2020 Minor League Thread

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Gson

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Every time I read a blurb, or see a clip on HS SS Ed Howard, he just strikes me like a great fit for the Tribe. I see him mocked in various spots in the first round, but somewhat in the Indians selection range. Obviously this is a very strange year, but any strong feelings for Howard, one way or another?
...well above average skills in all ways.. on the defensive side of the ball.. has a strong arm..not a bazooka.. has very good range.. but not superior range.. especially to his right.. He will be able to stay at SS as a solid all around middle infielder.. He's that pick a team takes while looking to save a few scheckels (signing below slot is possible.... and not just because of the current situation MLB finds itself).. What really stands out about him is his potential with the bat.. He really has great bat speed.. couple that with a short/compact swing allows him to put the bat on the ball.. That is the key to this kid's future.. and he does that as well as any SS prospect out there.. Without a lot of history this spring.. he's a risk... one worth taking if not for...

With the Indians system stacked with so many middle infielders.. it wouldn't surprise me to see Ed Howard passed when it comes time for the tribe to pick.. Thoughts?..

Prospect1500.com had this to say: https://www.prospects1500.com/mlb-draft/2020-mlb-draft-player-profile-ed-howard/
 
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MadThinker88

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Sorry everyone..
I thought I had posted the following over the weekend but I had not.
I finally received my book copy of the 2020 Minor League Baseball Analyst. Written by Baseball HQ, they have an interesting take on players in all systems.
Here is the top 15 for the Tribe prospects (in their view):
#NamePosGrade#NamePosGrade
1Nolan Jones3B9C9Triston McKenzieRHP8D
2George ValeraOF9D10Gabriel RodriguezSS8E
3Tyler FreemanSS8B11Daniel JohnsonOF7C
4Ethan HankinsRHP9D12Lenny TorresRHP8E
5Noah ‘Bo” NaylorC8C13Bobby Bradley1B7C
6Daniel EspinoRHP9E14Logan AllenLHP7C
7Aaron Bracho2B8C15Luis OviedoRHP8E
8Brayan RocchioSS8D

Now the grade for each player is a little interesting twist. Here is the grade explanation chart (it is done by max potential:

Potential
Hall of Famer
10​
MLB reserve5
Elite Player
9​
Top minor leaguer4
Solid Regular
8​
Average minor leaguer
3​
Average Regular
7​
Minor leauge reserve
2​
Platoon Player
6​
Minor leauge roster filler
1​
Probability Rating
90% probability of reaching potentialA
70% probability of reaching potentialB
50% probability of reaching potentialC
30% probability of reaching potentialD
10% probability of reaching potentialE

Just for some historical comparisons (from their previous publications):
2016​
2015​
2014​
2013​
2012​
2011​
2010​
Francisco Lindor9B9B9B8A
Giovanny Urshela7C7C8D
Dorssys Paulino7D7E8C8B8D
Hector Rondon7D8C8C8B
Chris Archer8B9E9D8D
Dylan Bundy (Balt)9C9B9A10C9B
Josh Bell (Pitt)9D9D9D9D9D
Corey Seager (LAD)9A9D9D9D

For those wondering:
Karinchak: 7C. There is some concern regarding Karinchak's control & walk rates.
Clase: 8D. It was noted that higher level hitters have made more contact. Perhaps a sign that his stuff while very good is not what some believe (my interpretation/ words for this last sentence).

They rarely award a 10 grade. An 'A' is also rare but more common in comparison. Think 10 like a Perfect Game or 5 homer game for a player. Think the 'A' like hitting for the cycle. I recall that Strasburg got 10 but no one else jumps to mind. This year Wander Franco was awarded a 10C this year. Jo Adell got a 9B & Gavin Lux got a 9A.

As an aside the book also rates each farm system, not only overall, but also by hitting, pitching, high-end talent & depth.
They rated Cleveland the 8th overall system with the following grades:
Hitting A-
Pitching B
Top end talent B+
Depth C
Overall B
 

sportscoach

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...well above average skills in all ways.. on the defensive side of the ball.. has a strong arm..not a bazooka.. has very good range.. but not superior range.. especially to his right.. He will be able to stay at SS as a solid all around middle infielder.. He's that pick a team takes while looking to save a few scheckels (signing below slot is possible.... and not just because of the current situation MLB finds itself).. What really stands out about him is his potential with the bat.. He really has great bat speed.. couple that with a short/compact swing allows him to put the bat on the ball.. That is the key to this kid's future.. and he does that as well as any SS prospect out there.. Without a lot of history this spring.. he's a risk... one worth taking if not for...

With the Indians system stacked with so many middle infielders.. it wouldn't surprise me to see Ed Howard passed when it comes time for the tribe to pick.. Thoughts?..

Prospect1500.com had this to say: https://www.prospects1500.com/mlb-draft/2020-mlb-draft-player-profile-ed-howard/
Honestly you grab the best player available that you think fits into the ability/plan in signing the prospects. Even if you have a lot of middle infielders, you can always change positions. I mean Mercado was drafted as a SS and Wolters was a INF who ended up as a C.

Indians have been going for athleticism and upside rather than position it feels like. Your best players in high school ball will often times be at SS, or CF so getting a million of those likely will have a greater potential of success then strictly going for a limited position type of player.

Jones was a SS in high school, Kipnis was drafted as an OF if I remember correctly. Yan Gomes wouldn't have been a catcher if he stayed in Toronto. Guys get moved around and eventually teams get them into the right position. Draft not for position but for physical tools and potential. Positions eventually will set themselves based off of team needs and how the player develops, so i don't 100% look at what position we draft a guy at, but the physical tools of a player to tell me what position to put him at.
 
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sportscoach

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Sorry everyone..
I thought I had posted the following over the weekend but I had not.
I finally received my book copy of the 2020 Minor League Baseball Analyst. Written by Baseball HQ, they have an interesting take on players in all systems.
Here is the top 15 for the Tribe prospects (in their view):
#NamePosGrade#NamePosGrade
1Nolan Jones3B9C9Triston McKenzieRHP8D
2George ValeraOF9D10Gabriel RodriguezSS8E
3Tyler FreemanSS8B11Daniel JohnsonOF7C
4Ethan HankinsRHP9D12Lenny TorresRHP8E
5Noah ‘Bo” NaylorC8C13Bobby Bradley1B7C
6Daniel EspinoRHP9E14Logan AllenLHP7C
7Aaron Bracho2B8C15Luis OviedoRHP8E
8Brayan RocchioSS8D

Now the grade for each player is a little interesting twist. Here is the grade explanation chart (it is done by max potential:

Potential
Hall of Famer
10​
MLB reserve5
Elite Player
9​
Top minor leaguer4
Solid Regular
8​
Average minor leaguer
3​
Average Regular
7​
Minor leauge reserve
2​
Platoon Player
6​
Minor leauge roster filler
1​
Probability Rating
90% probability of reaching potentialA
70% probability of reaching potentialB
50% probability of reaching potentialC
30% probability of reaching potentialD
10% probability of reaching potentialE

Just for some historical comparisons (from their previous publications):
2016​
2015​
2014​
2013​
2012​
2011​
2010​
Francisco Lindor9B9B9B8A
Giovanny Urshela7C7C8D
Dorssys Paulino7D7E8C8B8D
Hector Rondon7D8C8C8B
Chris Archer8B9E9D8D
Dylan Bundy (Balt)9C9B9A10C9B
Josh Bell (Pitt)9D9D9D9D9D
Corey Seager (LAD)9A9D9D9D

For those wondering:
Karinchak: 7C. There is some concern regarding Karinchak's control & walk rates.
Clase: 8D. It was noted that higher level hitters have made more contact. Perhaps a sign that his stuff while very good is not what some believe (my interpretation/ words for this last sentence).

They rarely award a 10 grade. An 'A' is also rare but more common in comparison. Think 10 like a Perfect Game or 5 homer game for a player. Think the 'A' like hitting for the cycle. I recall that Strasburg got 10 but no one else jumps to mind. This year Wander Franco was awarded a 10C this year. Jo Adell got a 9B & Gavin Lux got a 9A.

As an aside the book also rates each farm system, not only overall, but also by hitting, pitching, high-end talent & depth.
They rated Cleveland the 8th overall system with the following grades:
Hitting A-
Pitching B
Top end talent B+
Depth C
Overall B
So essentially the chart is first number 1-10, the potential the player has, with 10 being a Hall fo Famer, then the second letter, A-E is the probability of them reaching that potential.

When it comes to betting, Freeman has the best chance to succeed, but Jones has the best potential within the organization. While Espino will be a boom or bust.

Wish they went deeper than 15 on the list you had. How accurate has this system been overall?
 

MadThinker88

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So essentially the chart is first number 1-10, the potential the player has, with 10 being a Hall fo Famer, then the second letter, A-E is the probability of them reaching that potential.

When it comes to betting, Freeman has the best chance to succeed, but Jones has the best potential within the organization. While Espino will be a boom or bust.

Wish they went deeper than 15 on the list you had. How accurate has this system been overall?
I think they are like any other prospect projection. They get some right & they get some very wrong..
That was why I included the historical reference chart on various names (Lindor/ Urshela/ Paulino/ etc)...
 

LL3

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...well above average skills in all ways.. on the defensive side of the ball.. has a strong arm..not a bazooka.. has very good range.. but not superior range.. especially to his right.. He will be able to stay at SS as a solid all around middle infielder.. He's that pick a team takes while looking to save a few scheckels (signing below slot is possible.... and not just because of the current situation MLB finds itself).. What really stands out about him is his potential with the bat.. He really has great bat speed.. couple that with a short/compact swing allows him to put the bat on the ball.. That is the key to this kid's future.. and he does that as well as any SS prospect out there.. Without a lot of history this spring.. he's a risk... one worth taking if not for...

With the Indians system stacked with so many middle infielders.. it wouldn't surprise me to see Ed Howard passed when it comes time for the tribe to pick.. Thoughts?..

Prospect1500.com had this to say: https://www.prospects1500.com/mlb-draft/2020-mlb-draft-player-profile-ed-howard/
I do not believe our good depth at the position will be the reason they pass on him.
I appreciate your input, and it only adds to my "liking"...still, lots of of other good players to choose from, for sure.
 

Derek

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I do not believe our good depth at the position will be the reason they pass on him.
I appreciate your input, and it only adds to my "liking"...still, lots of of other good players to choose from, for sure.
Agreed.

No MLB team is drafting according to need given the volatility of prospects.
 

MadThinker88

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Agreed.
No MLB team is drafting according to need given the volatility of prospects.
Not arguing with you. But given the small number in this draft class & the believed construction of the Tribe's J2 2020 international class (only 3 pitchers in it), I could see adjustments being made.

The Tribe might have Ed Howard as the BPA on their board when its time for their 1st round pick and go for a pitcher..
It could see them making the adjustment multiple times during the draft. IF a position player was the BPA each time the Tribe was to select, I would be stunned for 4 or more position players to be taken by the Tribe.

It doesn't ring true for the Tribe to have only 6 (or fewer) pitching prospects drafted/ lined up going into UDFA signing period after the draft this month..
 

sportscoach

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Not arguing with you. But given the small number in this draft class & the believed construction of the Tribe's J2 2020 international class (only 3 pitchers in it), I could see adjustments being made.

The Tribe might have Ed Howard as the BPA on their board when its time for their 1st round pick and go for a pitcher..
It could see them making the adjustment multiple times during the draft. IF a position player was the BPA each time the Tribe was to select, I would be stunned for 4 or more position players to be taken by the Tribe.

It doesn't ring true for the Tribe to have only 6 (or fewer) pitching prospects drafted/ lined up going into UDFA signing period after the draft this month..
You can never have too much pitching is what they say. The draft is BPA and sign ability at the end of the day. I would still personally take BPA even if its straight position. Success rates of the draft say just get the top player in your board you feel you can sign since so many fail.

I am actually curious who we could end up bringing in as free agents from after the draft. High School guys who don't get drafted will likely do college. College guys who don't get drafted could easily just go back. I wanna see who they bring in more than who they draft since guys like Plesac, Tomlin, Roberto etc weren't early guys who succeed to getting to the pros. I wonder if we can find another one from those guys we bring in that way.
 

Wham with the Right Hand

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Thanks for sharing the Minor League Baseball Report MT88. Good stuff.

No left-handed pitchers until Allen at #14. Some things never change.

Triston McKenzie, who was #1 or #2 for what seemed like forever, is circling the drain.

Three shortstops in the top 10. I wonder how many of them stay at short?

Five infielders in the top 10. That's a good thing considering Lindor will be leaving, Santana's age, and we probably won't ever see Hernandez play.

Not much in the outfield but with Mercado, Reyes, and Luplow all between 24-26 and with several years of team control we should be OK there.

With Berto being 31 years old we better hope Naylor comes through. I don't think we have much else in the system at catcher. Fortunately, Berto doesn't have too much wear and tear since he was a backup until last year.

I would consider switching Jones to 1B to groom as Santana's eventual replacement. One of the shortstops can be moved to third when we can't afford Hosey any longer.
 

Derek

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Thanks for sharing the Minor League Baseball Report MT88. Good stuff.

No left-handed pitchers until Allen at #14. Some things never change.

Triston McKenzie, who was #1 or #2 for what seemed like forever, is circling the drain.
Circling the drain is a strong choice of words. He missed last season with a back strain. It's not like he has arm issues. He's been dominant all the way up through AA. We should definitely still be excited about him.

Three shortstops in the top 10. I wonder how many of them stay at short?

Five infielders in the top 10. That's a good thing considering Lindor will be leaving, Santana's age, and we probably won't ever see Hernandez play.

Not much in the outfield but with Mercado, Reyes, and Luplow all between 24-26 and with several years of team control we should be OK there.
Out of the top guys, Freeman seems the least likely to stick at SS. 2B seems like his ultimate destination.

We also have Valera and Daniel Johnson developing as OF with Nolan Jones as a likely OF if he doesn't pan out at 3B.

With Berto being 31 years old we better hope Naylor comes through. I don't think we have much else in the system at catcher. Fortunately, Berto doesn't have too much wear and tear since he was a backup until last year.

I would consider switching Jones to 1B to groom as Santana's eventual replacement. One of the shortstops can be moved to third when we can't afford Hosey any longer.
Jones is too good of an athlete to relegate to 1B so early in his career. If we can't retain Santana on a team-friendly deal, Bobby Bradley certainly deserves a chance to fill that role before we look elsewhere.
 

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@Derek @MadThinker88 just to respond to both of you.

I am sure Jones would take 1B if that means he gets to the pros quicker, but I've always felt Jones will end up in the OF. Bradley does need to get the chance, but i am not 100% sold he will make at 1st base. I dont trust Jones being a legit 3B defensively so thats why LF/RF or 1B could be something in the cards, but he is a 2021 debut with injuries and 22 has a chance of everyday player.

We need to replace 2B next season most likely, Then SS may not be there if we cannot resign Lindor. If we don't resign Lindor, I personally would trade Ramirez (because of what we could get in return possibly) so that means all three positions would be open so having that many INF prospects is perfectly fine since you always need your starters and utility guys. Making 22 a retool/rebuild season.

McKenzie reminds me of Sale body wise. Both very tall and very skinny, and had the same concern as Sale does about if his body can handle a workload of a starter or not. So far his body hasn't held up, but he is still super young and if he can add the right strength, he could move on from the injuries since i think its more just growing into his body than mechanical or fragility.
 

Derek

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@Derek @MadThinker88 just to respond to both of you.

I am sure Jones would take 1B if that means he gets to the pros quicker, but I've always felt Jones will end up in the OF. Bradley does need to get the chance, but i am not 100% sold he will make at 1st base. I dont trust Jones being a legit 3B defensively so thats why LF/RF or 1B could be something in the cards, but he is a 2021 debut with injuries and 22 has a chance of everyday player.

We need to replace 2B next season most likely, Then SS may not be there if we cannot resign Lindor. If we don't resign Lindor, I personally would trade Ramirez (because of what we could get in return possibly) so that means all three positions would be open so having that many INF prospects is perfectly fine since you always need your starters and utility guys. Making 22 a retool/rebuild season.

McKenzie reminds me of Sale body wise. Both very tall and very skinny, and had the same concern as Sale does about if his body can handle a workload of a starter or not. So far his body hasn't held up, but he is still super young and if he can add the right strength, he could move on from the injuries since i think its more just growing into his body than mechanical or fragility.
I wouldn't be surprised if Cesar re-upped, especially if there's no season this year. Jose is also an option over there, especially with Jones knocking on the door at 3B.

Trading Jose would make no sense to me as he is just entering his prime years at a heavily discounted rate. If we're going to trade him, why even bother fielding a team?

Sale's problem was never his body, but rather his unorthodox arm movements. McKenzie's arm motion is fine, and his issues have seemingly been unrelated to workload.
 

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I wouldn't be surprised if Cesar re-upped, especially if there's no season this year. Jose is also an option over there, especially with Jones knocking on the door at 3B.

Trading Jose would make no sense to me as he is just entering his prime years at a heavily discounted rate. If we're going to trade him, why even bother fielding a team?

Sale's problem was never his body, but rather his unorthodox arm movements. McKenzie's arm motion is fine, and his issues have seemingly been unrelated to workload.
About Jose being traded, I meant for the season if Lindor leaves as a free agent in 22, we could look at trading him (and maybe Clev if we cannot extend him) to help retool and keep us in contention long term. Now its in the mode of we dont have to trade him and we may not, but if we get a great offer, then we could. But it's not necessary, I am just thinking we could get a major haul and helps us long term. So thats a decision to make after the 21 season/if Lindor doesn't resign.

Well that is true, but Sale and McKenzie are so skinny for their builds. In basketball or football their bodies wouldn't likely hold up cause of how skinny they are. I personally am just afraid of the ability to stay healthy with that body type regardless of mechanics. If Sale though for the most part could avoid injuries for the majority of their career, then McKenzie if he trains right could avoid injuries as well.
 

Derek

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About Jose being traded, I meant for the season if Lindor leaves as a free agent in 22, we could look at trading him (and maybe Clev if we cannot extend him) to help retool and keep us in contention long term. Now its in the mode of we dont have to trade him and we may not, but if we get a great offer, then we could. But it's not necessary, I am just thinking we could get a major haul and helps us long term. So thats a decision to make after the 21 season/if Lindor doesn't resign.

Well that is true, but Sale and McKenzie are so skinny for their builds. In basketball or football their bodies wouldn't likely hold up cause of how skinny they are. I personally am just afraid of the ability to stay healthy with that body type regardless of mechanics. If Sale though for the most part could avoid injuries for the majority of their career, then McKenzie if he trains right could avoid injuries as well.
I know I'm in the minority on this, but I don't think our wins and losses will be impacted much if Lindor departs. So, retooling isn't something I really see as necessary.

As far as I'm concerned we should just keep doing what we're doing, and that doesn't include trading away guys in their prime that can't sign elsewhere until 2024.
 

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