-
Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.
2020 Lineup Discussion
- Thread starter Derek
- Start date
AZ_
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2007
- Messages
- 40,669
- Reaction score
- 51,324
- Points
- 148
Bauers probably fits in there somewhere too?
I truly don’t know, will be interesting to see what Tito does with it.
AZ_
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2007
- Messages
- 40,669
- Reaction score
- 51,324
- Points
- 148
ZiPS certainly not so high on Bradley:
blogs.fangraphs.com
2020 ZiPS Projections: Cleveland Indians
Cleveland's highs are very high, and the team's fate is overly reliant on them.
Steve_424
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2009
- Messages
- 10,555
- Reaction score
- 13,183
- Points
- 123
I really hope we add an OF to the mix. Puig is an obvious fit if his price falls within the Indians' target range. Holt would fit well in a platoon with Luplow and/or super utility, depending on price. Cameron Maybin could be a platoon option as well. Domingo Santana was pretty damn good at the plate in the first half last year before free-falling in the 2nd half. Hunter Pence may be worth a camp invite, if he doesn't find a market elsewhere.
I personally don't trust Bradley, Bauers, Allen, Zimmer, etc. Maybe they are high on Johnson, but I admittedly haven't seen him play enough to form a solid opinion.
I personally don't trust Bradley, Bauers, Allen, Zimmer, etc. Maybe they are high on Johnson, but I admittedly haven't seen him play enough to form a solid opinion.
Urban
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2009
- Messages
- 7,938
- Reaction score
- 11,043
- Points
- 123
Maybin was great last year but I don't necessarily trust him to repeat his 2019 success again. If he doesn't repeat, he's a JAG and we seemingly have plenty of those right now. Would rather see those ABs go to a Bauers, Zimmer, or Johnson to see what they have
Don't trust Holt filling the heavy side of an OF platoon. He'd be great as a super utility guy, but even a 1 yr $3m deal seems like a luxury type of spend for a utility player when the Indians have a handful of utility guys on minimum salary.
I'd certainly entertain Pence on a minor league deal but he's a walking disabled list trip and really should strictly be a DH. Which he mostly was last season and still missed half of the year.
Don't trust Holt filling the heavy side of an OF platoon. He'd be great as a super utility guy, but even a 1 yr $3m deal seems like a luxury type of spend for a utility player when the Indians have a handful of utility guys on minimum salary.
I'd certainly entertain Pence on a minor league deal but he's a walking disabled list trip and really should strictly be a DH. Which he mostly was last season and still missed half of the year.
Derek
Table Setter
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2009
- Messages
- 18,221
- Reaction score
- 31,606
- Points
- 148
I mean, that's the thing with young guys, you can't trust them until they actually do it. You have to give them a shot at some point though.
Bradley, Bauers, and Zimmer are all former top 100 prospects. While I'm not big on Bradley, he deserves more than a cup of coffee chance before we give up on him. Zimmer's basically just had part of a rookie year before getting injured. Bauers switched organizations and positions and only has 811 PA to his name.
I know it's tough to stomach while you're trying to win games, but sometimes you need to just let these guys work out their issues while getting regular major league at-bats.
For example, Rafael Devers showed pop but was ultimately very underwhelming in 2018 with the Sox before blowing up this past season.
Puig on a 1-year deal for $7 million would be a solid addition to our lineup, there's also value in trying to find a long-term option out of the numerous talented candidates we have waiting in the wings.
EDIT: Also, Maybin sucks. He had a BABIP 47 points higher than his career average and a HR/FB% nearly double his career number last season in that little league park they call Yankee stadium.
I would have liked Holt more if we hadn't already signed Hernandez.
Last edited:
Steve_424
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2009
- Messages
- 10,555
- Reaction score
- 13,183
- Points
- 123
Aside from maybe Johnson, I just don't see it with the other guys. Greg Allen is a 4th OF. Bauers had plenty of opportunity last year. Bradley didn't have enough of a chance, but looked overwhelmed in the bit he did have. Zimmer may still show something, but he'll start in Columbus.
Talent aside, Devers debuted with Boston at 20 years old. Allen (26), Bauers (24), Zimmer (27), Johnson (24), and Bradley (23) are older than he was.
Stark
The Winds of Winter
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2012
- Messages
- 22,085
- Reaction score
- 23,821
- Points
- 135
ZiPS certainly not so high on Bradley:
2020 ZiPS Projections: Cleveland Indians
Cleveland's highs are very high, and the team's fate is overly reliant on them.
These projections kind of confuse me.
Are they projecting that Nolan Jones would almost be a 2.0 fWAR player if given a full season of at-bats next year?
AZ_
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2007
- Messages
- 40,669
- Reaction score
- 51,324
- Points
- 148
Yes. Not much of an exact science by any means.
Derek
Table Setter
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2009
- Messages
- 18,221
- Reaction score
- 31,606
- Points
- 148
There’s a long list of guys that took more than a season to adjust to big-league pitching. Devers was just the first that came to mind.
You says Bauers has had plenty of opportunity, but 811 PA really isn’t that much. It takes time and patience to develop players, and despite our win now mentality, player development is still key to continued success.
I agree Allen is a 4th OF type, but he’s not really who I was referring to.
Steve_424
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2009
- Messages
- 10,555
- Reaction score
- 13,183
- Points
- 123
I want to maximize the Lindor years we have left. This isn't cutting it, nor is it good enough to win a World Series:
Vs RHP
LF-Bauers
CF-Mercado
RF-Luplow
DH-Reyes
Vs LHP
LF-Deshields Jr.
CF-Mercado
RF-Luplow
You're counting on Bauers/DeShields to produce, and Luplow to be an every day player. How many of those things are you confident in?
Now, say they sign Puig to a 1 year deal:
Vs RHP
LF-Bauers
CF-Mercado
RF-Puig
DH-Reyes
Vs LHP
LF-Luplow
CF-Mercado
RF-Puig
DH-Reyes
I'm confident in Puig producing as at least a competent starter. Luplow can potentially steal some ABs from Bauers against RHP, but you don't have to rely on it. You really only have one uncertain area - LF against RHP - and you have all of Bauers, Zimmer, Allen, Johnson to find a solution for that one spot. Or, if they all fail, Naquin is returning or you can return to the trade market this winter. I think one more every-day OF would just go sooooo far for this team, and it will be maddening if they, sitting around $90 M in payroll, aren't aggressive in filling that hole.
Lee
Hall-of-Famer
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2005
- Messages
- 40,938
- Reaction score
- 61,592
- Points
- 148
Elite pitching only takes average hitting to win a world series if your pitching is healthy, the batting takes off a bit in the playoffs and the other team doesn't have some sophisticated sign stealing scheme going on.
Derek
Table Setter
- Joined
- Jan 10, 2009
- Messages
- 18,221
- Reaction score
- 31,606
- Points
- 148
Really? I see us as favorites in the Central right now.
No, I’m not confident in Bauers, but I am confident that out of Bauers/Zimmer/Bradley/Johnson, somebody will step up as a positive contributor.
And yes, I’m confident Luplow will be a good everyday bat, if given the opportunity.
As far as maximizing Lindor’s remaining time here, I believe we are. He’s not LeBron James or anything. He’s just another cog in our success. One of the bigger ones, sure, but I don’t expect any drop off once he’s gone.