2022 Off-season Thread - The Future is Bright

[backstreet hooper]

Love/Okoro/1st is something you may be able to talk me into from an asset perspective but I am still a bit worried about how this affects our long term trajectory.

I wouldn't give up Love, Okoro, and 1st for a temporary LeBron because bringing LeBron at 38 won't guarantee us the championship or a deep playoff run. Young Okoro is already our best perimeter defender and I'd like to see him stick around going forward into our peak years. LeBron would make our defense worse, and without Okoro even more so.

 

[B Mac]

I wouldn't give up Love, Okoro, and 1st for a temporary LeBron because bringing LeBron at 38 won't guarantee us the championship or a deep playoff run. Young Okoro is already our best perimeter defender and I'd like to see him stick around going forward into our peak years. LeBron would make our defense worse, and without Okoro even more so.

I think you are majorly downplaying all of the things that LeBron would instantly improve compared to Okoro's 20 minutes of defense off the bench. There are a lot of understandable concerns to weigh in a move like this, but the impact comparison of Okoro versus LeBron shouldnt even be on the chart.

 

[Ohioplayer00]

I think you are majorly downplaying all of the things that LeBron would instantly improve compared to Okoro's 20 minutes of defense off the bench. There are a lot of understandable concerns to weigh in a move like this, but the impact comparison of Okoro versus LeBron shouldnt even be on the chart.

I’m not giving up more assets for LBJ. Definitely not giving up Love, Okoro (and I’m not a fan of Okoro) and a first.

 

[backstreet hooper]

I think you are majorly downplaying all of the things that LeBron would instantly improve compared to Okoro's 20 minutes of defense off the bench. There are a lot of understandable concerns to weigh in a move like this, but the impact comparison of Okoro versus LeBron shouldnt even be on the chart.

Agree. But my point was that I wouldn't like to include Okoro in that trade. And I would also take a bit more cautious approach as to LeBron's impact if he came here.

 

[buzzdog]

Just forget about trading for him this year, and sign him next year.

 

[BigZ94]

The Cavaliers have bounced around the idea of bringing back Wiggins into the fold for a while now and the Warriors probably cannot afford Wiggins on top of the other costly contracts on their payroll. With how Wiggins performed en route to an NBA Championship this summer, the fit would make almost too much sense with Cleveland.

With Love's salary coming off the books next year and probably Sexton or LeVert as well, Wiggins could be signable if the W's can't afford to keep him.

Wiggins would slot right in at the 3. Markkanen would back up Wiggins at the 3 and Mobley at the 4 (with Love gone).

Guards: Garland, LeVert or Sexton, Rubio, Agbaji
Forwards: Mobley, Wiggins, Markkanen, Wade, Okoro
Centers: Allen, Robin Lopez (re-sign, or another backup center)
End of bench: Stevens, Windler, Cedi

Don’t see how we could sign Wiggins if we kept both sexton and Lavert

 

[Lyuokdea]

I have finally gotten my trial for Dall-E, so I can make this:

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

I’m not giving up more assets for LBJ. Definitely not giving up Love, Okoro (and I’m not a fan of Okoro) and a first.

Love's contract expires at the end of the season. So does LeBron's, assuming he doe not sign an extension with the Lakers this fall. So we'd be trading a half season of our backup power forward for a half season of LeBron, who averaged 30 points, 8 rebounds, and 6 assists last year.

Okoro is expendable because he's 2 and we have Sexton and LeVert. I assume one of them will be extended and one will be allowed to walk or be traded. We also just drafted Agbagi, another 2.

Okoro could be moved back to the 3, but he'd be backing up Markkanen, who is a core piece and is signed for three more years. Personally I think Stevens is as good as Okoro in that role anyway.

With either LeVert and Sexton, Agbagi, and Markkanen all on the team for 3-4 more years I don't see a role for Okoro.

The Lakers would want a draft pick and our next first rounder is in 2024, which we can't trade since we already traded our 2023 1st for LeVert. So we would send them our 2025 first round pick. By then we should be one of the best teams in the league even if LeBron has retired.

The Lakers are looking at a long term rebuild. Westbrook will be 34 and hasn't worked out for them. LeBron will be 38 and his years are numbered. He needs to get somewhere where he can win another Championship or two, unless he just doesn't care about that anymore. The Lakers should get rid of LeBron and Westbrook and build around AD, who is 29. They need to collect young players with upsides and draft picks. This proposed deal would get that started.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

Just forget about trading for him this year, and sign him next year.

That's another realistic option, but we could win it all with LeBron this year, so why not do both?

I happen to think that playing with LeBron would accelerate the development of Mobley, Garland, and Agbagi. They would learn so much from him.

As he turns 38 and wants to extend his career so he's still a great player when Bronny arrives, LeBron will want to play on a team where his minutes and his role are more limited than they were in the past. He would benefit from playing on a team where he just supplies whatever the team is missing rather than having to do everything.

Last year LeBron raved about how the Cavs using Love off the bench and limiting his minutes was keeping him healthy and allowing him to produce at a high level. I think LeBron is ready for something similar as he tries to hold off Father Time for as long as possible.

 

[Larry hughes]

Nice run. Caris & Isaiah Mobley looked good.

 

[Jscc]

Don’t see how we could sign Wiggins if we kept both sexton and Lavert

Wiggins will want a max [and will get it]. We already got one on the books and I expect Mobley to be the next.

 

[RedBlackAttack]

Don’t see how we could sign Wiggins if we kept both sexton and Lavert

The idea of signing Wiggins to big money I don't like. At all.

Does he have prototypical size and length with an athletic profile that has finally resulted in winning basketball? Sure, but only in Golden State. Prior to that, he was seen as one of the worst contracts in the NBA, which is why Golden State got him for essentially nothing.

Let's not forget, in 2020, Minnesota had to attach 2 picks to move Wiggins, including a Top 3 protected 1st rounder that ended up being Kuminga. Incredible move by GS that obviously paid off and Wiggins works in that system.

But are we so far removed from lost, disinterested Wiggins that I'd be willing to make him the centerpiece of one of the last offseasons we'll have real money to throw around? Nah. I'm not there yet. We know he works well with Steph, Dray and Klay. I have a feeling a lot of otherwise mediocre players may be able to replicate that.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Golden State has a player combination that is greater than it's individual parts. I'm concerned that it took a full season and a half for Wiggins to adapt to the Warriors, a core that spaced the floor for him and allowed him to just focus on his own strengths.

 

[cavsfever]

I would say what LeBron playing alongside Kyrie is absolute best example of James fitting in with another elite player. Frankly, I thought LBJ-Ky fit together offensively better than LBJ-Wade ever did. Now, LBJ-Wade were able to overcome it to some extent because they were just that great, but then again, those teams probably should have won a title every year they were together in their primes considering that was pre-Super Team era and no one even came close to their level of talent.

I honestly wouldn't be that worried about Garland. DG is as lethal as an off-ball dynamo coming around screens and running the offense, not necessarily as the initiator all the time, but as the first or second pass into a set. They could actually be an incredible pairing considering the collective basketball IQ.

I'd be more concerned about Mobley's growth. LeBron really likes to operate from the high block as a kind of point-PF. That is an area of the floor I really want to see Mobley take control of and Mobley has some natural secondary playmaking instincts I'd love to explore. Since he and LBJ occupy similar areas of the floor, does it stunt Mobley's growth? Move him somewhere else where he's not as comfortable and/or doesn't fit in as well with this core?

We saw it with prime Kevin Love, who was a phenomenal player. We can say what we want about how his attributes helped the Cavs more than his stats showed and I'll stand by that, but there's no doubt his natural instincts on the floor were blunted and he had to search in order to carve out a role next to LeBron. It didn't come naturally.

Chris Bosh, same thing on offense.

So it's easy to get consumed with who has the ball and whether or not LeBron and Garland will get in each other's way... our bigs worry me more.

Good post. I agree Lebron and Garland would go very well together and the issue is Mobley. But I would also say that Mobley is a LONG way from being a developed point-PF who is a key secondary playmaker. He really has a couple of years to go in that area. Playing with Lebron for a couple of years might actually be a good education for him in that department. Remember he is only 21. In the meantime he could be a defensive dynamo and develop his skills as a scorer playing off Lebron - his pick and pop, rolling to the basket, and making jump shots after Lebron and Garland collapse the defense.

If you want to see how good Lebron can be with a mobile big, check how he paired with Anthony Davis in the 2020 playoffs. Davis averaged almost 28 ppg on 60% effective field goal percentage, 3.5 assists per game, 27.8% usage for Davis vs 30.4% usage for Lebron. They looked absolutely awesome together and Lebron managed it very well. Those two have rarely been able to show what they can do together because of injuries but that playoff run they did. If Mobley could get his jump shot together he strikes me as much closer to AD than Love or even Bosh.

And re Lebron-Wade I agree that they were not the greatest pairing, but I also think that post-2011 Wade’s knee problems really started dominating and he was no longer playing at a HOF level, more of a borderline all star maybe

 

[Heat Check]

Nice run. Caris & Isaiah Mobley looked good.

Isaiah looked unbelievably slow, with heavy legs. When you notice that even in a run where absolutely nobody is playing any defense, you got problems.

Guy's simply not an NBA player. Better to accept it now.