NFL Off-Season Thread

[JDailey23]

That's nice. He's pretty great.

Not even remotely close to the point I was making, but nice nonetheless.

The point is Deshaun Watson is a great QB regardless of his teams record. Because his team sucks, QBs don't magically change that.


If your argument is that going from Peyton Manning to Curtis Painter is bad, then yes, I agree with you.

But again, that isn't the point.

I agree. I don’t think the Colts would have been much better with Watson the year after Manning left either. I’d say maybe 3 or 4 wins max.
He’s a lot like Russell Westbrook. Amazing ball player, but not a leader of men or the type who can take over a game and will his team to a win.

 

[bob2the2nd]

The loss of simply Peyton Manning took the Colts from 14-2 to 2-14.

That colts team tanked and tanked hard. Peyton wasn't a 12 win difference to that team. It was a total mental let down by everyone associated with that team

 

[Surge]

I agree. I don’t think the Colts would have been much better with Watson the year after Manning left either. I’d say maybe 3 or 4 wins max.
He’s a lot like Russell Westbrook. Amazing ball player, but not a leader of men or the type who can take over a game and will his team to a win.

You know something an NFL scouting group and coaches he played under don't?

9 reasons why Deshaun Watson is an "excellent" leader

Head coach Bill O'Brien explained why his QB has flourished as a leader in the Texans locker room.

www.houstontexans.com

O'Brien emphasized how "excellent" a leader Watson is, and explained the many reasons why.

1. First and foremost he leads by example.
2. He leads with his work ethic, he's out there every day at practice.
3. He's in early, he stays late.
4. He works in the weight room, takes care of his body.
5. He'll do whatever needs to be done at practice, stay after practice to fix a route or go out early to try to work on center-quarterback cadence or things like that.
6. He cares about being as good of a player and a teammate as he can be every single day.
7. He tries to get better every day.
8. He's a very smart player.
9. He's gotten better and better. He's improved every single year.

Add on that he's literally written a book about leadership:

Deshaun Watson has written a book on leadership, service - ProFootballTalk

Texans quarterback Deshaun Watson has always encouraged kids to read, and launched a summer youth reading challenge in Houston.Now, he’s making his own addition to the book club.According to Aaron Wilson of the Houston Chronicle, Watson has authored a book called “Pass It On.”Available in July...

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

What are you basing him "Not being a leader of men" on?

 

[AZ_]

There are arguments like this:

I agree. I don’t think the Colts would have been much better with Watson the year after Manning left either. I’d say maybe 3 or 4 wins max.
He’s a lot like Russell Westbrook. Amazing ball player, but not a leader of men or the type who can take over a game and will his team to a win.

Then, there are arguments like this:

You know something an NFL scouting group and coaches he played under don't?

9 reasons why Deshaun Watson is an "excellent" leader

Head coach Bill O'Brien explained why his QB has flourished as a leader in the Texans locker room.

www.houstontexans.com

O'Brien emphasized how "excellent" a leader Watson is, and explained the many reasons why.

1. First and foremost he leads by example.
2. He leads with his work ethic, he's out there every day at practice.
3. He's in early, he stays late.
4. He works in the weight room, takes care of his body.
5. He'll do whatever needs to be done at practice, stay after practice to fix a route or go out early to try to work on center-quarterback cadence or things like that.
6. He cares about being as good of a player and a teammate as he can be every single day.
7. He tries to get better every day.
8. He's a very smart player.
9. He's gotten better and better. He's improved every single year.

Add on that he's literally written a book about leadership:

Deshaun Watson has written a book on leadership, service - ProFootballTalk

Texans quarterback Deshaun Watson has always encouraged kids to read, and launched a summer youth reading challenge in Houston.Now, he’s making his own addition to the book club.According to Aaron Wilson of the Houston Chronicle, Watson has authored a book called “Pass It On.”Available in July...

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

What are you basing him "Not being a leader of men" on?

Its incredibly easy to see why facts matter, and petty animus towards players (whom you didn't bother to do the research on) does not.

Hopefully you read the article he posted, because I think its incredibly on point.

Watson is the very definition of a leader. One of the best and brightest stars in football.


Excited to see what a team who values and respects their talent can do.

 

[JDailey23]

There are arguments like this:



Then, there are arguments like this:



Its incredibly easy to see why facts matter, and petty animus towards players (whom you didn't bother to do the research on) does not.

Hopefully you read the article he posted, because I think its incredibly on point.

Watson is the very definition of a leader. One of the best and brightest stars in football.


Excited to see what a team who values and respects their talent can do.

Blew a 3 TD lead in 2019/20 playoffs and then followed it up with 4 wins in his 4th season???
Now he is trying to bail on his teammates. Real leader huh.

 

[AZ_]

Blew a 3 TD lead in 2019/20 playoffs and then followed it up with 4 wins in his 4th season???
Now he is trying to bail on his teammates. Real leader huh.

His teammates, per Peter King:

It’s gotten to the point where, I’m told, even some respected veterans on the teams have, in effect, told Watson, Go ahead. Go. We love you. We don’t want you to get trapped here. You don’t owe us anything.

I’ve heard a few other things about Watson. The veterans on the team supported him going to owner Cal McNair a month ago and telling him the situation in the locker room was dire, and there was no faith in the management or direction of the team. When the team didn’t interview a Watson favorite, Robert Saleh, that turned off the locker room. When the team chose to keep EVP Jack Easterby (a major bone of contention with players, who do not trust him), that further soured the players, including Watson.

Again, I'm truly not sure how you have made a worse argument here.

There's a time to just admit you were wrong, and move on. You're clearly just hating.

 

[Surge]

Blew a 3 TD lead in 2019/20 playoffs and then followed it up with 4 wins in his 4th season???
Now he is trying to bail on his teammates. Real leader huh.

What QB's do you consider "Leaders Of Men" in the NFL today?

Because if Deshaun Watson isn't, I'm not sure how many there are.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Blew a 3 TD lead in 2019/20 playoffs and then followed it up with 4 wins in his 4th season???
Now he is trying to bail on his teammates. Real leader huh.

Usually blowing a three touchdown lead is an indictment of the defense. The Browns nearly blew several big leads this season because our defense couldn't stop anyone, and no one was blaming that on Baker or saying he wasn't a good leader. We, as adults, were able to recognize that the problem was not with Baker (at least in the back half of the season when he started to look good), or a lack of leadership. It was because our defense was dog shit.

 

[JDailey23]

His teammates, per Peter King:







Again, I'm truly not sure how you have made a worse argument here.

There's a time to just admit you were wrong, and move on. You're clearly just hating.

I’m not wrong. He won’t get traded and he’s quitting on his team, fan base and the franchise as a whole.

 

[AZ_]

Loyalty is everything, as they say.

 

[AZ_]

The sheer number of storylines upcoming in the free agent/trade market is amazing.

Hard to remember a time I’ve anticipated the NFL Hot Stove season more than this one, given the new expectations and overall boredom of the Covid era.

Multiple MVP level players who could wind up pretty much anywhere.

 

[Cement]

The sheer number of storylines upcoming in the free agent/trade market is amazing.

Hard to remember a time I’ve anticipated the NFL Hot Stove season more than this one, given the new expectations and overall boredom of the Covid era.

Multiple MVP level players who could wind up pretty much anywhere.

Yep - have already seen Goff & Stafford switch. And former MVP Wentz.

And we have drama with Watson and Russell Wilson and Dak.

I'm just glad the Browns don't have to deal with this mess.

 

[JDailey23]

I bet he wants QB money.

 

[Lee]

I bet he wants QB money.
View attachment 5134

The worst thing that happened to Ravens is Lamar got that MVP. I am not sure his style is long lasting or even championship level as there is a reason they under perform in the playoffs, so now they cant move on from Lamar obviously, but they have to pay him like an MVP that they dont know will lead them to the Super Bowl like a Kirk Cousins situation.

I love it, i hope they end up having to pay him 40 million a year, most of it guaranteed,

 

[JDailey23]

The worst thing that happened to Ravens is Lamar got that MVP. I am not sure his style is long lasting or even championship level as there is a reason they under perform in the playoffs, so now they cant move on from Lamar obviously, but they have to pay him like an MVP that they dont know will lead them to the Super Bowl like a Kirk Cousins situation.

I love it, i hope they end up having to pay him 40 million a year, most of it guaranteed,

I hope they franchise him year after year lol