2021 Draft Prospects Thread

[Randolphkeys]

It's really going to be tough to count on Delpit for anything given that free agency and the draft both likely will occur before the next time anyone steps on the field. We're very weak at corner other than the oft-injured Ward, and our linebackers couldn't cover the 600 pound life guy. I just don't see how improving pass coverage isn't our #1 need defensively.

We're not going to slow down the Chiefs by adding a stud pass rusher.

Delpit was injured in August. He is already five plus months into his rehabilitation. I'd think in a month they would have some idea, maybe not the full understanding, of where Delpit is in his healing process.

If your concern is a strong investment in the defensive back seven, drafting the starting defensive end to compete with Porter Gustin should be exactly what you want the Browns to do.

A starting veteran defensive end is going to be expensive and limit the free agent money the Browns could spend in the defensive backfield. Adrian Clayborn cost 6 million last season to be the third end. An upgrade would certainly cost more, especially since Clowney turned the Browns down at almost 20 million a season. Meanwhile, 20 million a season could pay for two starting defensive backs.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

If your concern is a strong investment in the defensive back seven, drafting the starting defensive end to compete with Porter Gustin should be exactly what you want the Browns to do.

A starting veteran defensive end is going to be expensive and limit the free agent money the Browns could spend in the defensive backfield. Adrian Clayborn cost 6 million last season to be the third end. An upgrade would certainly cost more, especially since Clowney turned the Browns down at almost 20 million a season. Meanwhile, 20 million a season could pay for two starting defensive backs.

If we fill all our back 7 needs in free agency prior to the draft, then sure, draft an eDGE. I just think that is extraordinarily unlikely because those needs are so immense.

ETA: To put it differently, I would prioritize our defense in this order:

1) CB
2a) S
2b) LB strong in coverage
3) interior pass rusher
4) eDGE rusher

 

[adam81king]

At this point I trust DePo, Berry and Stefanski to play chess with the roster. If thats a DE, IDL, LB, CD, S, WR, P, K or RB, I'll raise my eyebrows at something unexpected, but wait to see what happens. We all have our opinions on what the Browns *should* do, and it's fun to talk about, but let's keep in mind these guys took us from 6-10 to a couple plays from the Super Bowl in one highly compromised off-season. They arent Dwight Clark or Butch Davis or anyone else we've experienced for the last 2 decades.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I just saw this tweet from Lane Atkins, I tend to agree...


There are multiple ways to reshape the defense and juggle available money. The Browns can spend on an edge, they can cut a cost elsewhere and get younger... I can't imagine there is just one way to reshape the defense.

What everyone agrees upon is that multiple defensive spots need upgrading.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

If memory serves me correctly, there haven't been many DE's at the end of the first that I've been excited about. Meanwhile, there have been loads of corners and safeties that I thought should have been top 15-20 picks that were still hanging around.

I'm not sure if this draft will play out in a similar fashion, but if it does, there could be a larger gap in talent than there is in positional need.

But hey, if we get a repeat of last year and a talent like Yetur Gross-Matos is still around at 26, sign me up for that (although I still would've taken McKinney, Delpit or Winfield over him).

 

[AZ_]

I dislike him as a first round talent. He's a pass rushing specialist until he learns how to read and react rather than just rush up field every down.

His footwork is also terrible, IMO.

I don't disagree that he is not a finished product with regards to the moves, but the production and sheer value he brought to these games where he kept exploding and making consistently huge plays made me a believer.

Production + Room to Grow


Really waiting to see the body metrics and length. The arms look crazy long, but does he have the bulk to play with his hand down on the left side is the biggest question I have outside of the coachability aspect.

Pairing him with Garrett and Richardson, two veterans who I'd put right up there with just about anyone in this league, is a ++ in the development side for me.

They really need to find that other side DE for this defense to reach its potential.

 

[prf100]

I just saw this tweet from Lane Atkins, I tend to agree...


There are multiple ways to reshape the defense and juggle available money. The Browns can spend on an edge, they can cut a cost elsewhere and get younger... I can't imagine there is just one way to reshape the defense.

What everyone agrees upon is that multiple defensive spots need upgrading.

Cannot stand attempting to plug one hole by certainly creating another one.

 

[MirORich]

I don’t understand why anyone makes the argument about not counting on Delpit while simultaneosly acting like there is any more certainty of what a rookie is going to bring. If you liked Delpit at LSU, and if you like and believe are soon to be drafted rookies will make an impact, than you should presume Delpit is just as likely(or not likely) as the newly drafted rookies to make an impact. If anything, he’s more ready because he already has been around the team and scheme for a year.

For defensive improvement, we will be relying on:
-newly signed FAs
-newly drafted players
-return/debut of Delpit, Billings, Greedy, Weaver
-hopeful growth from Harrison, Elliot, Phillips, Taki, Taylor, etc
-hopeful growth from familiarity and experience in the system and not learning a new defense for the 4th year in a row

No one single area of hopeful growth will solve all the woes. its going to have to come together collectively. So as some others stated, I’m not concerned with what defensive position they choose to address in round 1. Just that the defensive player they select in round 1 is talented and comes through on the promise of their talent.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I don’t understand why anyone makes the argument about not counting on Delpit while simultaneosly acting like there is any more certainty of what a rookie is going to bring. If you liked Delpit at LSU, and if you like and believe are soon to be drafted rookies will make an impact, than you should presume Delpit is just as likely(or not likely) as the newly drafted rookies to make an impact. If anything, he’s more ready because he already has been around the team and scheme for a year.

For defensive improvement, we will be relying on:
-newly signed FAs
-newly drafted players
-return/debut of Delpit, Billings, Greedy, Weaver
-hopeful growth from Harrison, Elliot, Phillips, Taki, Taylor, etc
-hopeful growth from familiarity and experience in the system and not learning a new defense for the 4th year in a row

No one single area of hopeful growth will solve all the woes. its going to have to come together collectively. So as some others stated, I’m not concerned with what defensive position they choose to address in round 1. Just that the defensive player they select in round 1 is talented and comes through on the promise of their talent.

You're operating under the assumption that his health isn't a factor.

Anyone with a point different from yours is saying it certainly could be.

Don't get me wrong--I'm a huge Delpit stan. I had him as the highest rated safety in the class, above McKinney who most had at #1. I love the kid's talent. But I don't see anyone concerned about Delpit going forward saying it's because of his talent. It's because the kid had injury problems earlier, and just suffered a torn achilles.

 

[Randolphkeys]

I'm definitely missing the Indianapolis combine when I watch cornerback prospects. Comparing how they react to non-contact drills one after another just shows who has fluidity and quickness and who has a hitch. I remember watching the 2018 drills and clearly seeing Jaire Alexander in a whole different tier than the rest of the field... and that's exactly what happened in the draft and on the field.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I don’t understand why anyone makes the argument about not counting on Delpit while simultaneosly acting like there is any more certainty of what a rookie is going to bring.

Because "is he good enough" is a question that must be asked of any rookie, including Delpit himself who has yet to play a second in the NFL. But Delpit also has the "recovering from torn Achilles" factor that doesn't apply to equivalent guys you'd take in this year,s draft.

 

[MirORich]

My point wasn’t that Delpit is a certainty in the positive ledger, both from the recovery and the “is he good enough“ standpoint. It was that some of the same people who are saying ”draft as if he can’t be counted on” present their case as if their championed pick for 26 is an instant “solve our problem at that position” rather than having that “I’d he good enough” factor that all players who have no actual NFL resume have.

I just want the people who acknowledge the uncertainty that is Delpit to also acknowledge all the new draft clas will also be an uncertainty.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

My point wasn’t that Delpit is a certainty in the positive ledger, both from the recovery and the “is he good enough“ standpoint. It was that some of the same people who are saying ”draft as if he can’t be counted on” present their case as if their championed pick for 26 is an instant “solve our problem at that position” rather than having that “I’d he good enough” factor that all players who have no actual NFL resume have.

I just want the people who acknowledge the uncertainty that is Delpit to also acknowledge all the new draft clas will also be an uncertainty.

I think the people clamoring to proceed as if injured players can't be counted on are simply saying that we can't act as if they're dependable players. We're Super Bowl contenders and it would suck to miss a championship opportunity because one of these guys doesn't make it back (or goes down again).

If we entered next season with only Harrison and Delpit as the two starting-quality safeties on this team, I would be disappointed. If we entered next season with only Greedy as an option as a true #2 corner, I would be disappointed.

 

[MirORich]

I think the people clamoring to proceed as if injured players can't be counted on are simply saying that we can't act as if they're dependable players. We're Super Bowl contenders and it would suck to miss a championship opportunity because one of these guys doesn't make it back (or goes down again).

If we entered next season with only Harrison and Delpit as the two starting-quality safeties on this team, I would be disappointed. If we entered next season with only Greedy as an option as a true #2 corner, I would be disappointed.

Depth is paramount and tricky thing to create and maintain with a finite number of draft capital and a salary cap. But no argument from me, it’s necessary. Greedy I agree with has to be treated almost as the 5th corner, even if when healthy he plays more than that.

Considering Woods preferred scheme, a third legit safety type is needed but yu can guarantee the Browns will be counting on Delpit to be one of their top 3 safeties unless he has a setback prior to the draft. I agree that I wouldn’t want to count on MJ Stewart or Redwine as a top3 safety on the team, so whether it’s re-signing Karl Joseph or drafting safety in the early rounds, someone with the capabilities of being a plus player on the field for a large number of snaps is necessary.

 

[raiders91sc]

If we fill all our back 7 needs in free agency prior to the draft, then sure, draft an eDGE. I just think that is extraordinarily unlikely because those needs are so immense.

ETA: To put it differently, I would prioritize our defense in this order:

1) CB
2a) S
2b) LB strong in coverage
3) interior pass rusher
4) eDGE rusher

I agree our back 7 needs a lot of work but I understand 1 thing about NFL defenses if you cant put pressure on the QB then it doesn't matter who you have back there. The 2 most important positions on the defense are RDE and LDE. Not having to blitz 5 and 6 guys to get pressure on QB keeps ur CBs off islands. Plus making them double team or chipping ur DE makes it easier for ur DTs or keeps another guy from going out.

Both positions are tough to expect a guy to come in from the draft and play at a starter level. Look at 2020 draft. All CBs drafted in 1st round had replaceable grade and both DE/CB only had 2 guys play at starter or above grade. 31 CB in last 4 draft had backup or higher grades and about 1/4 of them were undrafted. 36 DE in last 4 drafts backup or higher grades and only 4 of them undrafted. Tough to positions to hit on in draft.

2020 PFF grades for CBs And DEs drafted last 4 years

2020 Draft
CB
2 with starter grades 4th and 3rd round picks
5 1st rounders all 5 with replacable grades
DE
1 All Pro 1st round
1 starter 3rd round
3 backups 2nd 5th 5th

2019 Draft
CB
2 with starter grades 3rd and 6th round
3 with backup grades 2nd 4th and 4th round
DE
7 with starter grades 4 x 1st 3rd 4th 5th
6 with backup grades 1st 3rd 5th and 3 undrafted

2018 Draft
CB
1 with Elite 1st round
4 with starter grade 1st(Ward) 5th and 2 undrafted
8 with backup grade 2nd 2nd 4th 5th 7th and 3 undrafted
DE
4 with starter grade 1st 1st 2nd and 4th
4 with backup grade 2nd 2nd 4th and undrafted

2017 Draft
CB
6 with starter grade 1st 1st 3rd 3rd and 2 undrafted
5 with backup grade 3rd 3rd 5th 5th and 1 undrafted
DE
1 with Elite 1st round
1 with all pro 1st round(Garrett)
3 with starter grade 1st 3rd and 4th
5 with backup grade 1st, 2nd 3rd, 6th and 7th