2020 NBA Draft

[inliner311]

Why do people keep suggesting drafting guards when @Randolphkeys keeps saying the only valuable inside info has the Cavaliers NOT taking a guard?

Because the Cavs have always been fairly tight lip about their draft evaluations and process. We didn't know about Anthony Bennett until draft day. Garland wasn't even on the radar to go to the Cavs until right around the draft. Dion Waiters didn't even work out for the Cavs.

It's hard to know if the Cavs are putting out real info or disinformation especially leading up to the draft.

 

[ajz20]

Hey, I don't know exactly what the Cavs have in mind. They may move Exum and a young player to completely change the needs of the team.

I do know that Joe Vardon of The Athletic has some insight into what the front office is looking to do, and he has said on the Wine and Gold podcast:

1. The Cavs are unlikely to draft a guard

2. They believe Kevin Porter Jr. Is "the guy" on the roster so far

and lastly

3. They view Porter as a shooting guard.

I ripped this off of Hoopshype:

“I think the other big takeaways that I have from this year, the belief in Kevin Porter Jr. It’s now gone into the coaching staff, it’s now gone into the players. This organization believes that he’s the one. If there is a focal point, if there is somebody that’s going to change the trajectory of this rebuild and change the timeline potentially of this rebuild, it’s going to be him.”

So if they are saying this 6'4 (6'5.5 in shoes) kid is at his best at shooting guard, that is better evidence than what one guy on RCF believes.

Help me out keys. People are taking about drafting another pg, who is neither a great outside shooter or athlete when we just drafted two pgs who still need time to develop themselves, while having a glaring whole at sf. To top it off the guy people are asking for is the thought Of by many as the third best pg prospect in a weak draft. Finally Sexton is not big enough to guard wings full time. Especially in a league where there are swing guys that play the 3/4 who are considered wings.
A guy like Vassell out of FSU seems like a much more logical selection. Porter And Vasell and the winner of the Garland Sexton battle at pg is a lineup that has some very nice potential! That is a much better way to build a roster versus drafting a big pg, when the team already has spent significant draft capital on the position. Luckily the Cavs have indicated they agree with us. Thank you for listening !

 

[inliner311]

Help me out keys. People are taking about drafting another pg, who is neither a great outside shooter or athlete when we just drafted two pgs who still need time to develop themselves, while having a glaring whole at sf. To top it off the guy people are asking for is the thought Of by many as the third best pg prospect in a weak draft. Finally Sexton is not big enough to guard wings full time. Especially in a league where there are swing guys that play the 3/4 who are considered wings.
A guy like Vassell out of FSU seems like a much more logical selection. Porter And Vasell and the winner of the Garland Sexton battle at pg is a lineup that has some very nice potential! That is a much better way to build a roster versus drafting a big pg, when the team already has spent significant draft capital on the position. Luckily the Cavs have indicated they agree with us. Thank you for listening !

Why do you keep saying Haliburton isn't a good outside shooter? He might be the best in this year's draft. Also if you look at his freshman highlight, you can see some real athleticism in his game. His sophomore highlights are more him playing in the half court but as a freshman playing off the ball, he has some impressive transition skills.

He shot 43% from 3 his freshman year and 42% his sophomore year. Half his shots came from 3 his sophomore year so he doesn't have a low attempt count.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Help me out keys. People are taking about drafting another pg, who is neither a great outside shooter or athlete when we just drafted two pgs who still need time to develop themselves, while having a glaring whole at sf. To top it off the guy people are asking for is the thought Of by many as the third best pg prospect in a weak draft. Finally Sexton is not big enough to guard wings full time. Especially in a league where there are swing guys that play the 3/4 who are considered wings.
A guy like Vassell out of FSU seems like a much more logical selection. Porter And Vasell and the winner of the Garland Sexton battle at pg is a lineup that has some very nice potential! That is a much better way to build a roster versus drafting a big pg, when the team already has spent significant draft capital on the position. Luckily the Cavs have indicated they agree with us. Thank you for listening !

Haliburton isn't off my list just yet. He is an efficient player with switch upside. He has a slow release and he gets gun-shy, but he can shoot accurately. I just believe it is much more likely they go for somebody who can be a two way forward next season. We know they really wanted De'Andre Hunter last season but had to settle for Garland as BPA. I think they would still really prefer a piece like that for their rebuild, if they determine that guy is available.

I want measurements and gym workouts, then I'll settle in on a top 5 players.

Until then, I got the top four as Edwards, Wiseman, Ball, and Avdija. One of those guys slides to five, Koby had a good day.

 

[Cavatt]

Why do you keep saying Haliburton isn't a good outside shooter? He might be the best in this year's draft. Also if you look at his freshman highlight, you can see some real athleticism in his game. His sophomore highlights are more him playing in the half court but as a freshman playing off the ball, he has some impressive transition skills.

He shot 43% from 3 his freshman year and 42% his sophomore year. Half his shots came from 3 his sophomore year so he doesn't have a low attempt count.

I think his athleticism is underrated a little like KPJ. Now KPJ is actually a really good athlete, but people underestimated his pop because he moves slowly and can accelerate fast. It's also why I like the SGA comparison because it looks liek they aren't athletic, but they are just playing the right speed for their competition. The clue to how fast they can move is in their steals.

 

[daytripper]

Why do people keep suggesting drafting guards when @Randolphkeys keeps saying the only valuable inside info has the Cavaliers NOT taking a guard?

I believe Haliburton and Hayes *may* be the 2 best talents available at #5. Haliburton may be the best fit next to Sexton too.
I'm not getting into this debate because I'm resigned to the fact they are most likely taking a wing which means Okoro, Vassell or possibly Avdija assuming they stay at 5.
I strongly believe they will need another ballhandler esp with Delly gone but highly doubt they get him thru the draft. What we really need is a 6'-8" guy that can play defense and initiate the offense. Any of those available?

 

[inliner311]

I think his athleticism is underrated a little like KPJ. Now KPJ is actually a really good athlete, but people underestimated his pop because he moves slowly and can accelerate fast. It's also why I like the SGA comparison because it looks liek they aren't athletic, but they are just playing the right speed for their competition. The clue to how fast they can move is in their steals.

This is his freshman highlights.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

I'm still intrigued by what GSW actually does with #2. Under most circumstances, Wiggins' contract will be a non-starter for most teams. They need someone that doesn't have to take back Wiggins' contract and can provide value.

If I'm NO, I'm calling GSW trying to convince them to do this. This trade does work in several trade checkers:

Lonzo
Hart
Alexander-Walker
Melli

for

Looney
Poole
#2

NO can include #13 if they need to, but I'm not sure it's necessary in this case.

Warriors add some quality depth and can bring back the death lineup with Curry, Ball, Thompson, Wiggins, and Green. They'd need to fill in the C spot, but that team at least has a shot.

Pretty obvious why you do this for the Pelicans. Adding another elite player on a rookie deal and not having to pay Ball next year is a pretty big deal when you look long-term. At #2 they could take Wiseman or Edwards. Likely to be Wiseman. Then you have a young frontcourt of Ingram, Zion, Wiseman, and Hayes locked up long-term.

If the Pelicans released Miller, they'd be able to sign a high-level FA. Someone like VanVleet would be a great fit there and could play next to Jrue. I'd also probably put a big-money offer out to Bogdanovic and force SAC to match. They'd still have #13 to add someone like Williams or Nesmith and a few million more for FA.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Why do people keep suggesting drafting guards when @Randolphkeys keeps saying the only valuable inside info has the Cavaliers NOT taking a guard?

They can go ahead and talk about guards for the next few months, and I'm not upset or anything... just providing some perspective on what is being floated in the media. If a trade materializes, the Cavs might both need a guard and not have the #5 pick. Who knows.

 

[inliner311]

I'm still intrigued by what GSW actually does with #2. Under most circumstances, Wiggins' contract will be a non-starter for most teams. They need someone that doesn't have to take back Wiggins' contract and can provide value.

If I'm NO, I'm calling GSW trying to convince them to do this. This trade does work in several trade checkers:

Lonzo
Hart
Alexander-Walker
Melli

for

Looney
Poole
#2

NO can include #13 if they need to, but I'm not sure it's necessary in this case.

Warriors add some quality depth and can bring back the death lineup with Curry, Ball, Thompson, Wiggins, and Green. They'd need to fill in the C spot, but that team at least has a shot.

Pretty obvious why you do this for the Pelicans. Adding another elite player on a rookie deal and not having to pay Ball next year is a pretty big deal when you look long-term. At #2 they could take Wiseman or Edwards. Likely to be Wiseman. Then you have a young frontcourt of Ingram, Zion, Wiseman, and Hayes locked up long-term.

If the Pelicans released Miller, they'd be able to sign a high-level FA. Someone like VanVleet would be a great fit there and could play next to Jrue. I'd also probably put a big-money offer out to Bogdanovic and force SAC to match. They'd still have #13 to add someone like Williams or Nesmith and a few million more for FA.

If the warriors want to give up #2, the Cavs should offer Drummond and Garland for #2 and Wiggins. The Cavs then have a ton of options to really mould this team with #2 and #5. They just got to deal with that Wiggins contract for a couple years.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

If the warriors want to give up #2, the Cavs should offer Drummond and Garland for #2 and Wiggins. The Cavs then have a ton of options to really mould this team with #2 and #5. They just got to deal with that Wiggins contract for a couple years.

I don't see how this makes the Warriors any better. They add a C who doesn't fit all that well with Green. They're going to have to change the way they play basketball to take advantage of said C. They don't have control over Drummond, and if he walks in 2021, it doesn't create any significant cap room to replace him. They don't add any depth on the wing. Garland is still completely unproven and can't be counted on for anything significant.

While GSW will be motivated to get out of Wiggins' contract, I don't think they'll just give him away. He's overpaid, but he's still a young'ish guy you can start at SG or SF and can get you 20 PPG, 5 reb, and 4 ast. GSW can't trade him and get nothing back on the wing.

All of the above is why I think that NO trade makes a ton of sense. GSW starts Curry, Ball, Thompson, Green, ____ with Wiggins, Hart, Paschall, Alexander-Walker, and others off the bench. That's a significantly stronger team overall and better fits the way they want to play basketball. Barring being able to trade for Simmons, Beal, or someone like that, I think they'd be hard-pressed to find a better result.

 

[adam81king]

A better, in my mind, deal with the Warriors would be Kevin Love and #5 for Wiggins and #2. Almost even money. Love fits them better. They can get Avdija, possibly, at #5. We can get Wiseman or Ball at #2.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Just don't forget the Warriors received two picks to take on the Wiggins contract, including a top three protected first rounder. His value isn't that high.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

A better, in my mind, deal with the Warriors would be Kevin Love and #5 for Wiggins and #2. Almost even money. Love fits them better. They can get Avdija, possibly, at #5. We can get Wiseman or Ball at #2.

As much as they might not want to pay Wiggins' salary, they only have a few more years of competing with Curry, Thompson, and Green before some major change has to occur. I think they'd keep Wiggins if they can do so and add quality depth. Trading Wiggins also leaves a big hole on the perimeter that needs to be filled. Unless they plan on trading Green, I don't see how adding Love helps much.

I also didn't realize that GSW has a $17 mill TPE, so they could add a guy without sending anyone out. So that means trades like these could certainly happen:

Oubre & #10 for #2 - Suns get pick of Ball, Hayes, and Deni.
Ball & Hart (#13 if needed) for #2
Smart, Theis, #14, #26 for Looney and #2

Those are all much better trades for them than anything involving Love or Drummond plus they keep Wiggins on the roster.

 

[inliner311]

As much as they might not want to pay Wiggins' salary, they only have a few more years of competing with Curry, Thompson, and Green before some major change has to occur. I think they'd keep Wiggins if they can do so and add quality depth. Trading Wiggins also leaves a big hole on the perimeter that needs to be filled. Unless they plan on trading Green, I don't see how adding Love helps much.

I also didn't realize that GSW has a $17 mill TPE, so they could add a guy without sending anyone out. So that means trades like these could certainly happen:

Oubre & #10 for #2 - Suns get pick of Ball, Hayes, and Deni.
Ball & Hart (#13 if needed) for #2
Smart, Theis, #14, #26 for Looney and #2

Those are all much better trades for them than anything involving Love or Drummond plus they keep Wiggins on the roster.

One thing if they add another star is they will get that bump in Vet free agents signing with them. Garland and Drummond give them a player for the future and a star in his prime. If adding an all-star center like Drummond doesn't work out they can move him much easier than Wiggins at the deadline. Salary cap possibly going down and how much they already have committed in the future, I'm not sure they want to pay a massive luxury tax for Wiggins. I think they are less likely to take on Love because of his contract. Drummond gives them flexibility especially with the picks they have from the Wiggins trade.