Kevin Love - Miami Ground Machine

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

I'm struggling to see the reach about Blatt and Love having some sort of major riff.

When Blatt said "me or Kevin Love", according to the article where that's the quote, he was specifically referring to who would be the fall guy for the Cavs.

The entire locker room (sans Kyrie, apparently) having issues with Blatt was much more of a LeBron thing than a Love thing.

Jr, Delly, Shumpert and Mozgov probably liked him too.

 

[Nphan]

So,Lebron took all the blame for Blatt's departure but not one word about Mr. Talc part in it. And,it look like he was throwing the team under the bus then...

He needs to be shut down just like JR and then traded during the offseason...I'm sorry you can't have a person like that on the team,especially a young team like us...

He was acting like a leader and that he wanted to lead a young team before he got his contract too. Now look at him. That's why TT is the true Cavs. Love is the polar opposite.

 

[Randolphkeys]

He does not have an achilles injury.
Achilles is a great excuse to sit out as it is a lingering, sometimes chronic injury. Cavs and Love can milk it however they see fit.
League office can't do nothing.

Literally nobody reputable has said this to be true. Look, when I read sources claim Love didn't support Beilein, that's one thing. Making shit up because you don't like Love is quite another.

Having veterans held out over minor injuries is commonplace and has been since I first heard about it in the 1990s, but nobody has actually said that is what happened.

After having a decent January and early February his advanced stats went to shit during the Clippers game, he didn't look the same in the clips I watched, then the team announced he would have a break to deal with an injury. There is more evidence that he is injured than not injured.

 

[Cavatt]

The Achilles is weird. I thought it was fake too, but it doesn't seem a good one to make up while trying to get value from his contract. Seems like it might scare teams off from trading for him even if they were interested.

 

[Alec]

We can be terrible with or without Kevin Love. Sign a tall guy who can shoot a three and move on. He’s a self-admitted headcase and coach killer. There’s no blood left in this stone.

 

[Randolphkeys]

We can be terrible with or without Kevin Love. Sign a tall guy who can shoot a three and move on. He’s a self-admitted headcase and coach killer. There’s no blood left in this stone.

I don't think this logic ends in wins or development of your draftees, Chris Grant. Hard tanks haven't shown as much success as combining actual NBA talent with young players, and that is the model Altman is trying to emulate. Will it work? Impossible to know... but Cleveland should know what doesn't work.

 

[Cavatt]

I don't think this logic ends in wins or development of your draftees, Chris Grant. Hard tanks haven't shown as much success as combining actual NBA talent with young players, and that is the model Altman is trying to emulate. Will it work? Impossible to know... but Cleveland should know what doesn't work.

I prefer this way to out and out tanking. I don't prefer Love tho. Every journalist is saying he nuked Beilein immediately and is setting a bad example. Even if the Coach "deserved" it I feel this way.

 

[cabs]

I don't think this logic ends in wins or development of your draftees, Chris Grant. Hard tanks haven't shown as much success as combining actual NBA talent with young players, and that is the model Altman is trying to emulate. Will it work? Impossible to know... but Cleveland should know what doesn't work.

I get what you are saying, I think being continually the worst team breeds a loser culture that is hard to shake but Love is just so detrimental to the team with his attitude.

 

[Cavatt]

I get what you are saying, I think being continually the worst team breeds a loser culture that is hard to shake but Love is just so detrimental to the team with his attitude.

We have 2 almost full season of evidence. When Love was out the team was terrible, but the locker room was reportedly pretty good. When Love has been mostly healthy this year, the record is basically the same but the locker room is worse they broke an old man's spirit. What difference has Love made in the win column, if any? Very hard to say. He looks like he has the worst effort every night.

 

[Randolphkeys]

We are absolutely talking about a cost- benefit analysis when discussing Kevin Love in a Cavaliers uniform, and I'm glad several people are viewing it through that lens. I do wonder if all factors are being taken into account with this cost-benefit analysis because clearly the front office has been willing to find a fair trade for Love, but no fair trades have been agreed upon since last off-season.

I have been following the NBA with a few inside nuggets for a very long time. I have seen players force their way off of teams in a variety of capacities. While I'm not saying Love is doing a good job modeling what a veteran on a rebuilding team should do - tangent: Korver, Delly, Channing, Big Z and Anthony Parker were legit - they aren't doing the type of undermining we saw from JR Smith. We aren't seeing him threaten elective surgery like Kyrie. We aren't seeing a Dennis Rodman type or a Gilbert Arenas type... we are seeing an aging vet who gets moody after losses. There is a difference, and it's why JR wasn't allowed around the team. Again, I feel like plenty of fans just want to see the liquidation of veterans... but there is a difference in a veteran who is still a major contributor and cranky compared to a veteran with nothing left in the tank or a veteran who is truly a cancer.

We are also seeing a player who carries advanced stats that suggest he is the most positively impactful asset on the team, even if he is overpaid. Fans can bitch about the amount he demands per year because it makes him harder to trade, but remember that number prevented the Cavs from losing him as an asset without any compensation. If Love left as a free agent, they would have a lower than replacement value power forward playing those minutes. The front office doesn't want that to happen with such an inexperienced group of guards.

The front office seems to have a plan. They let rookies play through mistakes. They sit veterans to prioritize development of young players. They moved Clarkson, who was playing well, when an offer seemed right. That plan includes Love being traded when the compensation is fair, but that simply hasn't happened yet, and a small market cold weather franchise desperately needs intelligent asset management.

 

[Alec]

I can’t argue with any of that, RK. It is for the best that the team is planning on maximizing his value and not acquiescing his attempt to cancer his way out of town (if that’s indeed what’s happening). I just hope the “maximizing his value” part comes to fruition and his value doesn’t continue to dwindle with age. That in itself is a culture move that tells future players the Cavs don’t play that pouting ish. They must see the kids as headstrong enough to go about their business the right way despite the guy making 15x their salary being being a moody turd.

 

[Bucketz]

Great

The general issue fans have with him isn't him falling short as a vocal leader but that he lacks every basketball intangible you can think of as our best and highest paid player while his body continues to fail him. IMO he's content and doesn't mind the losing but just wanted to do it with the least amount of resistance possible. Blatt and Beilein had different types of red flags individually as coaches but both of them having issues with Love during two different points of the franchises trajectory isn't a coincidence.

Empirically THIS team is worse without him (no question about it) and in fact are unwatchable but it's pretty clear the FO regrets that deal as he was a terrible fit for their "reload instead of rebuild" strategy. Plenty of red flag commentary from several guys this season questioning why guys don't work hard during games.

When I sadly think about his contract but then remember how he finessed the team by wearing a construction hat when announcing it ...

The new SI/Madden curse...

the Cavs marketing biz knows what they are doing at least! You can’t change your strategy all the time and keep up with the competition. Have a vision, a mission, then align your strategy.

He was acting like a leader and that he wanted to lead a young team before he got his contract too. Now look at him. That's why TT is the true Cavs. Love is the polar opposite.

TT all day. Seriously, we need more TT/Sexton/nance/Porter JR types. The ones who pass the eye test with flying colors IMO. even cedi/deli fall in there. I’m talking intangibles. Sure you can get away with less, if you KNOW you have a great coach, but when you are betting on a new coach and new players and a vet to play a new role, we’ll there is a lot of risk, and that’s what we are seeing play out. This org right now is playing the higher the risk the higher the reward game...and we are seeing it play out in a worst case scenario.

 

[inliner311]

I prefer this way to out and out tanking. I don't prefer Love tho. Every journalist is saying he nuked Beilein immediately and is setting a bad example. Even if the Coach "deserved" it I feel this way.

Not defending Love but Sexton including Love in this group seemed the complete opposite of what we see of their relationship on the court.

"Who were some of the veterans who had the biggest impact on you and mentored you the most – whether it’s on or off the court.

CS: K-Love, Chris Paul and Coach Avery Johnson. Those guys, they’ve been where I want to get to. I just take bits and pieces of their game so that I can learn from them and understand the game even more. My relationship with Chris goes back to high school when I played on his teams (Team CP3). Ever since then, we’ve just been building that relationship. I talk to him every week and just pick his brain and figure out how he feels about certain plays and things that I can incorporate into my game. It’s cool."

Collin Sexton Q&A: 'I talk to Chris Paul every week to pick his brain'

Collin Sexton opened up to HoopsHype about his development, relationship with Chris Paul, his in-depth chat with Kobe Bryant and more.

hoopshype.com

 

[Cavatt]

This was the type of showing I wanted to see from Garland and Porter that would make me reconsider putting Sexton on the bench.

Love played pretty good defense on the perimeter. I would change his position to small forward. Played like Marvin Williams.

He can stay in front of a guy provided it isn't near the rin

 

[Randolphkeys]

This was the type of showing I wanted to see from Garland and Porter that would make me reconsider putting Sexton on the bench.

Love played pretty good defense on the perimeter. I would change his position to small forward. Played like Marvin Williams.

He can stay in front of a guy provided it isn't near the rin

I see the point you are making, but I feel like you are only looking at Love's role offensively. Love has the most polished perimeter game out of the bigs despite his lack of explosiveness. His passing from a standstill or off one bounce is as good as any guard, and he has been the most consistent outside shooting threat.

Defensively, Nance and Love worked as a forward pairing against the Heat because the Heat went small without many explosive athletes on the court. Nance, Love, and Thompson could focus on closing out against three pointers without being burned too much on drives. The grouping looked more like a Euroleagues lineup with multidimensional stretch fours on the floor at the same time. All that size can contest threes better than the Sexland back court, as long as they hustle out to contest.

Great play by all five of those guys last night, with Love a key cog at the end.