: $27,058,075
Total Revenue: $210,548,239

Ohio State athletics will not be immune from budget cuts hitting Big Ten because of COVID-19

Ohio State athletic director Gene Smith said social distancing requirements might result in a limited capacity of 20,000-50,000 this fall. How would OSU handle that loss of revenue?

www.cleveland.com

So take away at least $55-60 mill from the athletic budget with no fans right off the top. I would have to guess that given the current circumstances, apparel sales take a massive hit with no fans in the stadium and the economic state of the country.

If you want the greater culprits, look no further than the coaching and support staffs:

Coronavirus: Ohio State athletics working to adjust budget on the fly

www.msn.com

So, $77,000,000 on coaches and support staff in athletics, a number that won't change this year according to Smith.

There's a lot of other factors in play for the 2020 fiscal year as well. This was OSU's 2020 budget:

https://busfin.osu.edu/sites/default/files/fy20_budget_plan_-_08202019_final.pdf

Read through it if you'd like. It'd shed a great deal of light on why these Presidents are in such a difficult situation.

The main point being, OSU's projected revenue was $7.5 Billion and projected expense was $7 Billion. Everyone leaves wiggle room in their budget, but it still has to be spent by the end of the year. Keep in mind, this is not only reflecting the Columbus campus, but this includes the total budget for all four regional campuses as well.

I have not seen numbers for enrollment yet, but I would have to assume out-of-state and international numbers will take a big hit, which will result in a big reduction of tuition dollars.

The state of Ohio contributes money to every public university in the state. In May they had to trim their budget and part of that involved contributions to universities.

Ohio university system gets a $76.7 million budget cut

All public universities and community colleges in the state of Ohio will take a 3.8% budget cut for the remainder of the fiscal year, the Ohio Department of Higher Education announced Wednesday morning.

www.wcpo.com

It doesn't totally work like this, but technically speaking, the loss of money from the state and the likely drop in enrollment would probably be enough to shut down at the very least two if not all four of the regional branches.

Not to get repetitive in this discussion, but a few days ago I outlined how collegiate athletic departments attempt to show losses in an effort to keep this system alive and well.

There is no logical reason to believe these athletic departments aren't raking in money through the various accounting practices I laid out earlier.

The Biggest Misconceptions About The Finances Of College Sports

You know there's big money around college sports, but do you really understand the business of college sports?

www.forbes.com

Be skeptical when big college athletic departments act broke

Official numbers need to be taken with several grains of salt.

www.bannersociety.com

The business of college football and basketball see hundreds of millions, even billions of dollars flowing through every year.

For us to claim that this practice isn't profitable for collegiate athletic departments, as they continue growing and expanding this business and further monetizing that business in various other ways, would be a crazy endeavor.

Looking at financial statements alone will never tell us the true story of profitability and health. The same is true for any business, really.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

Not to get repetitive in this discussion, but a few days ago I outlined how collegiate athletic departments attempt to show losses in an effort to keep this system alive and well.

There is no logical reason to believe these athletic departments aren't raking in money through the various accounting practices I laid out earlier.

The Biggest Misconceptions About The Finances Of College Sports

You know there's big money around college sports, but do you really understand the business of college sports?

www.forbes.com

Be skeptical when big college athletic departments act broke

Official numbers need to be taken with several grains of salt.

www.bannersociety.com

The business of college football and basketball see hundreds of millions, even billions of dollars flowing through every year.

For us to claim that this practice isn't profitable for collegiate athletic departments, as they continue growing and expanding this business and further monetizing that business in various other ways, would be a crazy endeavor.

Looking at financial statements alone will never tell us the true story of profitability and health. The same is true for any business, really.

Well yes, what you say is true when simply looking at a budget.

The issue I see going forward for athletes, and I don't know how this exists in the non-profit world, is that since universities and athletic departments are considered non-profits, how are you able to go about a valuation process that would be required in order to determine how athletes could be compensated? The number of legal hoops to jump through and restructuring that would need to take place seems monumental and almost not worth it to a university to some degree.

I don't know how they have to account for it, but a normal business needs to account for assets every year in determining what the company is worth. Do non-profits have to do the same? It certainly changes the game if you have to include venues, training facilities, land, media reach, etc.

The business of college football and basketball see hundreds of millions, even billions of dollars flowing through every year.

Don't disagree with this either. My larger question would be what percentage of this is making it to the universities and what percentage is staying with the networks, advertisers, apparel companies, licensing companies, etc.

 

[inliner311]

So I know that the season is most likely over but one thing that Gene Smith said got me thinking. He said that they won't be playing a non conference schedule. That made me realize that they have thought about going on without the big ten and that would be one way to do so without getting into any legal stuff with the big ten.

It got me thinking on if they were going to go at a season without the big 10 what they probably would do. I think joining a existing conference would be out because that conference won't want to share revenue or allow an outside team to play in their championship. Non conference schedule would be hard to assemble now and would be hard to sell the tv rights. Also no championship game, which is important to the selection committee for the playoffs.

The option I came up with is that they put together a temporary conference where they can legally construct everything they need to bypass the big ten. Maybe no one is official members except an independent team they recruit and the rest are affiliate members. It would get the a championship game and there would be a bidding war by tv networks to get the rights to it. Basically they could pick up the pac12 and big 10 money that isn't being spent. Lastly they might be able to find some legal loopholes so it's just a league for football, not all fall sports.

 

[Ohio]

OSU all in on a Spring season.

 

[inliner311]

OSU all in on a Spring season.

As much as the two seasons in one year has been talked about. I think it's kind of overblown for alot of guys who will make the jump to the NFL. Rookies tend to get less snaps and don't all come in to contribute right away in the NFL. That is mostly true for someone like Fields at QB. I think Wade at CB is another story, highly drafted CBs tend to jump right in. There are alot of positions where it takes them a half a season or year to even get snaps. WRs tend to play only a couple snaps even if they are drafted in the first round.

I think what Ohio state has to hope for is that the teams going at it in the fall stumbles but just enough that they can regroup in the new year when the big ten and possibly PAC 12 start. That way playoffs get pushed back.

 

[AZ_]

Well yes, what you say is true when simply looking at a budget.

The issue I see going forward for athletes, and I don't know how this exists in the non-profit world, is that since universities and athletic departments are considered non-profits, how are you able to go about a valuation process that would be required in order to determine how athletes could be compensated? The number of legal hoops to jump through and restructuring that would need to take place seems monumental and almost not worth it to a university to some degree.

I don't know how they have to account for it, but a normal business needs to account for assets every year in determining what the company is worth. Do non-profits have to do the same? It certainly changes the game if you have to include venues, training facilities, land, media reach, etc.



Don't disagree with this either. My larger question would be what percentage of this is making it to the universities and what percentage is staying with the networks, advertisers, apparel companies, licensing companies, etc.

My guess is, once the regulations are in place with regards to the NIL discussion, the market will begin to regulate itself for what athletes are worth.

Here is one company which has already begun helping athletes realize what their valuation is:

If there is any chance of preserving the "amateur" model, they'll regulate boosters and such to prevent woefully corrupt recruiting practices. But eventually whats left of the "free" market has to do the work.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

A spring season makes so much more sense to me despite the problem.

Right now, college football has to deal with two huge unknowns: 1) what will happen with Covid with respect to the football team, and 2) what will happen with Covid with respect to the university as a whole, of which they are a part? The first is inextricably entwined with the second.

Postponing football until January will give schools the entire rest of 2020 to figure out exactly what Covid is doing on their campuses. Protocols, health outcomes for people in that age group, etc.. That will enable teams to make much more informed and better decisions about their own policies and practices for a potential season.

 

[Ohio]

Woah

 

[inliner311]

Woah

I think this part is recruiting other universities and using everyone's collective legal departments to make an iron clad structure so their existing conferences can't do anything. Ohio State playing Michigan or Penn might have some legal or financial recourse from the big 10.

If they want to make sure they all have a equal chance at the playoffs, they need a championship game. The tv revenue will be waiting there for them if they can get the right mix of schools for the temporary conference. Big games and easy games need to be sold as a package.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

Woah

I’m still so confused on this bit.

It’s definitely not Day’s decision. As far as I know Smith doesn’t have the power to make that determination either.

Wouldn’t it have to have board approval? You know, the same board that already voted to cancel the Big 10 season?

About the only way I could see something like this happening is if OSU’s board of trustees wanted out of the Big 10, which seems incredibly unlikely.

Don’t get trapped in the football vacuum during a pandemic. The Big 10 association does in fact offer OSU a ton of benefit outside of just football and outside of sports.

 

[inliner311]

I’m still so confused on this bit.

It’s definitely not Day’s decision. As far as I know Smith doesn’t have the power to make that determination either.

Wouldn’t it have to have board approval? You know, the same board that already voted to cancel the Big 10 season?

About the only way I could see something like this happening is if OSU’s board of trustees wanted out of the Big 10, which seems incredibly unlikely.

Don’t get trapped in the football vacuum during a pandemic. The Big 10 association does in fact offer OSU a ton of benefit outside of just football and outside of sports.

I think there are probably a ton of moving parts here. Playing outside of the big 10 may piss off the big 10 but at the same time they might give their blessing. They need Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan to be relevant on the national stage, the financials basically run through the powerhouse football teams. TV contracts are given out based on it. The whole structure of college sports is football and basketball bring in the money.

I don't think the big ten will be happy to let teams go play in other conferences, that is just setting up for a team to leave the big 10. Ohio state and the teams that want to play could set up a purely non-conference schedule and it seems like that has been floated. I stated the problems with that above. There probably is a middle ground that solves all this and the big ten gives their blessing. Some temporary conference for football that the big 10 has a stake in so it can't run off to create a new conference in the future.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

I think there are probably a ton of moving parts here. Playing outside of the big 10 may piss off the big 10 but at the same time they might give their blessing. They need Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan to be relevant on the national stage, the financials basically run through the powerhouse football teams. TV contracts are given out based on it. The whole structure of college sports is football and basketball bring in the money.

I don't think the big ten will be happy to let teams go play in other conferences, that is just setting up for a team to leave the big 10. Ohio state and the teams that want to play could set up a purely non-conference schedule and it seems like that has been floated. I stated the problems with that above. There probably is a middle ground that solves all this and the big ten gives their blessing. Some temporary conference for football that the big 10 has a stake in so it can't run off to create a new conference in the future.

You're still missing my point. OSU already voted NOT to play. Iowa and Nebraska are the only one's that vote for the season. Don't you think that if the administration was fine with them playing in the fall, they would've voted FOR playing in the Big 10?

The only justification I can find for the board voting against playing in the Big 10 and then turning around and still playing in the fall is that they want out of the Big 10 to either join another conference, become an independent, or form some mega-conference. Nothing else makes much sense for them to suddenly switch course back to being OK with playing.

 

[NorthCoastBias]

You're still missing my point. OSU already voted NOT to play. Iowa and Nebraska are the only one's that vote for the season. Don't you think that if the administration was fine with them playing in the fall, they would've voted FOR playing in the Big 10?

It was reported that both Gene Smith and Kristina Johnson, the president-elect, were in favor of taking a wait-and-see approach rather than voting to postpone the season outright.

 

[inliner311]

You're still missing my point. OSU already voted NOT to play. Iowa and Nebraska are the only one's that vote for the season. Don't you think that if the administration was fine with them playing in the fall, they would've voted FOR playing in the Big 10?

The only justification I can find for the board voting against playing in the Big 10 and then turning around and still playing in the fall is that they want out of the Big 10 to either join another conference, become an independent, or form some mega-conference. Nothing else makes much sense for them to suddenly switch course back to being OK with playing.

That was only a rumor of how they voted. No one knows what the official vote was. The way that Ohio State officials are talking it doesn't seem like they were a vote not to play. The assistant AD might be one of the louder voices on Twitter trying to get them to play. If the president and board were against playing, I'm sure Gene Smith would tell him to knock it off.

 

[inliner311]

What seems to be coming out now is that the Big 10 didn't feel like the testing and resources were equal and adequate across the conference. Basically there were schools that couldn't test enough to keep everyone safe in the conference.

Ohio State has the ability to test in house, we know this because the state of Ohio has been relying on Ohio State and the hospitals in Cleveland for testing. I assume they have been planning for the needed extra capacity to run their own campus and not relying on private labs to do so. My guess is other schools didn't plan as well or were relying on private labs to do it. The turnaround time for private labs has been going up to where it might not even be reliable to use those result for something like college sports. If the turnaround is 5-10 days instead of 24 hours then it will be much hard to trust that those players aren't infected.