Evan Mobley: All-NBA 2nd Team

[Smooth]

i get your points but at the end of the day he also doesn't have any counter move when teams defend like the Raptors do now (and in the playoffs this will just continue especially in the later rounds...).

It's year 5 for him and he has no reliable midrange game, the Raptors dare him to shoot open 3s because he doesn't hit those consistently either. What does he do when he's not getting the ball on the move (close to the basket) or spoonfed for dunks and layups? This is his shot chart from game 2 where on paper he had a wonderful game (25 points on 11/13 shooting):


View attachment 38844

he even made one three in that game. The problem is, other than that this is the shot chart of Rudy Gobert but we can't put him at center fulltime because he's not able to hold his ground there against bigger guys there.

At this point i'm also afraid that the development of his jump shot will never happen, his form (you can especially see this during free-throws) consistently looks super slow, weird (often different on game to game basis) and flat (again: this is year 5...) .

Mentally he also doesn't strike me as a guy who in tough games (on the road) could potentially take over a game on offense, him playing next to someone who's mental makeup is similar emphasizes that issue.

That's more of a genral issue but it seems like both of our starting frontcourt players don't have any go-to moves (again: unless you count getting spoonfed very close to the basket) when things aren't going their way and that way never have the confidence in playoff games to overcome adversity. This might not be the case in every game, when they're playing at home and their first few shots are falling then it's different sometimes, but this will never be the case consistently in playoff games especially against smart teams that defend well.

Giving him a max. contract extension seemed like a no brainer a few seasons ago (because we probably all thought his development wouldn't stagnate) but where are you going as a team if your super max guy can't be relied on to create his own shot on offense and he often times completely disappears when games get tough?

Again: it would be easier if we could make him a center full time because then we could focus on finding someone with shooting range to play next to him (there are further problems with that though, see my next point).

Maybe i'm overreacting now (based on a few really bad games) but the entire team construction looks bad on paper right now, if we split up the two bigs lineup in the offseason by trading Allen for example then we could no longer cover up the terrible defense Mitchell and Harden are playing on the perimeter, so that might not be-all, end-all solution either...

I'm an optimist and i think we're still gonna win this series, but Toronto is not a good team, they had one of the worst shooting performances i've ever seen in a playoff game yesterday and they still won. What will happen once we meet true contending teams that can hit open 3s but also defend in a similar and smart way (pack the paint and dare them to shoot)?

The three-point shot was supposed to be the answer for diversifying his offensive portfolio but that went by the wayside when he went through his calf injuries and it seemingly messed up his mechanics and then his confidence in the shot.. 37% and 37.3% from three over the last two years, and then 37.9% the first two months of the season before his calf injuries started to pop up and it went downhill..

This is also where development comes into play and putting him in a box his first few years instead of tinkering with his development then put the Cavs behind the eight ball.. His first year in the league 11% of his shots were long mid-range; that dropped to 5% the next two years and then 2% and 3% this season and last... As we even saw to begin the year and to the end of the year, the primary focus of how JB and Kenny have used him is pushing him further towards the basket instead of utilizing in different ways that they set forth when their tenure began..

The ironic part of this discussion is the Giannis component... Giannis was at 34% from long mid-range in his 5th year with Mobley coming right in at 31%.. The biggest difference right now is Mobley does not consistently play with the same type of force and aggressiveness in how he operates once he gets inside the paint.. You can live with the middling mid-range if you're as good as Giannis was in getting downhill and finishing but when that comes-and-goes (which is frustrating to see with Mobley) there has to be more of a skill element to balance his game.. His go-to move should be his ability to get downhill (which we've seen him do) but that's been wholly dependent on his mentality which sways in a game-by-game basis..

One of the biggest issues I have with Kenny within all this is not utilizing Mobley as a playmaker more and expanding his offensive value instead of limiting it.. Career high AST% this year, and career low TOV%.. The Raptors series is a perfect example of where that can come in handy to help diffuse pressure and expand the Cavs offensive options when it comes to shot creation.. We saw inverted screens to begin the game and to begin the 3Q and it result in buckets both times.. Why is that not leaned on more? If you put Mobley and Allen in a box and force them to be play finishers and enable them to do more, this is partly what happens when the guards get bogged down with the Raptors high pressure..

I understand the notion of trying to split up the bigs but when they've played together it's been a +14 in 38 minutes with a 120 offensive rating and 98.7 defensive rating... There's some things that have gone wrong but the pairing of those two is not one of them..

 

[bdc2014]

The three-point shot was supposed to be the answer for diversifying his offensive portfolio but that went by the wayside when he went through his calf injuries and it seemingly messed up his mechanics and then his confidence in the shot.. 37% and 37.3% from three over the last two years, and then 37.9% the first two months of the season before his calf injuries started to pop up and it went downhill..

This is also where development comes into play and putting him in a box his first few years instead of tinkering with his development then put the Cavs behind the eight ball.. His first year in the league 11% of his shots were long mid-range; that dropped to 5% the next two years and then 2% and 3% this season and last... As we even saw to begin the year and to the end of the year, the primary focus of how JB and Kenny have used him is pushing him further towards the basket instead of utilizing in different ways that they set forth when their tenure began..

The ironic part of this discussion is the Giannis component... Giannis was at 34% from long mid-range in his 5th year with Mobley coming right in at 31%.. The biggest difference right now is Mobley does not consistently play with the same type of force and aggressiveness in how he operates once he gets inside the paint.. You can live with the middling mid-range if you're as good as Giannis was in getting downhill and finishing but when that comes-and-goes (which is frustrating to see with Mobley) there has to be more of a skill element to balance his game.. His go-to move should be his ability to get downhill (which we've seen him do) but that's been wholly dependent on his mentality which sways in a game-by-game basis..

One of the biggest issues I have with Kenny within all this is not utilizing Mobley as a playmaker more and expanding his offensive value instead of limiting it.. Career high AST% this year, and career low TOV%.. The Raptors series is a perfect example of where that can come in handy to help diffuse pressure and expand the Cavs offensive options when it comes to shot creation.. We saw inverted screens to begin the game and to begin the 3Q and it result in buckets both times.. Why is that not leaned on more? If you put Mobley and Allen in a box and force them to be play finishers and enable them to do more, this is partly what happens when the guards get bogged down with the Raptors high pressure..

I understand the notion of trying to split up the bigs but when they've played together it's been a +14 in 38 minutes with a 120 offensive rating and 98.7 defensive rating... There's some things that have gone wrong but the pairing of those two is not one of them..

Mobley getting ball against Poetl with a spread floor was really good.

 

[bdc2014]

Somehow this thread always turns into a cesspool after every game...

He’s the scapegoat of choice.

Every NBA playoff game is fraud v fraud to the poasters. Lose and fraudulence of your least favorite player is confirmed. Win and it doesn’t count b/c that bum barely succeeded against a fraud.

 

[Kouki]

I think everyone is shitting on everyone pretty equally tbqh

It's just magnified because of the mobley defense force

 

[bdc2014]

I think everyone is shitting on everyone pretty equally tbqh

It's just magnified because of the mobley defense force

just depends on the point of comparison. He’s not playing like a top-5 unicorn or whatever.

He’s playing as well as Franz, Sengun, Duren, etc. so if you think those are his peers he’s OK.

 

[*L-Train*]

The three-point shot was supposed to be the answer for diversifying his offensive portfolio but that went by the wayside when he went through his calf injuries and it seemingly messed up his mechanics and then his confidence in the shot.. 37% and 37.3% from three over the last two years, and then 37.9% the first two months of the season before his calf injuries started to pop up and it went downhill..

This is also where development comes into play and putting him in a box his first few years instead of tinkering with his development then put the Cavs behind the eight ball.. His first year in the league 11% of his shots were long mid-range; that dropped to 5% the next two years and then 2% and 3% this season and last... As we even saw to begin the year and to the end of the year, the primary focus of how JB and Kenny have used him is pushing him further towards the basket instead of utilizing in different ways that they set forth when their tenure began..

The ironic part of this discussion is the Giannis component... Giannis was at 34% from long mid-range in his 5th year with Mobley coming right in at 31%.. The biggest difference right now is Mobley does not consistently play with the same type of force and aggressiveness in how he operates once he gets inside the paint.. You can live with the middling mid-range if you're as good as Giannis was in getting downhill and finishing but when that comes-and-goes (which is frustrating to see with Mobley) there has to be more of a skill element to balance his game.. His go-to move should be his ability to get downhill (which we've seen him do) but that's been wholly dependent on his mentality which sways in a game-by-game basis..

One of the biggest issues I have with Kenny within all this is not utilizing Mobley as a playmaker more and expanding his offensive value instead of limiting it.. Career high AST% this year, and career low TOV%.. The Raptors series is a perfect example of where that can come in handy to help diffuse pressure and expand the Cavs offensive options when it comes to shot creation.. We saw inverted screens to begin the game and to begin the 3Q and it result in buckets both times.. Why is that not leaned on more? If you put Mobley and Allen in a box and force them to be play finishers and enable them to do more, this is partly what happens when the guards get bogged down with the Raptors high pressure..

I understand the notion of trying to split up the bigs but when they've played together it's been a +14 in 38 minutes with a 120 offensive rating and 98.7 defensive rating... There's some things that have gone wrong but the pairing of those two is not one of them..

thanks for your detailed response and with all the discussions about his skillset (or lack thereof) and go-to moves etc.... to be honest i think the bold part is my biggest gripe with him but he's by far not the only one on this team who has this issue (Hello Jarret Allen...)

 

[Dr No]

just depends on the point of comparison. He’s not playing like a top-5 unicorn or whatever.

He’s playing as well as Franz, Sengun, Duren, etc. so if you think those are his peers he’s OK.

if we were getting Sengun level play from Evan this series would have been a sweep. Sengun is playing with energy, toughness and is averaging 23 & 10. I can't stand the dude, but I wish Mobley would display a similar passion once in a while.

 

[CleveRocks]

Sure, I would trade Mobley for Sengun straight up, but that is not happening.. If we get eliminated here, Mitchell and Hardin are gone. So best scenario is to win out and maybe everybody wakes the fuck up, and plays champion ball from the jump.. that has not happened in Toronto

 

[Kouki]

Mobley has to consciously decide to be aggressive and that's the problem.

 

[Futuredome]

Mobley has to consciously decide to be aggressive and that's the problem.

That's not the problem. The problem is Mitchell and Harden are dribbling the life out of the ball. Then Mobley gets stationary, which doesn't support his game

if we were getting Sengun level play from Evan this series would have been a sweep. Sengun is playing with energy, toughness and is averaging 23 & 10. I can't stand the dude, but I wish Mobley would display a similar passion once in a while.

Yeah, playing to a 3-1 deficit. Stop looking at raw stats.

 

[Dr No]

That's not the problem. The problem is Mitchell and Harden are dribbling the life out of the ball. Then Mobley gets stationary, which doesn't support his game

Yeah, playing to a 3-1 deficit. Stop looking at raw stats.

Uh - I have actually watched the Lakers/Rockets series. I readily agree that Mitchell and Harden are not helping Evan, but had you watched the way Sengun has played in the series they are down 3-1, you'd see he has significantly outplayed Evan even more than the raw stats display.

 

[ryanf]

play like this every time please

 

[Thelastcavsfan]

Unlike Allen Mobley seems to give effort this is just who he is. Can’t give more than he’s giving. Allen out here with 3 rebounds and can’t wait to clock out

 

[Smooth]

 

[Dr No]

speaking of the broadcast - they were lousy showing replays. There were many plays that I wanted to see again - were they fouls? Did the ball hit the line? kind of stuff - and they never got to it. Just more talking and showing buckets scored a full minute earlier. There were a couple of plays where our crowd is going nuts at fouls called to the point that Van Gundy even said something about it, but did we ever see the actual play they were complaining so loudly about? Nope.