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BMAN

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What are people's thoughts on The Bad Batch?
I haven’t watched yet, honestly forgot that was running. They were my least favorite thing about the last season of the Clone Wars. Would you recommend?
 

SalvadoranCavsfan

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Bad Batch is fine. The most interesting parts are seeing how the early Empire is establishing itself but we definitely need more of that. I don't hate any of the characters which is nice.

Beyond that it's not the worst way to spend 20 minutes.
 

Sebastian

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Bad Batch is fine. The most interesting parts are seeing how the early Empire is establishing itself but we definitely need more of that. I don't hate any of the characters which is nice.

Beyond that it's not the worst way to spend 20 minutes.
This is what I really like.

As a government/history nerd I love seeing policy formation and how things are taking shape. And how the Empire is not a monolithically evil organization. Some people are working off best intentions and are being manipulated.

I love that we finally, FINALLY see how and why the Empire went away from Clones to first a mixed force, Clones and volunteers, to what will undoubtedly become conscription.

And I am so glad Feloni is doing it the right way with logical reasoning instead of some stupid Disney reason.

He has Tarkin clearly weighing cost vs. effectiveness. How much more does a Clone bring as compared to the volunteer?

Is the Clone at twice the cost of the volunteer twice as effective?
 

Jack Brickman

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This is what I really like.

As a government/history nerd I love seeing policy formation and how things are taking shape. And how the Empire is not a monolithically evil organization. Some people are working off best intentions and are being manipulated.

I love that we finally, FINALLY see how and why the Empire went away from Clones to first a mixed force, Clones and volunteers, to what will undoubtedly become conscription.

And I am so glad Feloni is doing it the right way with logical reasoning instead of some stupid Disney reason.

He has Tarkin clearly weighing cost vs. effectiveness. How much more does a Clone bring as compared to the volunteer?

Is the Clone at twice the cost of the volunteer twice as effective?

I, too, originally got into Star Wars to learn the business practices of the Empire. :chuckle:
 
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Sebastian

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The Bad Batch is really showing us the enormity of Order 66.

It not only eliminated the Jedi, but it pretty much turned all the Clones into Imperial puppets with no sapience.

Now we know how the Clones went from good guys to the unquestioning henchmen of the Empire.
 
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Sebastian

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Bad Batch continues to impress.

Interesting episode on how the Empire is treating systems that were formerly part of the CIS.

The early Rebellion had many former elements of the CIS in it.
 

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Wow, those last two episodes of the Bat Batch were quite good.

We quickly see there is no slow transition for the Empire turning evil.

Straight up destroying whole cities without a second thought.

The Kaminoians were playing a double game and got burnt. Prime Minister murdered, all scientists kidnapped, Tipocca City stripped of all useful material and destroyed.

It actually begs the question of why the Rebellion took so long to grow into an actual threat. From the start the Empire behaved in a manner that made it clear there was no choice but to resist.

I just wish they took some time to explore the motivations of the Imperial Officers. You can't go from being a force for good, and stability to genocidal over night. Many officers would have a serious issue with the overnight change in tactics to sheer brutality. Soldiers, and especially officers, are not trained to indiscriminately kill. By and large we saw Republic officers behaving ethically for most of the Clone Wars, and with a serious devotion to protecting life. You don't go from Tom Hanks in Private Ryan to Heinrich Himmler without some serious intervening happenings.
 

SalvadoranCavsfan

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Wow, those last two episodes of the Bat Batch were quite good.

We quickly see there is no slow transition for the Empire turning evil.

Straight up destroying whole cities without a second thought.

The Kaminoians were playing a double game and got burnt. Prime Minister murdered, all scientists kidnapped, Tipocca City stripped of all useful material and destroyed.

It actually begs the question of why the Rebellion took so long to grow into an actual threat. From the start the Empire behaved in a manner that made it clear there was no choice but to resist.

I just wish they took some time to explore the motivations of the Imperial Officers. You can't go from being a force for good, and stability to genocidal over night. Many officers would have a serious issue with the overnight change in tactics to sheer brutality. Soldiers, and especially officers, are not trained to indiscriminately kill. By and large we saw Republic officers behaving ethically for most of the Clone Wars, and with a serious devotion to protecting life. You don't go from Tom Hanks in Private Ryan to Heinrich Himmler without some serious intervening happenings.

I could be wrong but I was sensing some reservations from the main officer that gave the order to destroy the city after Tarkin gave the thumbs up. He did not seem to be eager at least.
 

Sebastian

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I could be wrong but I was sensing some reservations from the main officer that gave the order to destroy the city after Tarkin gave the thumbs up. He did not seem to be eager at least.
I did not get that impression. Rampart has been the one pushing for getting rid of the clones and Kamino because the conscription program is his.
 

SalvadoranCavsfan

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I did not get that impression. Rampart has been the one pushing for getting rid of the clones and Kamino because the conscription program is his.

I absolutely agree that he wanted to stop using clones and this project is his baby. Still, even watching it now he just seems subdued giving the order and watching through the window. I could be wrong.

 

Sebastian

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I absolutely agree that he wanted to stop using clones and this project is his baby. Still, even watching it now he just seems subdued giving the order and watching through the window. I could be wrong.

He's just not a cackling bad guy. He quietly but firmly gives the command and then observes the barrage.

He is much like Tarkin in that he can give awful orders while being calm and collected. It is the banality of evil that authoritarian systems create.

From a narrative point of view it highlights that the decisions being made are bureaucratic. The Empire is divesting itself of clones for partially financial reasons. Rampart is as much bureaucrat as he is military. Studied indifference is the trait of the bureaucrat. Impersonal and without emotion. Most military men are ruled by a code of honor, loyalty above all else. The Jedi and Clones personify honor and loyalty. To one another and to the cause. They disobey orders to leave no man behind. To do the right thing. But Rampart isn't like the military men of the Republic. He is a new breed taking their place.

That he can give such an order with no emotion demonstrates that the system is paramount, it is above human feeling and the individual is unimportant. To him destroying the city and killing that team is no different than giving the order to purchase 1000 new pairs of boots.

It is also emblematic of the Empire as a whole. Individuals, whole populations and even planets are not important. Emotions, feelings, are all irrelevant to the supremacy of the State and the will of the Emperor.

Or he's really just a cool customer. I used to give commands to fire when a tank commander not unlike what he did.

A firm "fire on my command... fire" will do. No shouting, no emphasis. Just a routine command.
 

LL3

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He's just not a cackling bad guy. He quietly but firmly gives the command and then observes the barrage.

He is much like Tarkin in that he can give awful orders while being calm and collected. It is the banality of evil that authoritarian systems create.

From a narrative point of view it highlights that the decisions being made are bureaucratic. The Empire is divesting itself of clones for partially financial reasons. Rampart is as much bureaucrat as he is military. Studied indifference is the trait of the bureaucrat. Impersonal and without emotion. Most military men are ruled by a code of honor, loyalty above all else. The Jedi and Clones personify honor and loyalty. To one another and to the cause. They disobey orders to leave no man behind. To do the right thing. But Rampart isn't like the military men of the Republic. He is a new breed taking their place.

That he can give such an order with no emotion demonstrates that the system is paramount, it is above human feeling and the individual is unimportant. To him destroying the city and killing that team is no different than giving the order to purchase 1000 new pairs of boots.

It is also emblematic of the Empire as a whole. Individuals, whole populations and even planets are not important. Emotions, feelings, are all irrelevant to the supremacy of the State and the will of the Emperor.

Or he's really just a cool customer. I used to give commands to fire when a tank commander not unlike what he did.

A firm "fire on my command... fire" will do. No shouting, no emphasis. Just a routine command.
Calm, cool, indifference was my take, too...on to the next task.
 

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