2020 NBA Draft

[Ozone]

We know the Cavs love hard workers who improve, and very few college players improved from their freshman season to their sophomore season as Robert Woodard II. He was a backup PF as a freshman who became a go-to scorer as an undersized power forward as a sophomore, adding that shooting range in the off-season. I was interested to learn his father is still the all-time scoring leader for Mississippi high school basketball and also an alum at Mississippi State. If he is still there at the top of the second, I'd jump on it.

I think he wants to play the 3 primarily at the next level but that is part of the problem being a sub par ball handler and cutter so he may have to sell himself as an undersized 4. at least to get drafted. He is athletic so he might be able to do it.
Not sold on the shooting yet, % went up but on low attempts and the ft % is less than 70 and thats being nice.
He is a solid explosive rebounder and defender but I would not expect the shooting,handle or cutting to improve enough to take him in the first. As is he is a 4 in a 3's body that should become a decent bench rotation stretch 4 that can finish strong above the rim in open straight line drives.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I think he wants to play the 3 primarily at the next level but that is part of the problem being a sub par ball handler and cutter so he may have to sell himself as an undersized 4. at least to get drafted. He is athletic so he might be able to do it.
Not sold on the shooting yet, % went up but on low attempts and the ft % is less than 70 and thats being nice.
He is a solid explosive rebounder and defender but I would not expect the shooting,handle or cutting to improve enough to take him in the first. As is he is a 4 in a 3's body that should become a decent bench rotation stretch 4 that can finish strong above the rim in open straight line drives.

Yeah, his dribbling reminds me of Sasha Pavlovic, and that isn't a compliment. When you are talking about an early 2nd round type of talent, there will be holes. I prefer taking a shot at a player who is young and improving, especially after seeing a lot of blue chippers at the top of this draft who really didn't do much to raise their stock. His off-the-ball awareness on defense and NBA ready body & athleticism are already going to give him a chance to see minutes.


Paul Reed of DePaul is another guy in that late first/early second conversation who would be worth trading back into the draft. I just believe a playoff team will snatch him up before the second round begins. He might be the most versatile defender in the draft and you can hide him on offense until his three point stroke becomes more consistent. Chances are, I will get excited for second round sleepers only to watch the Cavs decide not to trade back into the draft.

 

[I'mWithDan]

What position would he play here? Are you thinking Sexton PG, Edwards SG, or Sexton SG, Edwards SF, and trade for a PG?

From the Cavs perspective, I really think the only 1.5 future pieces they have are Sexton and KPJ. KPJ I'm more luke warm on but I think he potentially has a place in a top 8 rotation.

To me, Collin's destiny is still 6th man of the year type, as a bench scorer.......so I think fit consideration is just largely overblown at this stage....because I think the top 5 in our rotation, if we are talking about building a championship team, is still vacant.

Just find the best player.......I think bad organizations aren't honest with themselves and build around talent that just isn't good enough. You need a star or at least a fringe star prior to considering who goes where IMO.

My view is Sexton and KPJ are reserve players on a good team.......so drafting in to their starting minutes isn't ideal for their development but it just is what it is. I don't know if Edwards will be good.....but if the org thinks he's the best player, I think you just take him and see where the chips fall from a roster perspective.

 

[Cavatt]

From the Cavs perspective, I really think the only 1.5 future pieces they have are Sexton and KPJ. KPJ I'm more luke warm on but I think he potentially has a place in a top 8 rotation.

To me, Collin's destiny is still 6th man of the year type, as a bench scorer.......so I think fit consideration is just largely overblown at this stage....because I think the top 5 in our rotation, if we are talking about building a championship team, is still vacant.

Just find the best player.......I think bad organizations aren't honest with themselves and build around talent that just isn't good enough. You need a star or at least a fringe star prior to considering who goes where IMO.

My view is Sexton and KPJ are reserve players on a good team.......so drafting in to their starting minutes isn't ideal for their development but it just is what it is. I don't know if Edwards will be good.....but if the org thinks he's the best player, I think you just take him and see where the chips fall from a roster perspective.

What is your perspective on playing time though? There is no way you can maximize playing time for guys if you have a glut of guards. At some point you have to prioritize playing time if not fit.

It's hard enough saying which tiers guys are in for this draft. There might be 7 guys in tier one in this draft, but it is lower than other years. I find it hard not to even think about fit at all at least from a minutes perspective because one thing is for sure. If a guy doesn't get minutes you cannot properly evaluate them.

 

[Nathan S]

From the Cavs perspective, I really think the only 1.5 future pieces they have are Sexton and KPJ. KPJ I'm more luke warm on but I think he potentially has a place in a top 8 rotation.

To me, Collin's destiny is still 6th man of the year type, as a bench scorer.......so I think fit consideration is just largely overblown at this stage....because I think the top 5 in our rotation, if we are talking about building a championship team, is still vacant.

Just find the best player.......I think bad organizations aren't honest with themselves and build around talent that just isn't good enough. You need a star or at least a fringe star prior to considering who goes where IMO.

My view is Sexton and KPJ are reserve players on a good team.......so drafting in to their starting minutes isn't ideal for their development but it just is what it is. I don't know if Edwards will be good.....but if the org thinks he's the best player, I think you just take him and see where the chips fall from a roster perspective.

I get the argument for ignoring fit, but don't see how it works here specifically. Even if you feel Sexton is a future 6th man, I don't see any way the Cavs are going to bench him for next season. Given that, I see three possible options:

1. Go without a true point guard. It's an option, but it's been disastrous for us in the past. Certainly doesn't create ideal conditions for Edwards' development.

2. Start Garland/Sexton/Edwards. Also an option, but leaves us really undersized on the perimeter, forces Edwards to play out of position, and it'll be hard to find enough touches for all three of those guys (and Love).

3. Bring Edwards off the bench. This seems like the most sane option if we draft him, but it comes with its own issues, of course.

 

[Goldin Brown]

I get the argument for ignoring fit, but don't see how it works here specifically. Even if you feel Sexton is a future 6th man, I don't see any way the Cavs are going to bench him for next season. Given that, I see three possible options:

1. Go without a true point guard. It's an option, but it's been disastrous for us in the past. Certainly doesn't create ideal conditions for Edwards' development.

2. Start Garland/Sexton/Edwards. Also an option, but leaves us really undersized on the perimeter, forces Edwards to play out of position, and it'll be hard to find enough touches for all three of those guys (and Love).

3. Bring Edwards off the bench. This seems like the most sane option if we draft him, but it comes with its own issues, of course.

I think if we draft Edwards, it would be wise trade one of the other guards. If you don't want to do that, then you are going to have to hurt someone's feelings, and that may lead to guys wanting to leave at their first opportunity.

Seems like Collin would be the odd man out unless you want to force him into a sixth man role. He's got the most value, I think, and it doesn't seem like the organization knows what to do with him. I know he's going to blow up as soon as we trade him but I think you would have to bite the bullet and do it in this scenario.

 

[Ozone]

I think at this point Edwards is tiny bit overrated as a NBA ready player by some outlets.
He is not a high iq option in this class.
He has the prototypical explosive athleticism a great handles elite strength attacking and finishing ability and even showed some flashes of ability to go on hot streaks from way down town and play some man defense ehen interested.
However his ranking is a product of few others having those standout transferable skills more than anything , yet here is a kid who spent a lot of time loafing when not engaged on a meh roster and tbh was a high usage chucker at times and it is something to take into consideration that the Cavs Coaches could in fact not be able to keep him interested unless he is treated like the first option from the jump. Maybe he should be but i wouldn't.
I like his floor and his upside at pick 3-6 regardless of fit but I would trade down from 1 or 2 and pass on him if the calls came flooding in.

 

[Cavatt]

I get the argument for ignoring fit, but don't see how it works here specifically. Even if you feel Sexton is a future 6th man, I don't see any way the Cavs are going to bench him for next season. Given that, I see three possible options:

1. Go without a true point guard. It's an option, but it's been disastrous for us in the past. Certainly doesn't create ideal conditions for Edwards' development.

2. Start Garland/Sexton/Edwards. Also an option, but leaves us really undersized on the perimeter, forces Edwards to play out of position, and it'll be hard to find enough touches for all three of those guys (and Love).

3. Bring Edwards off the bench. This seems like the most sane option if we draft him, but it comes with its own issues, of course.

Edwards probably makes the most sense off the bench. I agree with that. You can bench Darius for Ball perhaps, but not for Edwards. If anything it would be like have Collin and Rookie Collin on at the sametime.

 

[cabs]

The second round prospect I like isn't a secret anymore, Robert Woodard II.


Isn't much of a dribbler or playmaker, but with some work on his perimeter defense I see a very good depth small forward. Legit three point shooter, 6-foot-7 with a 7-foot-1 wingspan and good athleticism. I've watched a lot of Killian Tillie of Gonzaga, and he could be a project big.

That is a sexy wingspan

 

[I'mWithDan]

1. Go without a true point guard. It's an option, but it's been disastrous for us in the past. Certainly doesn't create ideal conditions for Edwards' development.

True, and I think you have accurately described the options. To me, you just go with 1 and see what happens.

Edwards value at the next level is if he can develop in to a high usage scorer......I think 2's who dominate the ball more don't necessarily need a true PG. To me, it is far more important for Klay Thompson types, who have to learn to get their own offense.

For example, Wade played with "Skip To My Lou" as a rookie. In his second year, Damon Jones. His usage is what you would expect Edwards to be, if he pans out......so I just think he has less reliance on an offense initiator or playmaker next to him.

 

[Nathan S]

True, and I think you have accurately described the options. To me, you just go with 1 and see what happens.

Edwards value at the next level is if he can develop in to a high usage scorer......I think 2's who dominate the ball more don't necessarily need a true PG. To me, it is far more important for Klay Thompson types, who have to learn to get their own offense.

For example, Wade played with "Skip To My Lou" as a rookie. In his second year, Damon Jones. His usage is what you would expect Edwards to be, if he pans out......so I just think he has less reliance on an offense initiator or playmaker next to him.

Alston averaged 10.2 points, 4.5 assists, and 1.6 turnovers per game that season, as a 27-year-old veteran. I'd agree that a player like him would be a fine backcourt partner for rookie Edwards. But that's not the kind of player Sexton is, obviously, aside from vaguely-similar assists per game numbers.

A further complication is that Edwards is still extremely raw, and showed very clearly last season that he didn't know what to do when given the keys to the offense. I'm not saying that to bash him as a prospect...he's one of the youngest guys in the draft, of course, and I think he *could* eventually develop into an efficient, ball-dominant combo guard. But he won't be a similar rookie to Wade, who came into the league at age 21 after dropping a 29 point triple double on Kentucky in the NCAA tournament.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I'd definitely agree that Young Skip and veteran Miami Skip were two different players. I always targeted him in fantasy hoops because aside from a low field goal percentage, he was an efficient veteran by the end who was smart with the ball.

I was recently listening to an interview of ex-Warriors GM Larry Riley. He talked about how they viewed Steph as a true point guard they could build a team around with Monta Ellis as a scorer, and trying to figure out the future of the franchise with an undersized back court. He talked about making trade offers which packaged Steph and other players and eventually pivoted the discussion to Monta in place of Steph. This checks out an long-standing inside scoop RCF carried that at one point, the Cavs talked to G.S. about a deal for Klay and Steph for Kyrie. Multiple Steph deals were out there, but they weren't going to do it until a team agreed to swap out Monta. That is how Bogut ended up in the Bay Area.

So applying the Larry Riley situation to the Cavs, while the Cavs might talk publicly about Garland and Sexton as a starting back court, I'd be shocked if they are both Cavaliers by the time Sexton's rookie deal runs out.

 

[Adam]

I'd definitely agree that Young Skip and veteran Miami Skip were two different players. I always targeted him in fantasy hoops because aside from a low field goal percentage, he was an efficient veteran by the end who was smart with the ball.

I was recently listening to an interview of ex-Warriors GM Larry Riley. He talked about how they viewed Steph as a true point guard they could build a team around with Monta Ellis as a scorer, and trying to figure out the future of the franchise with an undersized back court. He talked about making trade offers which packaged Steph and other players and eventually pivoted the discussion to Monta in place of Steph. This checks out an long-standing inside scoop RCF carried that at one point, the Cavs talked to G.S. about a deal for Klay and Steph for Kyrie. Multiple Steph deals were out there, but they weren't going to do it until a team agreed to swap out Monta. That is how Bogut ended up in the Bay Area.

So applying the Larry Riley situation to the Cavs, while the Cavs might talk publicly about Garland and Sexton as a starting back court, I'd be shocked if they are both Cavaliers by the time Sexton's rookie deal runs out.

I never really thought it but Monta and Collin are kind equivalents. Pint sized point getters who dont do much else. If only Darius can grow into Steph!

 

[Randolphkeys]

I never really thought it but Monta and Collin are kind equivalents. Pint sized point getters who dont do much else. If only Darius can grow into Steph!

I believe Sexton and Garland had different skill sets when they were drafted, with Sexton being more of a Monta and Garland being more of a Steph. From there, they get to be their own players with their own futures. I'll take Sexton's mindset and work ethic over Monta's. I don't believe it's fair to expect Garland to be Steph. I do believe they are in a competition to stay on the Cavs as the future point guard whether it is discussed publicly or not.

 

[Nathan S]

I never really thought it but Monta and Collin are kind equivalents. Pint sized point getters who dont do much else. If only Darius can grow into Steph!

Don't hate the comparison qualitatively, but quantitatively, Collin is way ahead of Monta as a scorer.

Per-100 (rookie): Ellis 19.4 points (48.6% true shooting), Sexton 26.1 points (52.0% true shooting)
Per-100 (soph.): Ellis 23.3 points (54.5% true shooting), Sexton 30.6 points (56.0% true shooting)

Collin's sophomore year scoring numbers were better (per-possession) than Monta's scoring numbers at his peak.