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Trump Impeachment Inquiry

Should President Trump Be Impeached?

  • Yes

    Votes: 44 68.8%
  • No

    Votes: 5 7.8%
  • Undecided and awaiting evidence before making a decision

    Votes: 4 6.3%
  • Hillary Did it

    Votes: 9 14.1%
  • It Should be Left to the Election

    Votes: 1 1.6%
  • Get over it!

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Rudy Giuliani Did it

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    64

bob2the2nd

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Nancy Pelosi just announced that the House is establishing an Impeachment Inquiry into President Trump.

At the same time Mitch McConnell is fast tracking a request of release for the whistleblower report

May god save us all
 

bob2the2nd

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Also for those of you curious here is a breakdown of what an impeach inquiry means.

This is basically just a formal way of announcing that the president its formally under investigation. If through this investigation it is determined by House that the president broke certian laws worthy of removal of office "treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors." They can draw up articles of impeachment against the president. This can be as many reasons that the house deems worthy of being removed from office.

Once it would be determined that an article of impeachment is being brought forward the house will vote on each article. For President Clinton 4 articles of impeachment were tried in the house, with 2 passing. Once the articles of impeachment are formally voted on, any article passing the house with a simple majority is passed to the Senate.

I also want to point out that just because the president is under inquiry it does not mean that he is being impeached, or tried, or there are even any formal reasons to remove. This is strictly jsut a fact finding phase.


If you want an equivalent, this is a trial*. The Cheif of the Supreme Court (Justice Roberts) would preside over the hearings within the Senate. Here is where all facts and cases are made and ultimately the Senate would vote whether or not to convict and remove the president. In order to convict and remove the president 2/3rds of the Senate would have to vote to convict. Currently there are 47 democratic senators in the Senate, meaning at least 20 republican senators would have to switch sides in order to convict (this is the ultimate road block to the removal of Trump from being president). Unless something absolutely and incredibly damning comes out it is highly unlikely the that 20 GOP senators would switch sides.

If Trump were impeached the next person in line for the presidency is Mike Pence. If for some reason Pence either was also impeached, resigned or other. The next person in line for president would be Nancy Pelosi.

*there is argument whether or not Mitch McConnel who leads the senate can block or delay the formation of the trial if he so wanted. I am not a legal scholar so i wont get into it.
 
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cavsfan1985

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And here we go.

This is going to be very interesting on how all of this plays out. I had always thought the plan was to wait as long as possible for this, because then if it worked it would be hard for Republicans to recover for the election. If this flames out, and the economy turns to the good next year, Trump is going to win again. I am not sure if I get the timing of this. They better hope there is something in the Ukrainian phone call.
 

Lord Mar

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And here we go.

This is going to be very interesting on how all of this plays out. I had always thought the plan was to wait as long as possible for this, because then if it worked it would be hard for Republicans to recover for the election. If this flames out, and the economy turns to the good next year, Trump is going to win again. I am not sure if I get the timing of this. They better hope there is something in the Ukrainian phone call.
 

bob2the2nd

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And here we go.

This is going to be very interesting on how all of this plays out. I had always thought the plan was to wait as long as possible for this, because then if it worked it would be hard for Republicans to recover for the election. If this flames out, and the economy turns to the good next year, Trump is going to win again. I am not sure if I get the timing of this. They better hope there is something in the Ukrainian phone call.
Not to the point of the thread, but the economy is still going. It might be as strong as it was, but if it "turns" its because it turned south.

That said if it comes out the president offered the Ukrainian president his foreign aid back if he investigated Joe Biden, and it was said in those terms thats Bribery (among other things), and one of the things the constitution explicitly calls out as far things the president can be impeached for.

At this point in time, the only thing i can see helping the president is if it actually turns out this whistle blower thing is in fact completely and totally made up/false. At which point the democrats are stuck with a decision if they want to continue to go after Trump. If they dont ever vote on articles of impeachment they are going to not only give Trump to crow over, but democratic supporters are going to be upset with their representatives (and thus possibly drivign them away from the polls). But if it comes out there is an actual crime Trump committed and the house votes for Articles of Impeachment, i just dont see how that helps trump, even if the senate votes to keep him.
 

cavsfan1985

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Not to the point of the thread, but the economy is still going. It might be as strong as it was, but if it "turns" its because it turned south.

That said if it comes out the president offered the Ukrainian president his foreign aid back if he investigated Joe Biden, and it was said in those terms thats Bribery (among other things), and one of the things the constitution explicitly calls out as far things the president can be impeached for.
I think it is. I personally think this is politically motivated. If the Democrats really thought they could beat Trump in 14 months they would not be worrying about this. I think part of the reason they want to start now, is that the economy is not going south, like the Dems had hoped, so are looking for anything to try and stop Trump.

At the end of the day, if they find credible evidence against Trump he deserves to be kicked out. But I think this is 100% political and hope the more shit they throw against the wall something will stick.
 

bob2the2nd

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. If this flames out, and the economy turns to the good next year,
I think it is. I personally think this is politically motivated. I think part of the reason they want to start now, is that the economy is not going south, like the Dems had hoped,
So is the economy going south or not?

This is somewhat confusing to me over 20 minutes you've claimed that if the economy turns around for the good that'll help Trump but at the same time the economy hasn't turned bad.
 

cavsfan1985

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So is the economy going south or not?

This is somewhat confusing to me over 20 minutes you've claimed that if the economy turns around for the good that'll help Trump but at the same time the economy hasn't turned bad.
I think the economy is just humming around. Right now it is steady. If it holds I think there is a slight advantage to Trump. But if it gets better, such as the Fed dropping rates, China trade wars ends, I think it is a huge headwind. If we do fall into a down turn, it would be a huge negative.

Does that help?
 

-Akronite-

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And here we go.

This is going to be very interesting on how all of this plays out. I had always thought the plan was to wait as long as possible for this, because then if it worked it would be hard for Republicans to recover for the election. If this flames out, and the economy turns to the good next year, Trump is going to win again. I am not sure if I get the timing of this. They better hope there is something in the Ukrainian phone call.
That is how Trump wants this framed, but that's not the situation. The phone call is not the center of controversy, it's more important to focus on the entire whistleblower complaint. Up to this point the White House has been involved in covering up both. The call may or may not be damning, which is precisely why Trump is claiming he'll release it now. Send that out, control the narrative, pretend there's no controversy. But the whisteblower was about multiple incidents, not just this phone call.

The violation is clear, Trump used the office of the presidency to pressure a foreign government to investigate a political rival for his own gain. There is a possibility that there was a quid pro quo wrt military aid, but that does not need to be established, let alone explicitly. It would, however, be extra damning and perhaps even flip the Senate if proven. We already know he made the decision to withhold it days before a call that likely included pressure on the Biden situation. It's not hard to read between the lines there. Trump's excuse about the EU not paying in (even though they pay more than the US) is clearly bullshit.

We already know from both Giuliani and Trump that he brought up Biden, it's a matter of confirming that outside of the words of the babbling liars who change their story every time they open their mouths.

As for the timing, impeachment doesn't end quickly and this is just the start of a formal inquiry. I wouldn't be surprised if they brought forth articles that didn't rely on the Ukrainian call as well, as Trump has violated his constitutional duty pretty consistently for 3 years. Conviction in the Senate is unlikely, but I doubt Pelosi would go through with this if she didn't think impeachment would ultimately pass in the house. We will see though.
 

King Stannis

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Russia didn't work so the Dems moved to the next country over.
At what point do we hold the guy accountable?

We all know he sought and received Russian help.

And now he openly admits he is using the Office to blackmail the Ukrainians into making up crap against a political opponent during an election year.

Completely unprecedented. This is the exact scenario that the Founders envisioned: A POTUS abusing his power in a flagrant manner.

If the evidence is clear, and the GOP doesn't act, it is time we reconsider the nature of this Republic.
 

Huber.

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At what point do we hold the guy accountable?

We all know he sought and received Russian help.

And now he openly admits he is using the Office to blackmail the Ukrainians into making up crap against a political opponent during an election year.

Completely unprecedented. This is the exact scenario that the Founders envisioned: A POTUS abusing his power in a flagrant manner.

If the evidence is clear, and the GOP doesn't act, it is time we reconsider the nature of this Republic.
Biden admitted to this

“I said: ‘We’re leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor’s not fired, you’re not getting the money. Well, son of a bitch, he got fired.”
 

Lord Mar

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At what point do we hold the guy accountable?

We all know he sought and received Russian help.

And now he openly admits he is using the Office to blackmail the Ukrainians into making up crap against a political opponent during an election year.

Completely unprecedented. This is the exact scenario that the Founders envisioned: A POTUS abusing his power in a flagrant manner.

If the evidence is clear, and the GOP doesn't act, it is time we reconsider the nature of this Republic.
The real question is.....just who is Trump abusing?
 

CleveRocks

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The Dems just could not keep thier finger off that button.. it's a text book way to lose the election..Joe Biden will be smeared, and that leaves Warren. Warren proposes to tax the shit out of the rich and corporations.. That is the best case scenario for Trump..

There is nothing clear about the whistleblower report until it is released without redaction.. plus you have the Fisa thing.

As for the economy, we have had some panic mongering around the short term interest rates, and liquidity. Lots of economists predicting a recession in 2020.. What is different is that we have full employment. The economy would have to go pretty far south to fuck that up. A deal with China would hurt that.. So we shall see..
 

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