2021 Season | Series #39 | Rangers @ Indians | Aug. 24-26

[Gson]

...when a young pitcher can't get his curve/slider over with consistency..in any count, then ML hitters sit on and punish the fastball.. IF the fastball catches too much of the plate too often.. that pitcher gets hammered.. With more IP's.. and the continued use of his FB, but with better command (that can only be gained by pitching at the highest level) can big Sam begin to graduate like Cal Quantrill is currently doing..

..old numbers don't explain what he's doing now....they're no more than indicators..

 

[BimboColesHair]

Said this too many times now, but they need to bite the bullet and turn Hentges into a reliever when the top half of their rotation is back and healthy.

His fastball is no longer below average when he is a 1 inning guy. When they flirted with the idea Spring Training of 2019 he was bringing it 99-101 from the left side. His stuff plays up exceptionally when he focused on 1-2 innings as opposed to 4-6 in the past.

They’re going to do it soon enough, and he’ll be nasty. Like a beefed up left handed version of Zach McAllister.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

With more IP's.. and the continued use of his FB, but with better command (that can only be gained by pitching at the highest level) can big Sam begin to graduate like Cal Quantrill is currently doing..

..old numbers don't explain what he's doing now....they're no more than indicators..

Better command can only be gained by pitching at the highest level? Really? So none of the pitchers in our farm system are improving their command? That's discouraging to hear.

Those "old numbers" I cited are for the 2021 season. I couldn't find any that were more recent.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Said this too many times now, but they need to bite the bullet and turn Hentges into a reliever when the top half of their rotation is back and healthy.

His fastball is no longer below average when he is a 1 inning guy. When they flirted with the idea Spring Training of 2019 he was bringing it 99-101 from the left side. His stuff plays up exceptionally when he focused on 1-2 innings as opposed to 4-6 in the past.

They’re going to do it soon enough, and he’ll be nasty. Like a beefed up left handed version of Zach McAllister.

I can't see them putting him in the rotation next year based on this year's results so it's either the bullpen or DFA, right? We could use a one-inning lefty with nasty stuff.

 

[Criznit]

As of now we have several fringe starters at AAA/ML that may and likely will end up in the pen. Of these arms, Hentges and Mejia could both end up pretty darn good options out of the pen. Give either or both the Quantrill treatment in 2022 and see what happens.

 

[Gson]

Better command can only be gained by pitching at the highest level? Really? So none of the pitchers in our farm system are improving their command? That's discouraging to hear.

Those "old numbers" I cited are for the 2021 season. I couldn't find any that were more recent.

Command in the minors versus command in the big leagues.. IS VERY DIFFERENT.. sad you wouldn't know that..

 

[sportscoach]

...when a young pitcher can't get his curve/slider over with consistency..in any count, then ML hitters sit on and punish the fastball.. IF the fastball catches too much of the plate too often.. that pitcher gets hammered.. With more IP's.. and the continued use of his FB, but with better command (that can only be gained by pitching at the highest level) can big Sam begin to graduate like Cal Quantrill is currently doing..

..old numbers don't explain what he's doing now....they're no more than indicators..

That's the thing, Hentges' off speed have been good, not his fastball... At least in 21, its been that way.... It's hard to deny that one since the stats end up supporting that case...

Now as Bimbo stated, Hentges was hitting 99-100 when he was a reliever, then mixing in that fastball with an 80 mph curve... That's definitely going to improve his fastball numbers in theory...

 

[Gson]

That's the thing, Hentges' off speed have been good, not his fastball... At least in 21, its been that way.... It's hard to deny that one since the stats end up supporting that case...

Now as Bimbo stated, Hentges was hitting 99-100 when he was a reliever, then mixing in that fastball with an 80 mph curve... That's definitely going to improve his fastball numbers in theory...

If Hentges can't throw his fastball for quality strikes.. it doesn't matter how hard he throws.. it really doesn't....

 

[sportscoach]

If Hentges can't throw his fastball for quality strikes.. it doesn't matter how hard he throws.. it really doesn't....

He's got a flat fastball, there is no movement so when you throw what 94, in today's era, that's going to always get hit if it's not hitting the corners. Change that to 99, with almost a 20 mph difference now with his curveball and 15 with the slider, you will see much better rated fastball even if it's not perfect, it will still increase swing and misses, and with the curveball already what like a 40ish% whiff rate, how would it not increase it?

 

[Gson]

He's got a flat fastball, there is no movement so when you throw what 94, in today's era, that's going to always get hit if it's not hitting the corners. Change that to 99, with almost a 20 mph difference now with his curveball and 15 with the slider, you will see much better rated fastball even if it's not perfect, it will still increase swing and misses, and with the curveball already what like a 40ish% whiff rate, how would it not increase it?

It really doesn't matter how hard he's throwing his fastball if it's not commanded.. THE END..

 

[CATS44]

It really doesn't matter how hard he's throwing his fastball if it's not commanded.. THE END..

While this is true...and I mentioned this in another thread...

For a lot of failed starters with command problems, the move to being one inning relievers is a whole new ball game. (It also did wonders for Cookie)

Two former Tribe pitchers are prime examples.

Jose Mesa and Andrew Miller.

Both went from failed starter to instant Superman in the pen. Both significantly raised their K rates (esp Miller) and dropped their walk rates. I can't find velocity numbers for Mesa, but Millers jumped from about 93 MPH to 95.

In McAllister's case, he had a fastball without much movement, and not much else. But when he moved to the pen, his velocity rose nearly 3 MPH. For three years he was a fine reliever for us.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Command in the minors versus command in the big leagues.. IS VERY DIFFERENT.. sad you wouldn't know that..

Sad you don't get that being able to consistently locate a pitch on the black as opposed to the center of the strike zone (what is commonly referred to as "command") is a skill that can be developed at any level. It's a matter of coaching and practice. I'm talking about executing pitches regardless of who is trying to hit them.

Are you really arguing that Hentges can only improve his command pitching in the majors but not in the minors? Not that it matters because he is out of options.

I suspect you're trying to say that he can get away with pitches in the minors that he can't get away with in the majors (like all pitchers), but looking at his ERA in Columbus this year I'd say he can't get away with throwing in the middle of the zone even in AAA.

 

[Gson]

Sad you don't get that being able to consistently locate a pitch on the black as opposed to the center of the strike zone (what is commonly referred to as "command") is a skill that can be developed at any level. It's a matter of coaching and practice. I'm talking about executing pitches regardless of who is trying to hit them.

Are you really arguing that Hentges can only improve his command pitching in the majors but not in the minors? Not that it matters because he is out of options.

I suspect you're trying to say that he can get away with pitches in the minors that he can't get away with in the majors (like all pitchers), but looking at his ERA in Columbus this year I'd say he can't get away with throwing in the middle of the zone even in AAA.

You're making that argument.. by creating the belief there is exclusivity in where experience can be achieved.. It's your argument.. you get to live with it..

My argument is that Hentges' best chance to improve his command is to accumulate innings.. If they can be at the highest level.. that would be better.. and NO PITCHER locates on the black.. and it's not the definition of command... smh...

If you would stop putting so damn much emphasis on stats.. you might learn.... queue the next snarky repartee...

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

You're making that argument.. by creating the belief there is exclusivity in where experience can be achieved.. It's your argument.. you get to live with it..

My argument is that Hentges' best chance to improve his command is to accumulate innings.. If they can be at the highest level.. that would be better.. and NO PITCHER locates on the black.. and it's not the definition of command... smh...

If you would stop putting so damn much emphasis on stats.. you might learn.... queue the next snarky repartee...

No snarky repartee and no stats.

You said two things:

With more IP's.. and the continued use of his FB, but with better command (that can only be gained by pitching at the highest level) can big Sam begin to graduate like Cal Quantrill is currently doing..

And:

My argument is that Hentges' best chance to improve his command is to accumulate innings.. If they can be at the highest level.. that would be better...

I agree with the second statement, but only if those innings are not costing the Guardians ball games they could have won with a better pitcher. IOW, if Hentges is their 8th best starter next year then he should not be in the rotation just because they believe he can only improve his command pitching to big league hitters, not to AAA guys.

 

[CATS44]

Actually, a lot of very good pitchers have made a living by locating on the black.

Raffy Betancourt was a master at it.