2023 Guardians Spring Training Thread

[BMAN]

Yes.

Me.

But that's okay. I'm perfect.

Don’t ever compare him to one of the greatest wrestlers of all time.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Don’t ever compare him to one of the greatest wrestlers of all time.

I'm glad you enjoyed my wrestling career. Have you checked out my 2 DVD box set?

 

[bob2the2nd]

saw like 5 pages of discussion just today adn thought something interesting had happened....

 

[CATS44]

Matt LaPorta was rated as a tremendous hitter

Do you think that makes him a tremendous hitter? Should we bring him back?

Jose Ramirez was rated as a worse hitter than Matt LaPorta.

Does that mean we shouldn't have given Jose a shot at the majors?

Seriously Cats, figure yourself out. You're saying some really stupid things and it's getting obnoxious.

No.

I'm saying just what I said.

Just because a young prospect gets high grades for any particular tool set doesn't mean that will translate to MLB. Ameds defense is an example.



In the case of Arias...Rocchio...Freeman...any of them...not one has proven to be capable of performing any skill at the MLB level...even defensively.

To point that out is not stupid. Quite the contrary. Its only obnoxious to those that don't want to believe that prospects fail a lot more than they succeed.

But if my posting bothers you for any reason, simply ignore me.

 

[Criznit]

I'd bring back Berto in a heartbeat.

Team is looking STRONG despite the less than stellar ST W/L record.

Josh Naylor... Is he really going to take that next step this year? Spring results say lookout for our next all-star.

We are one surefire starting pitcher from having the BEST lineup since I started following Cleveland about 20 years ago. Still might be...

Might have the most underrated/under the radar lineup in all of MLB.

I'm ready.... LET'S GO!

 

[Gson]

I'd bring back Berto in a heartbeat.

Team is looking STRONG despite the less than stellar ST W/L record.

Josh Naylor... Is he really going to take that next step this year? Spring results say lookout for our next all-star.

We are one surefire starting pitcher from having the BEST lineup since I started following Cleveland about 20 years ago. Still might be...

Might have the most underrated/under the radar lineup in all of MLB.

I'm ready.... LET'S GO!

IDK that Bebo isn't more of what already exists.. perhaps better defensively than last season's squad.. perhaps not.. The emphasis on caught stealing is going to grow in importance.. I'm just not sure how much.. Either way, Bebo is on the wrong side of 30 and that ALWAYS suggests a regression of skills... Offensively, Bebo offers short instances of good play surrounded by a lot of misery..

The daily lineup is looking very solid save for catching on both sides of the ball.. Special attention to improvement on the defensive side of the ball comes from the improvement of Spongebob in RF and Amed at SS based on spring training and 2022 results.. The Guardians can't do much better at every other spot..

Hitting leans toward continued excellent contact rates and power increase..

Back of the rotation appears to be in flux.. IDK that Civale or Plesac will be holding onto their spots.. but, that's area needs to be viewed from a longer set of games.. Civale, especially.. The reinforcements in the minors should be more than adequate to fill in any deficiencies..

 

[Juice is Loose]

Ran into this guy outside the game last night. Anyone know if he's going to make the roster or will start in Lake County?

 

[Alabuckeye]

View attachment 14704
Ran into this guy outside the game last night. Anyone know if he's going to make the roster or will start in Lake County?

I hear he’s a lock in Akron at least!

 

[macbdog]

View attachment 14704
Ran into this guy outside the game last night. Anyone know if he's going to make the roster or will start in Lake County?

1. Guy you ran into looks like a total chode.

2. I never realized you were Steven Kwan. Good luck this year.

 

[Lee]

BSTV just ranked Amed Rosario 33rd among starting shortstops in MLB.

Personally, the only ranking I care about is the one from Butthole Sports.

I never heard of Butthole Sports until i was surfing the web the other day and ran into them.

Yeah, I was a Butthole Surfer.

 

[CDAV45]

His lower K rate is a source of 'concern', but as long as the dude is effective, why knock him? He doesn't need to be replaced in any way. He remains in the rotation when some of these young starter prospects earn their recall.

I can't help but wonder if Cal isn't the most likely to be extended before the start of the season? He performs well, but a lot of the metrics suggest that he's lucky even after 3 yrs of good production. We'll see what happens.

 

[Lee]

Unless he starts striking out a bunch of hitters or cuts his HR allowed rate in half or turns into Maddux and never walks anyone, never.

Sabermetric stats are all about predictability, using a players previous track record to predict what their future track record may look like. The only thing that is predictable to a higher degree of accuracy about what a pitcher can do year in and year out is strikeout guys, walk guys, or give up home runs.

High contact rate pitchers who rely on generating weak contact, low BABIP numbers, and more grounders than fly balls and line drives are less predictable because you can't predict the results of every ball projected to be put into play against that pitcher. Baseball is too unpredictable when balls are put into play that stay in the stadium. So naturally, sabermetrics doesn't like those kinds of pitchers because they are hard to predict.

Why sabermetric based WAR models don't like Quantrill as much as his actual production over the last 2 seasons, like Fangraphs who use FIP as a determining factor for their WAR stat. Cal has been worth 4.2 fWAR over his last 336 IP of 3.16 ERA pitching. Which doesn't seem as bad as it sounds, but he is 65th amongst all pitchers in fWAR over the last 2 seasons while posting the 15th best ERA over that time frame.

On the other side, BRef uses the actual runs against production in a given season as a determining factor in their WAR stat, using ERA+ as opposed to FIP. So Cal has been worth 6 bWAR over his last 336 IP of 3.16 ERA pitching. They don't use a stat that is determining how predictably good or bad a pitcher has been pitching, they use one that shows how good or bad you are at allowing runs vs the league average for that given season.

You have posted in this section allot. Sure its more about how to use metrics and things that dont effect your job, but I am just glad you are back.,...it means you missed us.

 

[CDAV45]

I like Arias a lot and I think he has real potential to be a good defensive shortstop, as well as a MIF bat with power. Those players are incredibly valuable.

I always think it's more likely that prospects fail than it is they succeed. So, if you make me bet one way or the other on Arias, I'm betting that he fails.

The main way I could see him failing is struggling with strikeouts at the major league level.

I could also see him just not getting a fair shot... if Amed holds down the spot this year and Rocchio passes Arias for next year, he might just draw the short straw.

I don't disagree with anything you said here. At the least he's a valuable defensive MIFer with some power when he makes contact. At the very best we're looking at a player similar to Correa. I think it's likely he falls somewhere in between like an Adames type. If Rocchio passes him up then that means he is playing very well and that wouldn't be terrible with Arias' ability to play every IF position well.

I have to say though that I don't see Tito not giving Arias a fair shot. This organization thinks very highly of Arias regardless of any public opinion. He'll have to prove himself unworthy to them before he is deemed so even if by the omniscient guru we've all come to love.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

No.

I'm saying just what I said.

Just because a young prospect gets high grades for any particular tool set doesn't mean that will translate to MLB. Ameds defense is an example.



In the case of Arias...Rocchio...Freeman...any of them...not one has proven to be capable of performing any skill at the MLB level...even defensively.

To point that out is not stupid. Quite the contrary. Its only obnoxious to those that don't want to believe that prospects fail a lot more than they succeed.

But if my posting bothers you for any reason, simply ignore me.

Cmon man, do you think everyone is that stupid?

Of course guys who haven't played at the major league level haven't proven things at the major league level. That's just the definition of words. There's no insight, analysis or conversation there.

You're using scouting rankings as rebuttals to people saying that Arias and Rocchio are already better defenders than Amed.

And, you're right--if all we were going off were scouting rankings, it would be valid. After all, they aren't the end-all be-all, as I pointed out.

However, that "if" in the above statement is doing a lot of heavy lifting. Because, ding ding ding, we DO have things to go off of besides scouting grades. We have the reality of what Amed has been at the major league level. We have what Arias and Rocchio have shown at the minor league level, and we have objective tracking data that checks, verifies, and inevitably supports the subjective scouting grades we think we see.

To loop back and say "lol, look at these scouting grades. Checkmate!" is stupid, even if you can't see it. You're failing to make an actual argument while at the same time thinking in your mind that you're the bees knees and have truly shown the ignorant masses the brilliance of your ways.

Finally, you might want to actually start reading things if you're going to post so arrogantly. To state "Its only obnoxious to those that don't want to believe that prospects fail a lot more than they succeed" only minutes after I said "I always think it's more likely that prospects fail than it is they succeed" feels like the smug emperor is just walking around naked.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I never heard of Butthole Sports until i was surfing the web the other day and ran into them.

Yeah, I was a Butthole Surfer.

@Lee I can still taste you on my lips and smell you in my clothes.