25 GM OffSeason Thread

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Just to stir up some trouble cause I am bored...

MIF Basabe from the Rays, OF Zach DeLoach of the White Soxs and OF Cade Marlowe of Seattle just all got DFA'D... Should we have any interest?
No
No
No

Basabe is a run of the mill util guy, certainly not a SS. Everybody we will have in camp...and some that won't...are better than him.

Deloach was cut from the White Sox...enough said.

Marlowe is a LH corner windmill at 27 yrs old.
 
Everyone here knows how much I would like the offense to improve so what I'm about to ask may come as a surprise. I'd like to see the Guardians acquire Bryce Miller from the Mariners. They're in need of some offense. Could a deal be constructed around a Kwan and Miller exchange? Having Bibee, Williams, Miller and Oritz would seemingly help the rotation be a force for years. We'd have a fantastic rotation and a league best BP that is controlled for years while our offensive weapons start to realize their potential. In other words, everything could come together on time.

You cannot fully replace Kwan as a hitter, but can someone give enough to go along with an ace SP like Miller to make us a better overall team? We have up and comers like Brito and Bazzana that may not fit in the MIF.

I wouldn't stop with Miller either. If there is a deal to be had that could bring in Sheehan I wouldn't hesitate to make it happen if reasonable. Maybe it could be expanded to include Pages? I hate to make the Dodgers better, but if it makes this team better in the process then I'm fine with it. Could something like Thomas and Gaddis bring back Sheehan and Pages?

Again, in the end I don't think this FO is interested in making any deals at this time. If they were this is the direction I would like them take.
 
Everyone here knows how much I would like the offense to improve so what I'm about to ask may come as a surprise. I'd like to see the Guardians acquire Bryce Miller from the Mariners. They're in need of some offense. Could a deal be constructed around a Kwan and Miller exchange? Having Bibee, Williams, Miller and Oritz would seemingly help the rotation be a force for years. We'd have a fantastic rotation and a league best BP that is controlled for years while our offensive weapons start to realize their potential. In other words, everything could come together on time.

You cannot fully replace Kwan as a hitter, but can someone give enough to go along with an ace SP like Miller to make us a better overall team? We have up and comers like Brito and Bazzana that may not fit in the MIF.

I wouldn't stop with Miller either. If there is a deal to be had that could bring in Sheehan I wouldn't hesitate to make it happen if reasonable. Maybe it could be expanded to include Pages? I hate to make the Dodgers better, but if it makes this team better in the process then I'm fine with it. Could something like Thomas and Gaddis bring back Sheehan and Pages?

Again, in the end I don't think this FO is interested in making any deals at this time. If they were this is the direction I would like them take.

We won't make the playoffs without Kwan... All I need to say on this matter
 
Since Kwan has debuted (3 seasons), these have been the best players in the ALC, per fWAR.

Witt 18.0.
JRam 17.1
Gimenez 12.7
KWAN 12.1
Correa 10.7
Buxton 7.7
Robert 7.6
Riley Greene 7.4
Nails 6.8

Nobody else has reached 6 fWAR.

A few thoughts...

We just traded away two of the top nine.

Kwan has been the third most productive of the ones left.

There are several that would be more productive, if they could stay healthy, but health track record is as important as production track record. 'IF Buxton would stay healthy' is like saying 'IF Manzardo would hit lefties'.

Look at this list the next time anybody says a player is 'only' a 2 WAR player.
 
Everyone here knows how much I would like the offense to improve so what I'm about to ask may come as a surprise. I'd like to see the Guardians acquire Bryce Miller from the Mariners. They're in need of some offense. Could a deal be constructed around a Kwan and Miller exchange? Having Bibee, Williams, Miller and Oritz would seemingly help the rotation be a force for years. We'd have a fantastic rotation and a league best BP that is controlled for years while our offensive weapons start to realize their potential. In other words, everything could come together on time.

You cannot fully replace Kwan as a hitter, but can someone give enough to go along with an ace SP like Miller to make us a better overall team? We have up and comers like Brito and Bazzana that may not fit in the MIF.

I wouldn't stop with Miller either. If there is a deal to be had that could bring in Sheehan I wouldn't hesitate to make it happen if reasonable. Maybe it could be expanded to include Pages? I hate to make the Dodgers better, but if it makes this team better in the process then I'm fine with it. Could something like Thomas and Gaddis bring back Sheehan and Pages?

Again, in the end I don't think this FO is interested in making any deals at this time. If they were this is the direction I would like them take.
A few notes...

-Kwan will have no higher value than he does right now.. He's a helluva spokesman for the club.. his off-field pursuits with kids (Chess) are a phenomenal success.. and he is just an outright good kid.. His on field prowess is a very strong four tools (lacks only power).. He's as complete of a player that the Cleveland franchise has had since Robby and Kenny..... imho..

Emmitt Sheehan: without a full understanding of his medicals, I'd be a bit leary of bringing him in.. but, if his medicals check out. .yessir !!.. The last report that has been published says that Sheehan is throwing off a mound and is "hopeful" to be able to begin rehabilitation starts in May/June of 2025. That would put him about on the same track as Shane Bieber. Sheehan did have the Internal Brace procedure in May... so that ties..

Including Pages.. For Thomas and Gaddis.. maybe not okay, imho.. If it's just Kwan as the return to the Dodgers.. Pages & Sheehan would be just part of the return..

Agree... at the end of this rainbow..the CleFO has shown no interest in moving Kwan and is even less likely to make a roster shaking multi-player deal right before the start of spring training..

Edit: some other names of SP's that could be of interest depending on how the season unfolds through the first 80 games: Michael King, Shane McClanahan, Jared Jones, Luis Gil, Mitch Keller, Nick Lodolo, Jesus Luzardo, Eury Perez, Tony Gonsolin and Ben Brown.. None of these guys are being actively shopped.. but they may be made available as the season unfolds.. usually for a pretty good price..

Thoughts?
 
A few notes...

-Kwan will have no higher value than he does right now.. He's a helluva spokesman for the club.. his off-field pursuits with kids (Chess) are a phenomenal success.. and he is just an outright good kid.. His on field prowess is a very strong four tools (lacks only power).. He's as complete of a player that the Cleveland franchise has had since Robby and Kenny..... imho..

Emmitt Sheehan: without a full understanding of his medicals, I'd be a bit leary of bringing him in.. but, if his medicals check out. .yessir !!.. The last report that has been published says that Sheehan is throwing off a mound and is "hopeful" to be able to begin rehabilitation starts in May/June of 2025. That would put him about on the same track as Shane Bieber. Sheehan did have the Internal Brace procedure in May... so that ties..

Including Pages.. For Thomas and Gaddis.. maybe not okay, imho.. If it's just Kwan as the return to the Dodgers.. Pages & Sheehan would be just part of the return..

Agree... at the end of this rainbow..the CleFO has shown no interest in moving Kwan and is even less likely to make a roster shaking multi-player deal right before the start of spring training..

Edit: some other names of SP's that could be of interest depending on how the season unfolds through the first 80 games: Michael King, Shane McClanahan, Jared Jones, Luis Gil, Mitch Keller, Nick Lodolo, Jesus Luzardo, Eury Perez, Tony Gonsolin and Ben Brown.. None of these guys are being actively shopped.. but they may be made available as the season unfolds.. usually for a pretty good price..

Thoughts?
Thanks for the reply Gson. I wouldn't deal Kwan for Sheehan and Pages. If I'm dealing Kwan it has to be for someone like Bryce Miller as I mentioned. In terms of acquiring Sheehan and Pages I was thinking more along the lines of Gaddis and Thomas or something like that. My reasoning is that the Dodgers are absolutely overloaded with SP even though 3-4 of them are rehabbing from TJS. I'd look to buy low on someone like Sheehan because he is a stud and pretty much right in line with guys like Williams and Bibee from a talent perspective.
 
We won't make the playoffs without Kwan... All I need to say on this matter
You 100% don't know that and you don't know if the deal I mentioned would or wouldn't improve this team as a whole.

Just so you know, and write this down. Kwan's overall numbers are going to continue to go backwards. The league knows him and have made their adjustments and the second half of last season are the results. Yes, he should continue to hit for a high average and get on base, but the power is a goner. All those advanced metrics that you see are going to fade into oblivion. What you'll have left is a singles hitter that can hit the gaps from time to time. To not capitalize on his value right now will be deeply regretted by this time next year. Flag this. Right it down or whatever and throw it in my face if what I say is wrong.

What happens when we don't make the playoffs with Kwan?
 
Since Kwan has debuted (3 seasons), these have been the best players in the ALC, per fWAR.

Witt 18.0.
JRam 17.1
Gimenez 12.7
KWAN 12.1
Correa 10.7
Buxton 7.7
Robert 7.6
Riley Greene 7.4
Nails 6.8

Nobody else has reached 6 fWAR.

A few thoughts...

We just traded away two of the top nine.

Kwan has been the third most productive of the ones left.

There are several that would be more productive, if they could stay healthy, but health track record is as important as production track record. 'IF Buxton would stay healthy' is like saying 'IF Manzardo would hit lefties'.

Look at this list the next time anybody says a player is 'only' a 2 WAR player.
Too much peripheral bullshit goes into those stats. The defensive sway is way too high to the point it's laughable. Neither Kwan nor Gimenez belong on that list.
 
You 100% don't know that and you don't know if the deal I mentioned would or wouldn't improve this team as a whole.

Just so you know, and write this down. Kwan's overall numbers are going to continue to go backwards. The league knows him and have made their adjustments and the second half of last season are the results. Yes, he should continue to hit for a high average and get on base, but the power is a goner. All those advanced metrics that you see are going to fade into oblivion. What you'll have left is a singles hitter that can hit the gaps from time to time. To not capitalize on his value right now will be deeply regretted by this time next year. Flag this. Right it down or whatever and throw it in my face if what I say is wrong.

What happens when we don't make the playoffs with Kwan?

I'd bet very good money, without Kwan, we won't make the playoffs...

Also we just trade Gimenez and Naylor for SPs... What do you think the fans and JRam would think if we do the same with Kwan... Our lineup, literally has provens in JRam and Kwan, a 39 year old in Santana, Thomas, who was usually a platoon, and a SS and a C that haven't done anything with the bat in MLB and a bunch of 23-25 year Olds trying to get a roster spot... Moving Kwan, is likely a very dumb move just PR wise alone let alone the lineup...
 
Thanks for the reply Gson. I wouldn't deal Kwan for Sheehan and Pages. If I'm dealing Kwan it has to be for someone like Bryce Miller as I mentioned. In terms of acquiring Sheehan and Pages I was thinking more along the lines of Gaddis and Thomas or something like that. My reasoning is that the Dodgers are absolutely overloaded with SP even though 3-4 of them are rehabbing from TJS. I'd look to buy low on someone like Sheehan because he is a stud and pretty much right in line with guys like Williams and Bibee from a talent perspective.
Yeah.,. I may have conflated the two separate deals into one and half or some bastardization...

I'd love to acquire Sheehan.. You or someone mentioned him as a target last year or before the start of last year... He's a helluva good young kid.. His internal brace surgery seems to have gone well.. and he should be back on the hill as early as the All Star break.. If it was Gaddis/Thomas.. for Pages/Sheehan at the end of May.. it's a deal that has to be looked at seriously.. seriously, indeed..

Seattle may still make a deal or two before the season kicks off.. we'll see..
 
I'd bet very good money, without Kwan, we won't make the playoffs...

Also we just trade Gimenez and Naylor for SPs... What do you think the fans and JRam would think if we do the same with Kwan... Our lineup, literally has provens in JRam and Kwan, a 39 year old in Santana, Thomas, who was usually a platoon, and a SS and a C that haven't done anything with the bat in MLB and a bunch of 23-25 year Olds trying to get a roster spot... Moving Kwan, is likely a very dumb move just PR wise alone let alone the lineup...
That would be a good bet since we might not make the playoffs with Kwan. What was our record with Kwan out of the lineup last season?

Like I've said a thousand times. Before I reject a deal I need to know what the deal consists of.

Thomas is not "usually a platoon".

I don't think this FO gives a single shit about "PR". If they think it's an intelligent move then they'll consider it. Roster timing might play a bigger role than most of us anticipate.

You making a statement about "a bunch of 23-25 yr olds" almost confirms that now might be the best time to recieve the maximum amount of value for Kwan. I wouldn't trade an arm like Miller for 3 Kwans, but the suggested values make it appear like it could work. My guess is that moving Kwan for that type of package would appear genius by this time next year and certainly over the next 4-5.

There isn't much established value to trade which is why Kwan and Clase are the most discussed.
 
Yeah.,. I may have conflated the two separate deals into one and half or some bastardization...

I'd love to acquire Sheehan.. You or someone mentioned him as a target last year or before the start of last year... He's a helluva good young kid.. His internal brace surgery seems to have gone well.. and he should be back on the hill as early as the All Star break.. If it was Gaddis/Thomas.. for Pages/Sheehan at the end of May.. it's a deal that has to be looked at seriously.. seriously, indeed..

Seattle may still make a deal or two before the season kicks off.. we'll see..
Yeah, I mentioned him last season. I really like what I see from him, but I also like what I see from River Ryan as well.

I don't even know if Seattle would be interested in a deal like I mentioned. I know I wouldn't want to deal a SP like Miller for Kwan, but that's just my opinion. I don't want to come across as mad or disappointed in the responses to my question. FFS I asked it. Clearly, some believe that Kwan is a vital part of this team's offense while I value him as a leadoff hitter and a good defensive LFer, I think adding an arm like Miller and replacing Kwan with any of JRod, Noel, Brito or Brennan could easily be a net gain. If the MIF gets locked down prior to Bazzana's promotion(whenever that may be) then he'll need a position. Should Kayfus continue then he'll need a position. I guess what I'm saying is if this team was set in stone, hardened and ready for a real run then I wouldn't have asked the question. I don't like taking the chance that in 2 yrs we'll be looking back and wishing they would have dealt him sooner. He's a prime candidate for that IMO and I'm not convinced we're ready.
 
We may not make the playoffs WITH Kwan either, IF:
  • Nobody takes charge and actually wins the RF job. Instead of winning it by default.
  • Brito plays an unacceptable 2B.
  • Another injury to a SP.
The last one I won't say because I don't want to start some bad juju.
 
That would be a good bet since we might not make the playoffs with Kwan. What was our record with Kwan out of the lineup last season?

Like I've said a thousand times. Before I reject a deal I need to know what the deal consists of.

Thomas is not "usually a platoon".

I don't think this FO gives a single shit about "PR". If they think it's an intelligent move then they'll consider it. Roster timing might play a bigger role than most of us anticipate.

You making a statement about "a bunch of 23-25 yr olds" almost confirms that now might be the best time to recieve the maximum amount of value for Kwan. I wouldn't trade an arm like Miller for 3 Kwans, but the suggested values make it appear like it could work. My guess is that moving Kwan for that type of package would appear genius by this time next year and certainly over the next 4-5.

There isn't much established value to trade which is why Kwan and Clase are the most discussed.

Thomas still doesn't have very good career numbers against RH pitching...

In 1300+ ABs, he's a .680 OPS... Was better in 23 at .719 OPS...

Vs LHP in 570 ABs he's got an .880 OPS...

The dude still has some work to do on hitting right handers better, that an opinion, but a fact...

Another factor is the fact we lack any OBP types to lead off in the organization... Tell me who actually gets on base?

Kwan OBP .358, JRam OBP .335,

Santana had .328 OBP% last season

Naylor was traded, Fry is out... Then the next guys is Brennan at .309... Brennan doesn't take walks... he had what a 5% BB rate... Freeman then Schneeman and people are trying to get rid of Schneeman... Rocchio isn't bad with taking walks, but he hasn't shown he can hit above thr mendoza yet...

We don't have a good lineup without him, on paper... Our veterans would be Santana at age 39... Thomas with those splits I mentioned... We need someone to hit infront of JRam... Whose gonna do that?

Looking at who wants Kwan... It's gonna be contenders... It's not gonna be a rebuilding club... Which makes his return, more prospects/low amount of MLB time... Teams are gonna want Kwan to add to their veterans...

Trading Kwan, regardless of return, even worse if it's a return of a pitcher, will put this team unable to properly score most runs...

This team hit better when someone was on base last season and guys have shit OBP outside of Kwan...

Plus we have JRam for a few more seasons, you gotta keep someone with them especially the best leadoff guy in baseball and one of the better hitters, when healthy, in baseball.

Tell me who leads off if we trade Kwan?
 

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