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Out of the Rafters at the Q

Out of the Rafters
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Why are people so fucking focused on what might happen multiple years down the road?

People were bitching that Lindor would be traded when he had over three years of control left on his deal. Jose is under team control through 2023.

Bieber is only under team control through 2024. Let's start bitching about him too.

@macbdog whenever the next young stud comes up to the bigs, make sure you're in there to bitch about the fact that he might not be in Cleveland 7 years from now.

Things change. Nothing lasts forever. Learn to enjoy what's in front of you. We have a good organization who has consistently maximized the value of its assets and been in contention for championships. That's rare. If you're not having fun, I don't know what else to tell you. If we signed Lindor to the deal he just got from New York, I guarantee you that wouldn't cause you to start enjoying it either.

Might as well just stop bitching about the team and start bitching about the fact that, at some point in the future, you won't be alive to follow them anymore. Might as well start being miserable over that fact now.

And no, the takeaway from this post isn't that you can't be a fan if you're not having fun. The takeaway from this post is that you need to have some perspective.
 
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Derek

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Why are people so fucking focused on what might happen multiple years down the road?

People were bitching that Lindor would be traded when he had over three years of control left on his deal. Jose is under team control through 2023.

Bieber is only under team control through 2024. Let's start bitching about him too.

@macbdog whenever the next young stud comes up to the bigs, make sure you're in there to bitch about the fact that he might not be an Indians 7 years from now.

Things change. Nothing lasts forever. Learn to enjoy what's in front of you. We have a good organization who has consistently maximized the value of its assets and been in contention for championships. That's rare. If you're not having fun, I don't know what else to tell you. If we signed Lindor to the deal he just got from New York, I guarantee you that wouldn't cause you to start enjoying it either.

Might as well just stop bitching about the team and start bitching about the fact that, at some point in the future, you won't be alive to follow them anymore. Might as well start being miserable over that fact now.
Get your head out of your ass.

Let's trade Jose for some young players, who we will then need to turn around and trade in 2023 for more young players.
 

LL3

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Get your head out of your ass.

Let's trade Jose for some young players, who we will then need to turn around and trade in 2023 for more young players.
Get on that cycle and ride, ride, ride...this is the way!
 

macbdog

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Meh.

The team is going to follow their established track record of dealing young players who don't sign ridiculously team favored extensions. Maybe Jose bends the knee again and signs; I'm banking he is smarter than that, bets on himself and goes to FA to make the money he has sacrificed the last 3 years. And whether folks want to admit it or not, Jose is gone in the off-season if he doesn't sign one. They won't ride it out to FA and lose him for nothing.
 

CDAV45

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Why are people so fucking focused on what might happen multiple years down the road?
Have you ever listened to CA speak? Everything is done with focus for the current and future health of the organization. It's been the mantra long enough to become the culture. Thing is, I see it as a positive rather than the opposite, and I firmly believe it is exactly how and why this team is even remotely competitive on a consistent basis.
 

Out of the Rafters at the Q

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Have you ever listened to CA speak? Everything is done with focus for the current and future health of the organization. It's been the mantra long enough to become the culture. Thing is, I see it as a positive rather than the opposite, and I firmly believe it is exactly how and why this team is even remotely competitive on a consistent basis.
Obviously organizations should plan for continued success.

That is not the point of my retort.

If the choice is between letting a player walk for nothing, or trading them to get assets to continue our success, the obvious choice is obvious.

It's worked for us at every single turn so far. Why would we stop now?

Why is the fact that a player can't play for this team forever the primary focus of some people's ire?

I can only imagine how upset these people will be when they realize that, at some point, players get old and retire!
 

Lee

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Here is a fun question. Lets say we have a new owner. We are still a midmarket team, so the 200 mill payroll is still too high, but we are allowed lets say 130 million. Which trades do you still do from the last 4 years, which dont you do?

For example considering Lindor just got almost 40 mill a year, do you still keep him, or do you think too much of an imbalance?
 

Out of the Rafters at the Q

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Here is a fun question. Lets say we have a new owner. We are still a midmarket team, so the 200 mill payroll is still too high, but we are allowed lets say 130 million. Which trades do you still do from the last 4 years, which dont you do?

For example considering Lindor just got almost 40 mill a year, do you still keep him, or do you think too much of an imbalance?
You mean like we just did in 2018-2019, where our average payroll was over 130 million?

I've asked this question multiple times. Nobody has a specific example.

From their own mouths, the organization has basically done everything it can, and hasn't made a bad move. They still don't like it. It's somehow flawless and awful at the same time.

I'm beginning to believe they don't have a genuine critique. They just like to be curmudgeons.
 

Cassity14

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You mean like we just did in 2018-2019, where our average payroll was over 130 million?

I've asked this question multiple times. Nobody has a specific example.

From their own mouths, the organization has basically done everything it can, and hasn't made a bad move. They still don't like it. It's somehow flawless and awful at the same time.

I'm beginning to believe they don't have a genuine critique. They just like to be curmudgeons.

I think overall disdain for the lack of any sort of salary cap in baseball bleads into hating the Indians for not being one of the teams possessing the cheat code that is a 200+ million dollar payroll.
 

Criznit

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In other news.. Here is a story about a Cleveland Indians minor league depth catcher from the 80's

 

Lee

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You mean like we just did in 2018-2019, where our average payroll was over 130 million?

I've asked this question multiple times. Nobody has a specific example.

From their own mouths, the organization has basically done everything it can, and hasn't made a bad move. They still don't like it. It's somehow flawless and awful at the same time.

I'm beginning to believe they don't have a genuine critique. They just like to be curmudgeons.

Bauer and Kluber i do for sure, I am not sure i would have kept Lindor, but maybe, its a huge part of our payroll, but he is probably worth it.

Clevinger brought back allot and we have pitching, i am 50/50 on Clevinger.

If you are building a roster, you cant keep them all, and we need hitting, so i think i still do the pitching trades, keep Lindor, sign a Edwin level player on top of what we already did.
 

Derek

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Meh.

The team is going to follow their established track record of dealing young players who don't sign ridiculously team favored extensions. Maybe Jose bends the knee again and signs; I'm banking he is smarter than that, bets on himself and goes to FA to make the money he has sacrificed the last 3 years. And whether folks want to admit it or not, Jose is gone in the off-season if he doesn't sign one. They won't ride it out to FA and lose him for nothing.
He's still signed for two more seasons after this one! If you're thinking about trading guys with three seasons left on their highly affordable deal, then you might as well pack it in.

Say we get a high-level guy about ready to breakthrough in the majors. Dylan Carlson and Cristian Pache come to mind. They'll be in the same situation as Jose (if they even pan out) in 2024, which is just one year after Jose could hit the open market. Why make ourselves worse over the next three years just to have a guy like Pache or Carlson in 2024/25 before doing the exact same thing again?

He didn't sacrifice anything on his first extension. The Indians bet on a guy who had one good season and was never particularly high-regarded. They gave him long-term security and an appropriately-priced pre-arb extension. I think the odds of him signing an extension are quite good. The team can give him an extra 10-15 million over the next two years and gain a few more years of team control.
 

Derek

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Have you ever listened to CA speak? Everything is done with focus for the current and future health of the organization. It's been the mantra long enough to become the culture. Thing is, I see it as a positive rather than the opposite, and I firmly believe it is exactly how and why this team is even remotely competitive on a consistent basis.
He's not saying to make short-sighted moves. He's just saying that three years is a really long time, and there's no reason to keep kicking the ball down the road when there's a chance to win some games now without sacrificing our long-term outlook.

Correct me if I'm wrong @Out of the Rafters at the Q
 

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