Game Thread 2020-21 Season | Game #19 | Cavs @ Knicks | January 29, 2021

[Soar]

The draft may have sucked... I'm just saying as much as Okoro contributes and he does on defense.... He's great on D.

It would be nice if the 5th pick could make a layup or dribble.

I don't question his work ethic. By all accounts he's relentless about becoming better.

Its more frustration about having a top 5 pick and ending up with a guy who is just so limited right now.

 

["MVP"]

I've been very encouraged with Okoro thus far. Two of his biggest weaknesses this season have been finishing and dropping passes -- two of his biggest strengths at Auburn. His confidence seems a little shaken offensively, but he'll figure it out and be fine.

Sloppy game all around. No reason to over-analyze.

 

[redscoon]

The tank talk is silly. Are you suggesting we don’t play talented young players and hinder their development? It’s not like we have a group of vets that are contributing that we can shut down. Our only vets outside of Drummond are already shut down.

You can’t jump from high lottery to contender over night. At some point you have to toil in the middle for a little while. That appears to be where we are at right now. Talented enough to win a nice chunk of games, but not polished and consistent enough to do it night in and night out.

 

[Kouki]

I've been very encouraged with Okoro thus far. Two of his biggest weaknesses this season have been finishing and dropping passes -- two of his biggest strengths at Auburn. His confidence seems a little shaken offensively, but he'll figure it out and be fine.

Sloppy game all around. No reason to over-analyze.

Exactly. One day a light bulb is going to go off for him and we will see the same meteoric rise we saw from Sexton. Not that he's going to be a 25ppg scorer - doubt he ever is - but we will see him much more comfortable driving and slashing and finishing and dishing. I don't know if the light bulb will be this season, or this offseason, or next year, but it will come.

We knew his handles were shaky coming out of college but he had a few go-to moves that were smooth. He was a great finisher in college (with both hands) with really good feel and footwork around the basket, and he will get there in the NBA.

He's playing tentative on offense partially due to getting adjusted to the NBA and struggling against size and athleticism, and partly because he's not stupid and realizes his relative limitations at this time.

 

[CavsFaninNJ]

The draft may have sucked... I'm just saying as much as Okoro contributes and he does on defense.... He's great on D.

It would be nice if the 5th pick could make a layup or dribble.

I don't question his work ethic. By all accounts he's relentless about becoming better.

Its more frustration about having a top 5 pick and ending up with a guy who is just so limited right now.

“It would be nice if the 5th pick could make a layup or dribble”

So I guess you’re saying it sucks that the draft wasn’t deep.

I’ll be pulling for Okoro because he’s on the Cavs. I really don’t understand holding his draft position against him or the team unless some great players were picked 5-8. And even then, it is what it is.

Were Sexton’s struggles in years 1 and 2 any less frustrating because he was only picked 8th?

At some point you got to let the draft position go.

 

[Dr. Claw]

The tank talk is silly. Are you suggesting we don’t play talented young players and hinder their development? It’s not like we have a group of vets that are contributing that we can shut down. Our only vets outside of Drummond are already shut down.

You can’t jump from high lottery to contender over night. At some point you have to toil in the middle for a little while. That appears to be where we are at right now. Talented enough to win a nice chunk of games, but not polished and consistent enough to do it night in and night out.

Tanking won't be necessary. The Cavs will lose games like these unless something changes.
Which is the best thing as far as the lottery is concerned. I hope the Cavs can get a top 3 pick under the new lottery rules. They've gotten #5 twice (the first of which was some pure BS but I'm cool with Garland)

 

[CavsFaninNJ]

Tanking won't be necessary. The Cavs will lose games like these unless something changes.
Which is the best thing as far as the lottery is concerned. I hope the Cavs can get a top 3 pick under the new lottery rules. They've gotten #5 twice (the first of which was some pure BS but I'm cool with Garland)

I hate the new lottery system, as the fan of a bad team. But I can see how it helps curb tanking.

That being said, I might start to like the new lottery if we’re in the 6-9th worst record range. Good shot for a team that’s not in the cellar to move up.

 

[Dr. Claw]

I hate the new lottery system, as the fan of a bad team. But I can see how it helps curb tanking.

That being said, I might start to like the new lottery if we’re in the 6-9th worst record range. Good shot for a team that’s not in the cellar to move up.

I think that might be where the Cavs end up when it's all said and done. This team craps the bed against very specific types of matchups (time well tell if it will be a hat trick against the Nets), regardless of how good the team actually is. Which is why I expect season sweeps from teams like Orlando and Boston unless something changes.

 

[OptimusPrime]

Only half of the guys drafted ahead of Okoro could really be argued to have been better than him so far this season. He was the 5th pick, not the first. The 5th pick is what tanking gets you.

Okoro has been fine. He needs to work on his shot and his all around offensive game, but he'll get better. If we're going to blast anyone for missing layups, I'd think it would be the guy that takes 17 of them a game and makes less than half of them.

Sexton didn't have a good game by his standards tonight, but he and Garland still combined for around 40 points. They got nothing from the front court. It happens. Nance not being able to hit anything hurt, but he's injured. Hopefully Love gets back soon and still has something in the tank.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

This game reminded me of the blowout loss to the Celtics. It was the same scenario; the Cavs had two home games then their first game on the road they got hammered.

Two weeks ago the Cavs beat the Knicks. Since that game the Cavs added Garland, Sexton, Windler, Allen and Prince. Guess what? They got hammered.

Drummond scored 33 in that win - tonight he scored 4. Him and Allen were missing layups and dunks right and left. I never saw so many missed uncontested shots at the rim. They missed three uncontested dunks! The whole team missed a ton of layups and shot 34.5% from the field. The Knicks are the best defensive team in the NBA but 33 points in the first half? Really?

I don't think Larry Nance's wrist is 100%. He was 1-for-9 and 0-for-5 on 3's. The wrist is definitely not OK. When you have two players in your starting lineup who barely score at all (Nance, Okoro) it puts a lot of pressure on the other three. Sexton's floater wasn't falling and he ended up 6-for-18. Prince and Cedi both went 1-for-7. Drummond was awful, although he worked hard on the glass. The Knicks' swarming and very physical defense bothered the Cavs a lot.

Allen, Osman, and Windler were all between -22 and -28 off the bench. Rivers, Quickley, and Noel were between +17 and +24 off the Knicks' bench. Their bench destroyed our bench and that was the difference in the game. Immanuel Quickley was a +19 and scored 25 points in 25 minutes.

At least Garland is getting his mojo back after the injury with 24 points in 29 minutes.

Give the Knicks' defense a lot of credit, but the Cavs just could not get their shots to fall. Bickerstaff needs to find a way to have them more ready to play on the first game of a road trip. The Knicks had a 28-9 run at the end of the second quarter and a 16-3 run at the end of the third. If I'm not mistaken the Cavs had the same problem last year where they frequently let opponents go on big runs right before halftime or the end of the third quarter. That was when the bench was on the floor tonight and the Allen, Osman, Windler group got their asses handed to them. The Cavs need to learn to close the quarter strong.

Barrett manhandled Windler and guys like Cedi have no chance against Randle. Barrett played 40 minutes and was a +27. The Cavs kept letting him go to his left and take it to the rim. He was too big, strong, and athletic to stop once he got going down the left side of the lane.

The Knicks bench was 18-for-34. They actually have a nice young nucleus between Barrett, Randle, Quickley, Noel, and Toppin. They're not a bad team. Already this season they have wins against Milwaukee, Boston, Utah, and Indiana. When they're on their game they can beat anybody. I'm glad we won't see them the rest of the season.

 

[Ohioplayer00]

I hate the new lottery system, as the fan of a bad team. But I can see how it helps curb tanking.

That being said, I might start to like the new lottery if we’re in the 6-9th worst record range. Good shot for a team that’s not in the cellar to move up.

Book it this year: CAVS GET THE #2 PICK

 

[KilgoreTrout]

I think that might be where the Cavs end up when it's all said and done. This team craps the bed against very specific types of matchups (time well tell if it will be a hat trick against the Nets), regardless of how good the team actually is. Which is why I expect season sweeps from teams like Orlando and Boston unless something changes.

We were really short-handed against Orlando twice. Really hard to know how we would do against them at full strength.

 

[foucault87]

I didn't get to watch the game but I think some of you need to review what is meant by sample size. Statistical variance tells us any team will throw up a clunker every now and then. Sometimes the whole team does it. It happens. Reacting off of one game is mindless, especially in a sport like basketball which has a long season. You have to look at longitudinal trends and not react based on what happens in a single game.

If I watched that 33/24 game from Drummond and only that, I would think he was an MVP and the best offensive center in the league. If I only watch Cedi's game today, I start trying to find the best 2nd rounder for him. Chill out guys. I have read some of the worst immediate takes in a long time in this thread. How does Okoro go from being the next Paul Pierce to absolute crap in 3 days? Absolutely ridiculous.

 

[KilgoreTrout]

Only half of the guys drafted ahead of Okoro could really be argued to have been better than him so far this season. He was the 5th pick, not the first. The 5th pick is what tanking gets you.

Okoro has been fine. He needs to work on his shot and his all around offensive game, but he'll get better. If we're going to blast anyone for missing layups, I'd think it would be the guy that takes 17 of them a game and makes less than half of them.

Sexton didn't have a good game by his standards tonight, but he and Garland still combined for around 40 points. They got nothing from the front court. It happens. Nance not being able to hit anything hurt, but he's injured. Hopefully Love gets back soon and still has something in the tank.

Like I said, I don’t get Cedi. We he’s off, he’s not just bad - he drops a Larry-Hughes-level MEGA-turd at center court. Like, 1/3 of the time, he is so noxious, he doesn’t just retreat into the background - he kills the team. I’m not sure we can HAVE that. When he’s like that, JB has to have a quick hook!

 

[KilgoreTrout]

This game reminded me of the blowout loss to the Celtics. It was the same scenario; the Cavs had two home games then their first game on the road they got hammered.

Two weeks ago the Cavs beat the Knicks. Since that game the Cavs added Garland, Sexton, Windler, Allen and Prince. Guess what? They got hammered.

Drummond scored 33 in that win - tonight he scored 4. Him and Allen were missing layups and dunks right and left. I never saw so many missed uncontested shots at the rim. They missed three uncontested dunks! The whole team missed a ton of layups and shot 34.5% from the field. The Knicks are the best defensive team in the NBA but 33 points in the first half? Really?

I don't think Larry Nance's wrist is 100%. He was 1-for-9 and 0-for-5 on 3's. The wrist is definitely not OK. When you have two players in your starting lineup who barely score at all (Nance, Okoro) it puts a lot of pressure on the other three. Sexton's floater wasn't falling and he ended up 6-for-18. Prince and Cedi both went 1-for-7. Drummond was awful, although he worked hard on the glass. The Knicks' swarming and very physical defense bothered the Cavs a lot.

Allen, Osman, and Windler were all between -22 and -28 off the bench. Rivers, Quickley, and Noel were between +17 and +24 off the Knicks' bench. Their bench destroyed our bench and that was the difference in the game. Immanuel Quickley was a +19 and scored 25 points in 25 minutes.

At least Garland is getting his mojo back after the injury with 24 points in 29 minutes.

Give the Knicks' defense a lot of credit, but the Cavs just could not get their shots to fall. Bickerstaff needs to find a way to have them more ready to play on the first game of a road trip. The Knicks had a 28-9 run at the end of the second quarter and a 16-3 run at the end of the third. If I'm not mistaken the Cavs had the same problem last year where they frequently let opponents go on big runs right before halftime or the end of the third quarter. That was when the bench was on the floor tonight and the Allen, Osman, Windler group got their asses handed to them. The Cavs need to learn to close the quarter strong.

Barrett manhandled Windler and guys like Cedi have no chance against Randle. Barrett played 40 minutes and was a +27. The Cavs kept letting him go to his left and take it to the rim. He was too big, strong, and athletic to stop once he got going down the left side of the lane.

The Knicks bench was 18-for-34. They actually have a nice young nucleus between Barrett, Randle, Quickley, Noel, and Toppin. They're not a bad team. Already this season they have wins against Milwaukee, Boston, Utah, and Indiana. When they're on their game they can beat anybody. I'm glad we won't see them the rest of the season.

How on earth do 7-footers miss uncontested dunks? Like, how is that POSSIBLE?