Isaac 3 & D Okoro - A Two Way Playing Basketball Savant

[Cavatt]

Coming to this thread is timely, because I have recently realized that the "Okoro Question" is an annoying one for me. People harp over his draft position, the lack of shooting, and at this point I ask only one question: does he lose the Cavs games? No. I can point to several games where Okoro contributed to winning in a major way over the course of this season.

I struggle to understand where more shots for Okoro in the starting line up as it is today makes sense. Where you get most of the team's points from Garland, Mitchell, Mobley and Allen. I do think there needs to be more movement in the offense and more passing when the backcourt's pull-up game is not hitting like that. I really don't want to see Okoro out there doing what Donovan (for example) is doing on offense. Okoro's offensive impact may be seen more when there is less ISO out there. There appears to be more opportunities on the bench unit in that regard.

I just want more ball movement. He thrives in the scenario where everyone is making plays. He can participate in that too. When bodies move and the ball moves he is at his best and can exploit the seams.

He's been good as a roller and has made good passes in the short roll.

8-10 pts is all he needs. When he is at his best he is very efficient, hits most of his layups, makes a couple passes and hits some free throws.

Last game he attacked Deni off the dribble, with no screen and just overpowered and went by him. I would love to see him attack weaker defenders like that when he has the opportunity, especially if they are hiding a high offense poor defense guy on him

 

[dms]

Coming to this thread is timely, because I have recently realized that the "Okoro Question" is an annoying one for me. People harp over his draft position, the lack of shooting, and at this point I ask only one question: does he lose the Cavs games? No. I can point to several games where Okoro contributed to winning in a major way over the course of this season.

Watch a replay of the last Sixers game. Who do you think Embiid was guarding much of the game??? Okoro. How much energy do you think Embiid used on the defensive end? The Cavs 2nd possession of the game illustrated the problem. The ball is on the right side of the court and 9 of the players are on that side of the court too. The exception is Okoro, all by his lonesome in the left corner. The guy "guarding" him, Embiid, is actually underneath the hoop on the other side of the basket from Okoro! Garland tries to drive but there's nowhere to go since Embiid is waiting for him in the paint, so he actually dishes to an all alone Okoro who is heading to the hoop, where of course his dunk attempt is swallowed up by Embiid. Next possession down Mitchell hits a three, but again Embiid is 25' from Okoro, just resting on D waiting to help in the paint.
Okoro's lack of scoring is not the issue, the issue is that other teams realize that he is absolutely no threat to them, forcing Mitchell and Garland to go through an extra defender and allowing whomever is guarding him to rest. Last year in the play in JB had to yank Okoro against the Hawks as Atlanta had Trae Young on him, and Young was able to rest on D as Okoro made no effort whatsoever on the offensive end. When the playoffs come this year you will see the same thing, teams will totally ignore Okoro making it much tougher for everyone else.
Okoro doesn't do anything to directly lose a game, but he makes it much more difficult for everybody else to win one. It's why come the playoffs you will probably see LeVert playing 35 minutes a night and Okoro for about 15. Okoro is fine as a 7th or 8th guy off the bench, but in the starting line up he exacerbates spacing issues which are already difficult to play with in today's game.

 

[Jscc]

Per cleaningtheglass.com, the Cavs' best lineup this year (over 150 possessions) has been Garland, Mitchell, LeVert, Mobley, and Allen at +13.4 points per 100 possessions. If you put Okoro into that lineup for LeVert it drops to +5.7. Putting Stevens in that spot drops it to -3.4.

I watched the Chase Down podcast a week or two ago and they were discussing why exchanging Okoro for LeVert makes that lineup better. It apparently has to do with contesting corner 3s.

Opponents shooting percentages for left corner 3s / right corner 3s / corner 3s:

against LeVert = 38% / 35.5% / 36.7%

against Okoro = 42.4% / 40.2% / 41.3%

 

[mAo_mAo]

We will see how having Okoro in the starting lineup will fuck up our offense once the playoffs start. The court will be just too congested for us to operate with three non shooters in the lineup.

I hope I am wrong, though. But, we have seen this shit before. Heck, when we played the Warriors back then, we dared Barnes to hit his shots.

 

[Cavatt]

I watched the Chase Down podcast a week or two ago and they were discussing why exchanging Okoro for LeVert makes that lineup better. It apparently has to do with contesting corner 3s.

Opponents shooting percentages for left corner 3s / right corner 3s / corner 3s:

against LeVert = 38% / 35.5% / 36.7%

against Okoro = 42.4% / 40.2% / 41.3%

Their point was that they use Okoro as point of attack, so it isn't that Levert is better contesting it is that putting Mitchell or Garland on that guy in the corner is worse than Having Levert guard him

 

[Peacedog]

So a player who makes 36% of his threes (probably 40+% since Jan 1) is now a "non shooter?" Fascinating.

 

[2 For The Brew]

So a player who makes 36% of his threes (probably 40+% since Jan 1) is now a "non shooter?" Fascinating.

He has a higher 3pt shooting percentage this season than Dean Wade.

 

[Peacedog]

Yeah, over 43% since Jan 1, which is a 36 game sample size. Sometimes, I wonder if some posters here actually watch the games.

 

[dms]

Yeah, over 43% since Jan 1, which is a 36 game sample size. Sometimes, I wonder if some posters here actually watch the games.

I wonder that too.
Some people i think just look at numbers and don't watch the actual games.

 

[Jscc]

Yeah, over 43% since Jan 1, which is a 36 game sample size. Sometimes, I wonder if some posters here actually watch the games.

We will see what he is in the post-season when teams game-plan him.

 

[Dr No]

He has a higher 3pt shooting percentage this season than Dean Wade.

you really think that if they played Wade the same way they play Okoro he'd have the same numbers? Talk about wondering if people actually watch games or just look at numbers . . .

 

[Lee]

Yeah, over 43% since Jan 1, which is a 36 game sample size. Sometimes, I wonder if some posters here actually watch the games.

Okoro has been making them pay a bit for leaving him open.

But Okoro isnt a shooter, he doesnt take a ton of 3's, only takes when he is wide open, and even then atleast half the time he fakes the shot and drives to the basket to be typically cut off and pass out of it.

Leave Garland or Mitchell open in the corner like Okoro is almost every possession and they would make 10 3's a game.

But I am not mad at Okoro, he has shot respectable since Jan 1 from the corner, just needs to take more shots, learn to make the shot with a hand in his face and take 5 or 6 a game, the opportunity is there for him.

Also, Okoro is not a complete product, who knows if he can step up on shooting even more with hard work, we know he puts the time in.

 

[jmuxl]

I've been acutely following Okoro's threes, as I've made some good money betting Okoro over 0.5 threes for anywhere from +130 to -210.

23-7 since I started betting it, which was the Minnesota game back in January. At that rate, the implied odds over the last 30 games would be -329, so even at -210, still ahead of the market.

 

[Cavatt]

So a player who makes 36% of his threes (probably 40+% since Jan 1) is now a "non shooter?" Fascinating.

Only 4 + shooters on the team this year. Mitchell, Garland, Levert and Okoro.

I would not have believed that had you said it under oath before the season.

Okoro isn't passing them up anymore unless he thinks he can drive on a guy. He doesn't need to make them pay every game, he just needs to do it early in the series lol

 

[Dr No]

Only 4 + shooters on the team this year. Mitchell, Garland, Levert and Okoro.

I would not have believed that had you said it under oath before the season.

Okoro isn't passing them up anymore unless he thinks he can drive on a guy. He doesn't need to make them pay every game, he just needs to do it early in the series lol

Okoro is not a + shooter. He's just not ridiculously bad anymore. He is shooting mainly "free throws" from 3. I was at the Philly game and could see the floor well. Every shot he (and Stevens) took is because they wanted him to take it. Every good team we play from here on out is going to dare Okoro, Stevens & Rubio to beat them from 3.