2021 Draft Prospects Thread

[Jack Brickman]

Marvin Harrison was 6’0 and 179 lbs and is the best comp you can have for Smith.

Also, why would he not be adding weight at the next level?

I mean, he might, but he was in a world class strength and conditioning program in college, one that is probably better than those of many NFL teams, and he didn't bulk up. So until he does, I'm going to assume he's not getting much bigger.

 

[DJTJ]

I mean, he might, but he was in a world class strength and conditioning program in college, one that is probably better than those of many NFL teams, and he didn't bulk up. So until he does, I'm going to assume he's not getting much bigger.

Im dying to know what his freshman weight is. Under 140, right?

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I'm not sure comparing college and the NFL 25 years ago to today is going to provide a whole lot of meaningful insight. 1996 was a long time ago.

I also hate the idea of picking out a specific player example and saying this is what that player can be. Have we ever hit on a comparison like that? These dudes are individuals.

When evaluating Devonta Smith, there's a lot to like. But, his size is certainly a negative. It doesn't mean he can't be successful, but it certainly means he can't be successful at doing certain things.

To me, that doesn't matter as much. I'm in the camp that prefers to look at what players can do, rather than what they can't. Right now, I'm riding high and cocky in that stance after it panned out so well for DK Metcalf. But, that just means I'm probably going to miss hard on the next prospect I look at in the same way.

For what it's worth, I don't have a first-round grade on Devonta Smith. I think his best ability is causing separation at the line with his first step (or first couple of steps). This attribute's potency is sort of lost due to his lack of size. You put his ability to separate immediately in a bigger frame and you have Nuk, Davante Adams, Michael Thomas, etc. With his lack of size, it just doesn't turn him into a first-round WR for me. I'd need to see elite open-field movement skills from him, and I just don't see it. (Spare me the highlight film on this point... I know it's contentious to say Devonta Smith doesn't have elite open-field movement skills)

You force me to make a comparison to someone currently in the NFL, and I'm going Calvin Ridley, who I don't think is a dominant #1 receiver in the league.

I'm also curious to see his height and weight in two weeks at the Alabama Pro Day. There's obviously a reason he declined those measurements at the Senior Bowl. I think 6'1", 175 lbs is generous.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I'm not sure comparing college and the NFL 25 years ago to today is going to provide a whole lot of meaningful insight. 1996 was a long time ago.

I also hate the idea of picking out a specific player example and saying this is what that player can be. Have we ever hit on a comparison like that? These dudes are individuals.

When evaluating Devonta Smith, there's a lot to like. But, his size is certainly a negative. It doesn't mean he can't be successful, but it certainly means he can't be successful at doing certain things.

To me, that doesn't matter as much. I'm in the camp that prefers to look at what players can do, rather than what they can't. Right now, I'm riding high and cocky in that stance after it panned out so well for DK Metcalf. But, that just means I'm probably going to miss hard on the next prospect I look at in the same way.

For what it's worth, I don't have a first-round grade on Devonta Smith. I think his best ability is causing separation at the line with his first step (or first couple of steps). This attribute's potency is sort of lost due to his lack of size. You put his ability to separate immediately in a bigger frame and you have Nuk, Davante Adams, Michael Thomas, etc. With his lack of size, it just doesn't turn him into a first-round WR for me. I'd need to see elite open-field movement skills from him, and I just don't see it. (Spare me the highlight film on this point... I know it's contentious to say Devonta Smith doesn't have elite open-field movement skills)

You force me to make a comparison to someone currently in the NFL, and I'm going Calvin Ridley, who I don't think is a dominant #1 receiver in the league.

I'm also curious to see his height and weight in two weeks at the Alabama Pro Day. There's obviously a reason he declined those measurements at the Senior Bowl. I think 6'1", 175 lbs is generous.

Metcalf was a day two pick, though. If I thought Smith was going to be a day two pick, I'd feel different about him.

But I think he's a lock to go in round one and I hate him there.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Metcalf was a day two pick, though. If I thought Smith was going to be a day two pick, I'd feel different about him.

But I think he's a lock to go in round one and I hate him there.

I agree. I think he's off the board before the Browns pick, and I don't mind that one bit.

If he's on the board when we pick in the second round, he's very attractive.

For what it's worth, I had DK as the #1 receiver in the 2019 draft, and had no problem taking him in the top half of the first round. I still remember when someone didn't make their pick in our RCF mock draft, and they were auto-assigned DK when I had my eye on him the whole time.

I still would rather take someone like Tamorrion Terry in the middle rounds. I like the risk-to-reward of getting him in the fourth.

 

[Triplethreat]

I'm not sure comparing college and the NFL 25 years ago to today is going to provide a whole lot of meaningful insight. 1996 was a long time ago.

I also hate the idea of picking out a specific player example and saying this is what that player can be. Have we ever hit on a comparison like that? These dudes are individuals.

When evaluating Devonta Smith, there's a lot to like. But, his size is certainly a negative. It doesn't mean he can't be successful, but it certainly means he can't be successful at doing certain things.

To me, that doesn't matter as much. I'm in the camp that prefers to look at what players can do, rather than what they can't. Right now, I'm riding high and cocky in that stance after it panned out so well for DK Metcalf. But, that just means I'm probably going to miss hard on the next prospect I look at in the same way.

For what it's worth, I don't have a first-round grade on Devonta Smith. I think his best ability is causing separation at the line with his first step (or first couple of steps). This attribute's potency is sort of lost due to his lack of size. You put his ability to separate immediately in a bigger frame and you have Nuk, Davante Adams, Michael Thomas, etc. With his lack of size, it just doesn't turn him into a first-round WR for me. I'd need to see elite open-field movement skills from him, and I just don't see it. (Spare me the highlight film on this point... I know it's contentious to say Devonta Smith doesn't have elite open-field movement skills)

You force me to make a comparison to someone currently in the NFL, and I'm going Calvin Ridley, who I don't think is a dominant #1 receiver in the league.

I'm also curious to see his height and weight in two weeks at the Alabama Pro Day. There's obviously a reason he declined those measurements at the Senior Bowl. I think 6'1", 175 lbs is generous.

Calvin Ridley had 90 catches for just about 1400 yards and 9 TDs and isn’t a dominant #1 in the NFL?

Only 4 players had more yards and he was tied with Davante Adam’s.

What more does a guy need to do to be a #1 WR in your eyes?

 

[AZ_]

Calvin Ridley had 90 catches for just about 1400 yards and 9 TDs and isn’t a dominant #1 in the NFL?

Only 4 players had more yards and he was tied with Davante Adam’s.

What more does a guy need to do to be a #1 WR in your eyes?

What arbitrary baselines do you use to justify your subjective adjectives?

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Calvin Ridley had 90 catches for just about 1400 yards and 9 TDs and isn’t a dominant #1 in the NFL?

Only 4 players had more yards and he was tied with Davante Adam’s.

What more does a guy need to do to be a #1 WR in your eyes?

He needs to be a better player.

I don't care about stats you put up. He was on a losing team, in an offense designed to get him the ball. For the same reason Austin Hooper wasn't a good tight end, even though he put up monster numbers in Atlanta, Calvin Ridley isn't automatically a stud receiver because of the numbers he put up.

Is Juju a dominant, stud #1 receiver because of his 2018 season? Or is he a pedestrian third receiver because of what he did this year? I'd contend that he is the player he is--a reliable target in the middle of the field without any explosive, game-breaking potential. A big-slot type player. He's closer to Tyler Boyd than he is to replacing Pittsburgh Antonio Brown. When you can evaluate a player, the stats they accumulate are more noise than anything else.

I have Ridley closer to a... Robert Woods, DJ Moore sort of tier than I do to Nuk, Adams, Thomas, Hill, etc. Good piece, not an alpha #1 WR in the NFL.

If you differ with me, that's fine. But that's where I'm coming from. I'd easily take someone like DK Metcalf over him. I prefer Golladay over him. I have CeeDee Lamb close to him, but slightly ahead. If there's no injury questions, I'm taking Courtland Sutton over him.

If you're saying a #1 means one of the 32 best receivers in the league, then he fits that description. I am not using that description. I think there's probably less than 15 of the sort of player I'm describing as a true #1 guy--someone capable of dominating a matchup on a play-by-play basis, regardless of situation.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Calvin Ridley had 90 catches for just about 1400 yards and 9 TDs and isn’t a dominant #1 in the NFL?

Only 4 players had more yards and he was tied with Davante Adam’s.

What more does a guy need to do to be a #1 WR in your eyes?

Personally, I think you need to see a guy do it for more than one season that was fueled by insane volume due to the alpha (Julio) being hurt most of the season on a bad team with constant negative game scripts.

If he does it again next year with some actual competition for targets, then there's a discussion to be had.

And as far as comparing him to Smith goes, Ridley is at least fifteen pounds heavier at the same height and is probably faster too.

 

[AZ_]

Couple of eye-popping numbers from the Texas Pro Day

OT Samuel Cosmi did 35 bench reps
EDGE Joseph Ossai jumped 41.5'' on the vertical

 

[AZ_]

He needs to be a better player.

I don't care about stats you put up. He was on a losing team, in an offense designed to get him the ball. For the same reason Austin Hooper wasn't a good tight end, even though he put up monster numbers in Atlanta, Calvin Ridley isn't automatically a stud receiver because of the numbers he put up.

Is Juju a dominant, stud #1 receiver because of his 2018 season? Or is he a pedestrian third receiver because of what he did this year? I'd contend that he is the player he is--a reliable target in the middle of the field without any explosive, game-breaking potential. A big-slot type player. He's closer to Tyler Boyd than he is to replacing Pittsburgh Antonio Brown. When you can evaluate a player, the stats they accumulate are more noise than anything else.

I have Ridley closer to a... Robert Woods, DJ Moore sort of tier than I do to Nuk, Adams, Thomas, Hill, etc. Good piece, not an alpha #1 WR in the NFL.

If you differ with me, that's fine. But that's where I'm coming from. I'd easily take someone like DK Metcalf over him. I prefer Golladay over him. I have CeeDee Lamb close to him, but slightly ahead. If there's no injury questions, I'm taking Courtland Sutton over him.

If you're saying a #1 means one of the 32 best receivers in the league, then he fits that description. I am not using that description. I think there's probably less than 15 of the sort of player I'm describing as a true #1 guy--someone capable of dominating a matchup on a play-by-play basis, regardless of situation.

Personally, I think you need to see a guy do it for more than one season that was fueled by insane volume due to the alpha (Julio) being hurt most of the season on a bad team with constant negative game scripts.

If he does it again next year with some actual competition for targets, then there's a discussion to be had.

And as far as comparing him to Smith goes, Ridley is at least fifteen pounds heavier at the same height and is probably faster too.

We're also talking about a season when he was:
17th in DYAR
27th in DVOA
58th in Catch %

Compared to Adams':
1st
10th
2nd

The two players aren't comparable if you look beyond any elementary metrics.

 

[Triplethreat]

Personally, I think you need to see a guy do it for more than one season that was fueled by insane volume due to the alpha (Julio) being hurt most of the season on a bad team with constant negative game scripts.

If he does it again next year with some actual competition for targets, then there's a discussion to be had.

And as far as comparing him to Smith goes, Ridley is at least fifteen pounds heavier at the same height and is probably faster too.

Wouldn't not having a guy like Julio Jones on your roster and producing incredible numbers make you a #1 WR?

He got all the game planning, all the attention and still was sensational.

Ridley is a surefire #1 WR.

I'm tired of these lazy, stats don't matter takes. Being the 5th leading WR in the league in terms of yards and 9th in the league in terms of targets isn't something to just gloss over. It's exceptional production from an emerging superstar at WR.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Wouldn't not having a guy like Julio Jones on your roster and producing incredible numbers make you a #1 WR?

He got all the game planning, all the attention and still was sensational.

Ridley is a surefire #1 WR.

I'm tired of these lazy, stats don't matter takes. Being the 5th leading WR in the league in terms of yards and 9th in the league in terms of targets isn't something to just gloss over. It's exceptional production from an emerging superstar at WR.

Counting. Stats. Don't. Matter. Out. Of. Context.

 

[Triplethreat]

Counting. Stats. Don't. Matter. Out. Of. Context.

If you have watched any Atlanta Falcons games this season you'd have the context.

One of the best route runners in the entire NFL.

 

[Jack Brickman]

If you have watched any Atlanta Falcons games this season you'd have the context.

One of the best route runners in the entire NFL.

Okay. Being great at one aspect of the position doesn't automatically make you an alpha. We could very well have just witnessed the best statistical season of Ridley's entire career.