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Darius Kinnard Garland

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What is Darius Garland's Ceiling?

  • One Time All-Star

    Votes: 14 8.9%
  • Occasional All-Star

    Votes: 16 10.2%
  • 5-6 Time All-Star

    Votes: 31 19.7%
  • Perennial All-Star

    Votes: 40 25.5%
  • An All-NBA Team or Two

    Votes: 23 14.6%
  • Perennial All-NBA Teamer

    Votes: 20 12.7%
  • Occasional MVP Candidate

    Votes: 11 7.0%
  • Perennial MVP Candidate

    Votes: 2 1.3%
  • MVP, Baby!

    Votes: 10 6.4%
  • Being Jim Chones

    Votes: 12 7.6%

  • Total voters
    157
There's a variety of factors involved here that combine to make our playmaking very PG-centric currently.

1) Garland is ineffective when he's off ball. He doesn't really move, and while he can shoot from the outside, he doesn't scare teams as a catch-and-shoot threat - mostly because of his size, and the aforementioned lack of movement. We're maximizing his talents right now, and that means keeping the ball in his hands all the time when he's out there. (That's why the Garland-Rubio lineups are some of my least favorite ones. You often see Ricky taking the PG responsibilities, leaving DG to function as a meh combo guard.)

2) Talking about Ricky – for all his passing talent, he's truly a ball dominant PG by nature. He thrives when he gets to run the show. And like Garland, he's hardly a spot up threat on the weak side anyway.

3) Our ball movement has dried up a bit. Sometimes it seems we're almost addicted to the Garland-Allen pick and roll – and hey, it works. But we've started to ignore cutters and guys sealing smaller defenders in the paint since we're so eager to get the aforemention duo going all the time. I'd like to see the ball being worked around a bit more.

The above things sound like complaints, but we're playing very well, so consider them as something to keep an eye on. Predictability is never good in the NBA. Not individally and not on team level. What we're doing is working now, but this league will eventually figure you out. It always does.


The on court production speaks against you


2 man combo of Garland/Rubio shows the best results by far. And both of them lead the team in +/-.

if you go thru 5 man lineups with both those 2 involved you see that almost all of them are in the plus.
 
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The big difference between Morant and Garland is that Ja's front office didn't make him split playmaking duties with a non playmaker in the same backcourt for 2 seasons.

Garlands ascent over the past 15 games is directly attributable to taking Sexton off the floor and letting Garland play without fighting his own teammate for PG possessions.

Ja Morant is NOT a better point guard than Darius Garland.

He is a better athlete who has a 2 year headstart at establishing himself as the floor general of his team. DG the PG is a better all around floor general with a more developed offensive game. Both use their above average IQs to play defensive lanes.

Morant is on a Westbrook, Francis, prime John Wall trajectory... Garland is much more on a CP3, Nash, prime Tony Parker trajectory

One trajectory is fun for highlights but doesn't impact winning as much. The other is all about getting the wins and will get every ounce out of his skillet to lift the floor of the entire team in order to do it.

Give me Garland in this debate
Great post.
 
I don’t want Sexton here anymore and I’m surprised I’m basically the only one.

You guys realize making him come off the bench isn’t going to change much right? It’s always weird to me when people talk about moving a guy to a super sub bench role as if it’s going to drastically change the dynamic of the team. Sure, it makes a little difference, but at the end of the day Sexton is still going to be playing his 30+ mpg which is at least 2/3 of a basketball game, and at least 1/3 of that is going to be alongside Garland. Why spends anywhere from $15 mil/year and $25 mil/year on a bench guy who very clearly has made the team’s worse so far and we only hope that by putting him in a bench role, things will be different?

Oh, and by the way you guys do know we’re set to have $50 million in cap space when Love comes off the books in 2023, right? Say goodbye to the ability to sign a max free agent or multiple great role players if we retain Sexton, because we’re also going to need to extend Garland and possibly Rubio.

Furthermore, if you look at the Cavs’ Rubio-Sexton minutes with Garland off the floor from this year, Sexton actually shot the ball well during that time despite being inefficient on the whole to start this year so far. In fact, Sexton’s 56.3% TS (compared to league average 55.3%) is actually higher in relation to league average than his scoring efficiency last year, being 57.3% TS versus 57.2% TS for the league on the whole. So good new right? Actually no. Because the Cavs still posted an absolutely putrid 99.6 ORTG during those 117 minutes. We’re 4 seasons into his career and it’s become abundantly clear that despite his one-on-one scoring he doesn’t have a positive impact on a team-level offense due to his lack of playmaking, poor off-ball movement and off-ball gravity, and his style of play which leaves everyone else out of rhythm. And yet people on this forum are still in denial about this for some reason.

It doesn’t have to be anything personal. It just hasn’t worked out here. We have an awesome roster and we can afford to let Sexton go. We’re not obligated to try to fit a square peg in a round hole while paying a shit ton of money for that square peg as well. Basically everyone else seems to recognize how much better the Cavs play without Sexton except for Cavs fans themselves lol. It’s more than just Garland being able to be more comfortable in his role and play better. The whole team’s chemistry on and off the court is better. Let’s get some guys who fit around our core to play the 2 and 3 (preferably a 3+D guy and another player who can function as a secondary creator on the wing) and contend for titles.

Come on, you definitely aren’t the only one who feels this way, especially after watching how our (nearly) full lineup operates without Sexton over the past couple of weeks. I’d say the board is about split between those who want to move on from Sexton and those who see him as a long term piece. And many of those who want to keep him don’t want him starting (although I don’t think the “super sub” angle really solves the issue)
 

“We need him to carry us offensively,” J.B. Bickerstaff said of Darius Garland. “We need him to score. We need him to play make, and he stepped up in that, and he’s doing a great job.”​

Garland is averaging 19.1 points and 7.3 assists while shooting 47% from the floor in 34.6 minutes per game, all of which are career-highs. He’s a big reason why the Cavs are riding a four game win streak and sitting at 6th in the East. With the way he’s playing, he should definitely be in the conversation for most improved player.
 
Just straight up carrying us on offense this season. If he ever goes down, we are big time fucked.
 
I have no idea what our offense would even do without him. It would be ugly for sure.
I remember in the year immediate post-LeBron where TT was taking multiple isolation possessions per game because Irving couldn’t take EVERY shot. It was a dark time. Thank god for Garland and our boys.
 
I have no idea what our offense would even do without him. It would be ugly for sure.

Possibly.

Why do we accept it though? Why do we now play in a way that makes everything depend on one guy? Why not create system that's more sustainable?

We played nothing like this to start the season, yet did well. What's changed?
 
Possibly.

Why do we accept it though? Why do we now play in a way that makes everything depend on one guy? Why not create system that's more sustainable?

We played nothing like this to start the season, yet did well. What's changed?
It has nothing to do with play style and everything to do with the talent on the team.

Still, the team is more than capable of playing well without Garland on the floor as evidenced by the game changing run they made while he sat tonight.

Overall though, if you want better offense while Garland sits, you need to have a wing besides Osman that can put the ball in the hoop occasionally.
 

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