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So long, David Griffin

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Griff figured he would get offensively capable player (Frye, Korver, Deron) for a defensive coach. It didn't work out and Ty Lue proved to be a mediocre coach timeout management (lettting GSW go on 15-0 runs), personnel management (Liggins and Derrick playing too well then disappearing), increasing pace for a team with slow foot speed (bottom 3 in transition defense).

- I don't like Mark Jackson but his indirect criticism of Lue was hilariously spot on.

If we had Pop we probably lose in 6 still. I wonder if Lue listens to the RJ/Frye podcast? Embarrassing stuff for any professional team in any sport.
 
Stories will always contradict if you don't distinguish good sources of information from bad ones. I wasn't terribly surprised by Griffin leaving, and without another job lined up at that. The hints were always there since last offseason, the evidence is still present. That's said, the loss for the franchise is about to be overblown in the national media... the same group of storytellers who claimed LeBron was the real GM anyway. Enjoy sifting the sand for Golden nuggets, everyone. Lots of bullshit out there.
No I wasn't shocked...surprised ..but after listening to 92.3 yesterday,plus the stuff Windy had been saying for a few weeks, I was concerned.
I do want to know what the differences were/are about that forced him out.
I t is bad timing considering he was working on these deals...plus whatever draft plans they have.
Gilbert as you mention in your next post needs to be a hands off owner,his constant stir the pot is annoying and damages the organization a lot.
Listening to Windy now ..appears it was money/contract that they could not agree on..Dan didn't want to significantly up his pay.
 
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I like Griff a lot and I'm sad to see him go.

I definitely do not think this was all Gilbert, I believe it was just as much Griff not wanting to ride out what becomes a tougher proposition in the coming years, with a lot fewer ways to succeed and more pitfalls built in to the situation in Cleveland.

Griff proved he has balls of titanium when he fired Blatt and no doubt he has his own vision of how to build the team that clearly fell short this season. There's more than one way to skin a cat and while I like Griff as a person I don't completely agree with his vision on how to put together a team. I agree with those who would like to see more 2 way players and more defensive emphasis, more ball movement and less dependence on ISO and P&R.

Griff heard all the chatter about how Lebron was the defacto GM, how we only won because of Lebron and Gilbert's willingness to pay record luxury tax dollars. Griff knew there is virtually no narrative where he is considered a top GM in the NBA while he stays in Cleveland. He knows better than anyone what he's up against with Gilbert as owner and Lebron as the ruling prima donna.

This was never going to be about just money, it is also about vision and style. This was never a matter of Gilbert just paying Griff like a top 5 GM. To keep Griff Gilbert would have needed to pay him top dollar, plus cede control to Griff's vision of building offensive minded teams while sacrificing on defensive and 2 way players.

Although this is a bad time I now think it was inevitable that Griff was going to move on. I think Griff will savor taking a year off also, he's probably a big picture, quality of life type of a guy.

Our biggest loss in this was that Griff knew how to get deals done, he has deep and trusted connections around the league. Gilbert needs to find someone with comparable connections and network, and that will be hard if not impossible.

But I don't regret going in a different direction towards a more balanced and defensive minded approach. And I can't blame Gilbert for being concerned about a post Lebron era at least to some degree.
 
I think there is some truth to what you wrote. I also think that he probably blew through the assets left him by his predecessor when he could have been more judicious. He got us a ring so that is most important but I would not put him on the MT.Rushmore of NBA execs.

Too many people are taking for granted how hard it is to win a ring.

Only 7 franchises have won an NBA championship since 1996.

Compare that to MLB: 11

Or the NFL: 10

Winning in the NBA is so freakin hard. By those numbers, 30-40% harder than the other major sports.

Debating over the application of assets is a trivial exercise for me.

We won a title, so that diminishes a lot of negatives in the process IMO.

Any GM could have done better. That's a constant across all executives. There is no perfect GM.

Griff made the right move 2/3rd's of the time IMO and executing personnel moves to that frequency leads to positive results and a winning culture / organization.

Is he on Mt. Rushmore? No. Is he a good GM that will be hard to replace with equal value? Unequivocally yes.

This move will be judged by who replaces him and how successful they are. 1 championship is a really high bar.....LeBron or not.
 
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19685160/nba-end-david-griffin-tenure-cleveland

Griff!"

"C'mon, Griff!"

"Get up here!"

On a makeshift stage in a corner of TD Garden, Cleveland Cavaliers players wearing fresh white T-shirts with crisp "The NBA Finals 2017" lettering called David Griffin to join them. TNT's Ernie Johnson shifted to make room right up front for Griffin, as the smallest man in the huddle sheepishly joined the group.

Moments later, when it was time for a group photo, an assistant coach saw team owner Dan Gilbert standing behind the cameras and called for him to join too. Gilbert smiled and shook his head and declined, staying away.

LeBron James carried the Cavs, Griffin built them and Gilbert paid for them to the tune of $150 million this season including luxury taxes. But Gilbert didn't want to be a part of one of the NBA's rare glory moments, backing up from the awkwardness of posing alongside his general manager.
For months as the Cavs battled to assemble rhythm on the court and then hit their stride as they blitzed through the Eastern Conference playoffs, there was a growing tension within the team's executive offices. Griffin was on the final year of his contract and nervous. Gilbert had never extended the contract of a general manager -- he'd had four of them in his 12 years as owner -- and never felt pressured by the coming end of a contract.

Griffin had turned pessimistic about his future with the Cavs over the last months of the season, telling people he didn't think he'd be in the chair for very long. He was concerned enough that he started to keep an eye on other jobs that opened.

In part, Griffin was frustrated he was still one of the lowest-paid GMs in the league at less than $2 million per year on one of the shortest contracts, just three years after accepting under duress in 2014. After acting as interim for several months, Griffin had to announce the firing of coach Mike Brown on the day Griffin officially got the job. Gilbert didn't attend the news conference. Within days, Gilbert had offered John Calipari a job that would have made him Griffin's boss.

As such, Griffin also didn't have the power others in his position had. Most other executives who had won a championship had been promoted to president of basketball operations or similar titles if they hadn't had them already, from Bob Myers in Golden State to Donnie Nelson in Dallas to R.C. Buford in San Antonio to Danny Ainge in Boston.

Last season, Cavs coach Tyronn Lue received a five-year contract extension worth $7 million annually after helping the Cavs to a championship. Over the course of the summer, Griffin signed the coaching staff to new and, in some cases, lucrative extensions that brought their compensation toward the top of the league. Almost every player in the locker room was on a rich contract, Griffin having signed or re-signed six players to deals averaging $10 million or more per season.

Griffin had one of the best but hardest GM jobs in the league. His owner was willing to spend and willing to gamble, allowing him to operate in a position of strength in trades as he built the team. But he also had to deal with Gilbert's management style, which vacillated between overbearing and absent. Sometimes Gilbert would insert himself into trade talks, calling another owner directly, and derailing Griffin's plans. Sometimes he'd send scathing emails on subjects within and outside Griffin's control. And other times he was nowhere to be found, unreachable or distant at key moments.

Griffin balanced it all the past couple of seasons while dealing with his third bout of cancer since first being diagnosed in 2006. There were long treatment sessions. His signature red hair all but disappeared. Griffin hardly ever let on publicly, offering only a few clues along the way, such as the lapel pin he wore to his news conference after the dismissal of David Blatt, meant to show solidarity to others with the disease.

So when the Orlando Magic needed a new voice for their front office after firing Rob Hennigan the day after the regular season ended, Griffin was interested. Both in the job itself -- which was going to be the president role that Griffin desired and portended to pay handsomely, more than double his current salary -- and in the possible leverage it might get him with Gilbert when the time came.

When the Magic contacted Gilbert to ask for permission to speak to Griffin during the playoffs, he did not grant it. The Magic were quite interested, sources said, eager to get an executive with experience and their due diligence telling them Griffin wasn't happy in Cleveland.

Despite not having formal permission, Griffin met with an intermediary of the Magic to discuss the job when the Cavs were off preparing for the Eastern Conference finals, sources said. The talks did not progress and the Magic moved on, hiring Jeff Weltman away from the Toronto Raptors and giving him the exact type of job and long-term contract Griffin had sought in Cleveland.

The Atlanta Hawks also reached out to Griffin and asked Gilbert for permission when their GM job opened in May. Gilbert declined to give it. When the Milwaukee Bucks lost GM John Hammond and they opened their search, Griffin made it known through back channels he'd be interested in that job too if he couldn't get a deal in Cleveland.

All of the interest and talking irritated Gilbert, who wasn't pleased an employee had eyes elsewhere -- even if many people in the league probably would've done the same in Griffin's unsteady position.

What became apparent as the Magic, Hawks and Bucks filled their jobs, however, is that Griffin might have overplayed his hand. When the Cavs lost in the Finals, his only leverage was to threaten to walk away, which he was prepared to do.

It came to a head over the past weekend. Gilbert and Griffin had a long meeting last Friday and discussed the future. The conversation did not go well, sources said. Griffin wanted a large pay raise and an upgrade in power. Gilbert wanted better communication and more aggression from Griffin as the team licked its wounds after a 4-1 loss in the Finals.

On Monday, Gilbert came to the team's practice facility from his home in Detroit. It was the fourth time the owner and GM would meet to try to come to a resolution. There were times in his tenure when Griffin dealt more directly with Cavs minority owner Nate Forbes. After Forbes and Gilbert nearly had a falling out during the 2016-17 season, Griffin worked on strengthening communication with Gilbert directly. Yet Griffin never got the sense Gilbert truly knew the lengths he went to try to lift up all parts of the Cavs organization. At one point during negotiations during the 2017 playoffs, an exasperated Griffin implored Gilbert to talk to people in different departments for the Cavs to see what they had to say about Griffin, hoping a sea of voices could drown out any preconceived notions Gilbert had developed about his GM.

From his office during the day, Griffin burned up the phone lines as he attempted to engage teams in a blockbuster trade. He knew he was in the final days of his contract, but he wasn't acting like it, even though many trade calls had to start with questions about what was happening with his future.

He'd had discussions over the weekend with the Indiana Pacers about Paul George. But on this day, he was trying to find a way to trade for a lottery pick. He called several teams, including the Chicago Bulls, and told them he might be able to get his hands on a top-five pick if they'd be willing to do a deal for Jimmy Butler, sources said.

The Cavs were trying to work a three-team trade using Kevin Love and the No. 4 pick belonging to the Phoenix Suns, sources said. When the talks leaked in the media, some wondered if Griffin was attempting to create a buzz. Gilbert is often influenced by media reports and here his general manager was out trying to be aggressive as the owner indicated he wanted. Late into the afternoon, Griffin was still on the phone trying to put something together.

But finally, after a monthslong dance, the end of the road came. The deal Gilbert was willing to offer wasn't going to get it done. Griffin was not interested in agreeing to something he wasn't comfortable with. Just like that, it was over.
Gilbert didn't consult James on the decision. Despite assumptions to the contrary even within the NBA, James doesn't have much say in major franchise decisions. James did get a courtesy heads-up before an official announcement and the franchise player was upset, sources said.

James knew it was a possibility Griffin would leave but expected it would get worked out. He'd developed a trust with Griffin; never more so than with JR Smith, whom James advocated Griffin to trade for in 2015. Griffin didn't want to do it, afraid of Smith's reputation, but he trusted James. It ended up being a domino in the run to a title.

It was Griffin who had the guts to fire David Blatt a season earlier when the team was in first place and did his best to keep James out of it, despite what many assumed. It helped set the stage for a run to a championship.

It was Griffin who worked with James to keep a positive attitude when the Cavs fell down 3-1 in the Finals in 2016, their uplifting messages helping spur the team toward a historic comeback. James pressed Griffin hard, demanding upgrades to the roster at every turn, and Griffin almost always delivered. And he did it in the face of James sometimes publicly questioning the direction of the franchise, as he did after a road loss to New Orleans in January. James' comments to the media not only put the Cavs' business out there for 29 other league executives to see, but it also could be seen as a dig at his teammates as James described Cleveland as having a "top-heavy" roster.

Griffin met with James one-on-one about it shortly thereafter, having a very direct and open conversation about his plans and why James wasn't helping when he went to the media with that displeasure. It was the type of dialogue that takes trust on both sides to engage in. And it was precisely the type of dialogue that Gilbert -- for all of his apparent desire to dabble in GM duties even though he was the owner -- couldn't have with James because of the history between them dating to James' departure from the team in 2010.

In April, James knew exactly what he was doing when he went on the record in an interview with ESPN about Griffin's contract situation: "It makes no sense why he shouldn't get an extension. He's pulled every move -- he's tried to make every move happen -- to better this team to be able to compete for a championship. So we wouldn't be in this position, obviously, without him and without the guys that are here."

Several hours after the news broke, James, who is about to enter the final year of his contract, sent out a tweet in support of Griffin.

Lue was also in the dark, finding out after the fact. Also let go was Trent Redden, the popular VP of basketball operations who had been with the team for 11 years. He started out as an intern in 2006 and so impressed the staff that they started sending him out to scout college games within a few months. Redden was one of the longest-tenured employees in basketball operations -- there to see James lead the Cavs to the Finals in 2007, the team suffer through a 26-game losing streak, and to win the title.

Like Redden, Griffin cut his teeth as an intern with the Suns' public relations department in the early '90s. Some 25 years later he worked his way up to be the guy who helped put together the most successful team in Cleveland franchise history.

As the news was relayed to staff members at the Cavs facility in suburban Cleveland, many came into Griffin's and Redden's offices in tears. They knew it might happen for months but the shock stung just the same.

The championship euphoria that that gave everyone in the organization just a little extra sense of purpose was all but sapped. "It speaks to the uncertainty of the business of basketball," a Cavs player told ESPN. "That's the business. That's the business at its core."
 
Griffin balanced it all the past couple of seasons while dealing with his third bout of cancer since first being diagnosed in 2006. There were long treatment sessions. His signature red hair all but disappeared. Griffin hardly ever let on publicly, offering only a few clues along the way, such as the lapel pin he wore to his news conference after the dismissal of David Blatt, meant to show solidarity to others with the disease.

I think this has a big part of him and Gilbert not coming to a common ground in terms of salary and power he had. It's got to be worth his time and effort because he know it might be more limited than a normal person. Even though Gilbert didn't give him permission he still did talk to other organizations through back channels, it didn't seem to progress to a job that made sense for him.

I could see him going to an organization as a special consultant making $1 million and working a quarter of the time.
 
Anyone else feel like this is the basketball equivalent to an Adele song?

If you're not the one for me
Then I'll come back and bring you to your knees
If you're not the one for me
Why do I hate the idea of being free?
eb66efafa42aa4a971b1558451ff1791

And if I'm not the one for you
You've gotta stop holding me the way you do
Oh when you found that the one for you
Why have we been through what we have been through
David-Griffin.jpg

If you're gonna let me down, let me down gently
Don't pretend that you don't want me
Our love ain't water under the bridge
DSC_0406_1453527335429_86752_ver1.0.JPG
 
Griff unofficial backchannel talks:

"The talks did not progress and the Magic moved on, hiring Jeff Weltman away from the Toronto Raptors and giving him the exact type of job and long-term contract Griffin had sought in Cleveland"

Griffin wanted $$$ (10m is my guess) and control.

LeBron and Gilbert still not over the letter and unable to have 1 on 1 meeting was an interesting tidbit. Bron mentioned something about that on his Uninterrupted Barber Shop piece with Draymond Green.
 
10 mil for a president and GM?


Yeeeeah, I'm thinking Gilbert is probably not crazy for saying bye-bye.
 
10 mil for a president and GM?

Yeeeeah, I'm thinking Gilbert is probably not crazy for saying bye-bye.

Mediocre coaches like Lue make $7 million.

Then look at good execs...

Pat Riley - $11 mllion
RC Buford - $10 million
Bob Meyers - $8 million
Neil Olshey - $7 million

I'm not saying you for sure do it but executive salaries are ballooning in the NBA.

Most winning organizations have $10 mil tied up in their president and GM roles (whether it goes to 1 guy or 2).

Again, I don't put Griff at that Riley, Buford, Meyers level but a competent GM is going to make a lot of money.
 
Be funny Griff getting his money and title in Phoenix next year after facilitating Love-to-Suns in a Butler/Cavs deal.

Be like the end of Any Given Sunday.
 
Mediocre coaches like Lue make $7 million.

Then look at good execs...

Pat Riley - $11 mllion
RC Buford - $10 million
Bob Meyers - $8 million
Neil Olshey - $7 million

I'm not saying you for sure do it but executive salaries are ballooning in the NBA.

Most winning organizations have $10 mil tied up in their president and GM roles (whether it goes to 1 guy or 2).

Again, I don't put Griff at that Riley, Buford, Meyers level but a competent GM is going to make a lot of money.
All those guys are objectively overpaid for what they actually do.
 

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