Early 22 GM Thread! (Trade Ideas here)

[Gson]

Dont be so sure about that...

He has 1.132 yrs of service entering the season. He was in the majors all this year (2021), bringing him to 2.132 after the season..

The normal cut point for Super 2 is in the 120s.

So Cal might get Super 2 (or into Arbitration due to the new CBA)

Yes.. he's right on the raggedy edge of Super 2.. If there is no change int he CBA.. I think you're right... he'll probably end up as a Super 2.. That will advance his salary level by a year..

CLEFO (less if they are traded for by the Guardians) has these guys for the first six to seven years of their careers.. super this..or arby that.. it's what we get.. Cal Quantrill is showing he's advancing toward becoming a MOR SP... perhap more is there (I doubt it).. Hopefully, he remains healthy enough to realize that potential..

 

[MadThinker88]

Just as FYI for everyone, here are the Super Two arbitration cutoff marks going back to 2009:

Someone with the cutoff or greater (ie. .148) is/was Super 2.
Those with service time less than the cutoff (ie. .099) were not Super 2

Year	Cutoff		Year	Cutoff
2021	??? / TBA		2015	2.130
2020	2.125		2014	2.133
2019	2.115		2013	2.122
2018	2.134		2012	2.140
2017	2.123		2011	2.146
2016	2.131		2010	2.122
			2009	2.139

 

[sportscoach]

Just as FYI for everyone, here are the Super Two arbitration cutoff marks going back to 2009:

Someone with the cutoff or greater (ie. .148) is/was Super 2.
Those with service time less than the cutoff (ie. .099) were not Super 2

Year	Cutoff		Year	Cutoff
2021	??? / TBA		2015	2.130
2020	2.125		2014	2.133
2019	2.115		2013	2.122
2018	2.134		2012	2.140
2017	2.123		2011	2.146
2016	2.131		2010	2.122
			2009	2.139

Do you know how they decide where the cutoff is at? I have a hunch if we stayed under the old system it would be a 2.140 type of year cause of covid/60 games gave a full season...

 

[Gson]

Do you know how they decide where the cutoff is at? I have a hunch if we stayed under the old system it would be a 2.140 type of year cause of covid/60 games gave a full season...

@sportscoach it's a straight percentage.. I think.. something like 22 % between a players second and third year in the majors..

 

[CATS44]

Depth Charts Roster Resource has Quantrill as arby one this off season.

 

[sportscoach]

Depth Charts Roster Resource has Quantrill as arby one this off season.

Sportrac and baseball reference have him as pre-arb.. Either way I don't think the price difference isn't going to hurt us in 22...

 

[MadThinker88]

Depth Charts Roster Resource has Quantrill as arby one this off season.

And it also has him as FA heading into the 2026 season.. That would be 4 yrs of arbitration ('22, '23, 24, '25)
Guess that group is assuming Cal will be a Super 2...

----------------------------------

The cost difference (pre-arb vs arb) will not be a big issue in 2022.
It gets to be a greater & greater difference in future arbitration years if Cal continues to perform....

 

[Gson]

Hmm... a few thoughts.. Before the start of the 2021 season.. there was significant amounts of discussion/posting about a deal with the Reds for Jose Israel Garcia.. Jonathan India, Reece Hinds, Nick Lodolo, Nick Senzel.. Jesse Winker.. etc.. etc..

My have the times changed.. For the current flavor of the day, Jesse Winker.. I suggested that he was good DH that needed to be hidden in defensively.. There was no indication that he would be able to put up kind of spectacular numbers he has this season.. During the offseason run up to the start.. the kinds of deals suggested including making Andres Gimenez the Indians starting shortstop while trading Amed Rosario and others for Nick Senzel and Winker and others.. that deal would probably turned into a wash given Winker's offensive display both with the bat and the glove.. Senzel would have remained the nightmare he continues to be w/r to playing anytime soon.. The other parts of the deals suggested had both good and not so good outcomes.. it's baseball..

This retrospective isn't meant as a "I told you so".. or an admission of being wrong.. It is a review of what was said.. and what transpired during the 2021 season.. now that we're looking at the end coming in two weeks.. I still stand on what Jesse Winker would be with the Indians.. a DH who, if he had to play a defensive position..would be offensive.. or another Franmil..who, imho, can become a much better defensive player than Winker.. Hopefully, we'll get to see than in 2022..a svelt 240 pound Franimal doing his Cobra impression for the Indians..

 

[CATS44]

As we go into 2022, our rotation looks to be set.

Overall we've had an outstanding run of rotations since Tito arrived. How does next year's rotation stack up? One way is to look at ERA+, which measures pitchers against league averages.

For this exercise, I'm using what the pitchers did as Indians, with the exception of Quantrill, for whom I've used his numbers in both SD and Cleveland. I think I have all the main SPs in that time span.

Clevinger...141
Bieber........137*
Kluber........134
Civale........122*
Plesac.......118*
Quantrill....118*
Cookie......114
Bauer........113
Salazar.....112
TMac........111*
Masterson...93
Tomlin........88

It's worth noting that Kluber, Cookie, and Bauer got better as time went on. Clev pretty much started elite, and held it. Tomlin and Masterson bounced up and down. Of the group, only Salazar went backward.

Its also worth noting that all five projected SPs have been much better at the same point in their careers than Kluber, Cookie, and Bauer.

 

[DCTribefan]

Anyone else find this message a little cryptic?

 

[Derek]

Anyone else find this message a little cryptic?

Seems pretty straightforward to me. If Tito is healthy enough, he’ll be the manager.

However, that’s far from a given at this point in time.

 

[DCTribefan]

Seems pretty straightforward to me. If Tito is healthy enough, he’ll be the manager.

However, that’s far from a given at this point in time.

“With where we are right now…”

 

[Derek]

“With where we are right now…”

Like I said, it all seems straightforward to me

 

[CATS44]

'With where we are right now' should probably be read 'with where Tito is right now '

 

[KluberSociety]

To me it looks like it's up to him, and they don't trust that he'll be ready or want to come back. It's a little cryptic in the sense that earlier releases seemed to indicate that he was having the surgery now so that he could come back and there was little doubt that he would.

We could end up in a pickle if we don't want Hale coaching yet Tito bows out. I'd assume the FO is able to have enough foresight to avoid this kind of situation though.