2022 Season - Week #3 - Steelers @ Browns - 9/22 7:15 PM Prime Video

[lukecfg]

Trubisky takes his helmet off and knocks out Miles Garrett, then takes a dump on the elf.

Steelers 58
Browns 4

 

[Benway]

I will say one thing about the angry elf: these colors don't run!

 

[Surge]

Picked up this book after the game on Sunday. At least the game is on Thursday this week. Should free my Sunday up nicely.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

Najee averaging a crisp 2.9 YPC this season after 3.9 last year got him universal praise

How long before the NFL world catches on that he isn't special

 

[red.]

 

[red.]

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Najee averaging a crisp 2.9 YPC this season after 3.9 last year got him universal praise

How long before the NFL world catches on that he isn't special

I don't think anyone with an opinion worth a damn ever thought he was special.

He's fine. He's a good starting RB in the NFL. The Steelers were stupid to draft a first round RB when their offensive line is this bad.

YPC is an awful metric to judge RB talent. Najee is also on the worst offense in the league, so I wouldn't expect good results.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

I don't think anyone with an opinion worth a damn ever thought he was special.

He's fine. He's a good starting RB in the NFL. The Steelers were stupid to draft a first round RB when their offensive line is this bad.

YPC is an awful metric to judge RB talent. Najee is also on the worst offense in the league, so I wouldn't expect good results.

I don’t agree it’s an awful metric so we probably won’t get anywhere with this discussion

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I don’t agree it’s an awful metric so we probably won’t get anywhere with this discussion

Thomas Rawls, Ryan Mathews, Doug Martin, Charles Sims, CJ Anderson and Giovani Bernard were all in the top 10 YPC in 2015. Rawls was the leader at 5.6

In 2016, Mike Gillislee led at 5.7, Bilal Powell next at 5.5... Jordan Howard, Jay Ajayi, Isaiah Crowell all in the top 10.

2017 had Kenyan Drake, Alfred Morris, Alex Collins, Giovani Bernard, LeGerrette Blount, Matt Breida all inside the top 10.

In 2014, your leader was Justin Forsett at 5.4, followed by Jeremy Hill and Lamar Miller.

You could also use individual players, like Todd Gurley, Melvin Gordon and an entire slew of others who have drastically different yards per carry on a season-by-season (or even game-by-game, or play-by play!) basis. Did Todd Gurley go from being the worst RB in the league to the best in an offseason, or did the circumstances around him change because the Rams got rid of Jeff Fisher and brought in McVay and the best offense in football?

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

Thomas Rawls, Ryan Mathews, Doug Martin, Charles Sims, CJ Anderson and Giovani Bernard were all in the top 10 YPC in 2015. Rawls was the leader at 5.6

In 2016, Mike Gillislee led at 5.7, Bilal Powell next at 5.5... Jordan Howard, Jay Ajayi, Isaiah Crowell all in the top 10.

2017 had Kenyan Drake, Alfred Morris, Alex Collins, Giovani Bernard, LeGerrette Blount, Matt Breida all inside the top 10.

In 2014, your leader was Justin Forsett at 5.4, followed by Jeremy Hill and Lamar Miller.

You could also use individual players, like Todd Gurley, Melvin Gordon and an entire slew of others who have drastically different yards per carry on a season-by-season (or even game-by-game, or play-by play!) basis. Did Todd Gurley go from being the worst RB in the league to the best in an offseason, or did the circumstances around him change because the Rams got rid of Jeff Fisher and brought in McVay and the best offense in football?

You almost always see things as either a great stat or awful. I would challenge you to not be so binary in your analysis and be open to the idea that a stat can be useful without being a perfect indicator

Your example falls flat for me because I never claimed it to be anything other than "not an awful" stat. You picked out some guys that most wouldn't consider good that had objectively good seasons and I don't see how that proves that it's an awful stat. Was Doug Martin not good in his rookie season? Was Lamar Miller not a good runner during his peak?

My claim was never: YPC is the end all be all and it is a definitive ranking for the best RBs in the NFL, year in and year out.

My claim is that is is a heavily correlated stat for RB play over large samples. Some guys have anomalous games. Some guys have anomalous years

A lot of people on this board pretend they watch every game for every team so they know everything. They don't. The stats are a short hand, objective, and quantified way to compare players. YPC isn't the only thing that goes into a RB, but I can tell you this much, there is no good RB that has ever been below 3.

You are taking a heavily correlated with talent variable, pointing to some anomalies and then saying "SEE! I told you it was flawed!"

 

[Real Deal]

Big news or nah

 

[Lee]

Big news or nah

He hasnt even played this year, Signed as a backup, borderline out of the NFL at this point, almost 30 years alod.

Not big news at all.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

You almost always see things as either a great stat or awful. I would challenge you to not be so binary in your analysis and be open to the idea that a stat can be useful without being a perfect indicator

I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a statistic in football that I feel is great. I think we're too used to baseball and basketball, where we have massive amounts of repeatable events, and therefore terrific statistics. Between the small number of plays per game, the small number of games per season, and the immense number of interdependent variables on the field for each play, football isn't a sport that lends itself to summary statistics very well.

For what it's worth, I think yards per carry can be useful in the same way that wins can be useful for evaluating a pitcher. Sure, mention them, but they are an awful crutch to try and support yourself if you're going to make any evaluation of the player themselves.

Your example falls flat for me because I never claimed it to be anything other than "not an awful" stat

I think that by bringing it up, and by claiming that yards per carry was the reason for praise, you did infer that the stat is significant.

. You picked out some guys that most wouldn't consider good that had objectively good seasons

This is a point where there's a massive disconnect.

I don't think those RB's were good in years they had high yards per carry.

The stat is one that's situational and speaks more about the team around a back than the back himself.

Whether it's by using examples of bad players having good YPC, good players having bad YPC, or individual players having wildly differing YPC, those examples are used to illustrate the lack of correlation between YPC and RB ability.

and I don't see how that proves that it's an awful stat. Was Doug Martin not good in his rookie season? Was Lamar Miller not a good runner during his peak?

My claim was never: YPC is the end all be all and it is a definitive ranking for the best RBs in the NFL, year in and year out.

My claim is that is is a heavily correlated stat for RB play over large samples.

I still disagree with that claim. I think the correlation is closer to Wins for a pitcher in baseball than it is for an actually predictive baseball stat like xFIP.

Some guys have anomalous games. Some guys have anomalous years

Agreed. If we have scales and one side is "individual performance" while the other is "imperfect statistic" then which side do you feel carries more weight as to the variance of yards per carry?

A lot of people on this board pretend they watch every game for every team so they know everything. They don't. The stats are a short hand, objective, and quantified way to compare players. YPC isn't the only thing that goes into a RB, but I can tell you this much, there is no good RB that has ever been below 3.

You are taking a heavily correlated with talent variable, pointing to some anomalies and then saying "SEE! I told you it was flawed!

I agree with most of this except for the value you're placing in yards per carry. Below 3 certainly is atrocious, but Gurley, who was arguably the most talented RB in football, averaged 3.2 yards per carry under Jeff Fisher before winning Offensive Player of the Year and finishing second in MVP voting the following season.



So, putting all that aside, if we were to talk about Najee's yards per carry this year as opposed to last year, my impression would be "Wow, how bad is that Pittsburgh offense!" I don't feel the stat says much about Najee Harris himself.

 

[WellYouNeednt]

He hasnt even played this year, Signed as a backup, borderline out of the NFL at this point, almost 30 years alod.

Not big news at all.

What age is 30 years alod?

 

[Lee]

What age is 30 years alod?

are you knew here? lol

Typos are my thing....30 years old.