Which player are you most excited about? Which will have the largest impact on winning?

[weepinwillow]

I get the optimism about Garland but I hate the scratch off take. Both of them are just as highly recruited and both have a higher ceiling esp Kuminga than Garland has. The OG thing I hope is a joke smh no mid range game not a playmaker not a leader ok shooter already overpaid. C'mon man

best 3 and D SF in the game right now with top-shelf athletic ability, the ability to finish, attack close outs, a strong hoops IQ, underpaid, under contract and only 24.

 

[Ozone]

best 3 and D SF in the game right now with top-shelf athletic ability, the ability to finish, attack close outs, a strong hoops IQ, underpaid, under contract and only 24.

Not really . 97% if his 3's are assisted . He has no creation ability off the bounce, no handles just straight line attacking. I think his game is vastly overrated at this point because he also plays defense. Okoro is basically on track to being OG anyway but Okoro has more on ball athleticism.
I think Mikal and others similar to him as good as they are to have as a weapon are also overrated as a result of their 3 point %. Even if most categorize OG as a top 5-10 3/d nba player it is just more reinforcement as to how difficult it is to get high upside SF's that does more than shoot assisted corner 3's and play defense.
Somebody like Moody as a rookie can have the same impact on lesser usage as a catch and shoot defender and if given as many reps as OG but that never happens for rookies on most teams even though it would here. Kuminga is a far better playmaker and creator than OG even if his shot green light needs to be more yellow and needs repair he is on the same tier as an athlete as far as explosive leaping and tbh is much smoother and quicker on top of it with OG's injuries starting to slow him some.

 

[weepinwillow]

Good break down here. I love Bridges, but OG is a better athlete, Mikal is longer (should have been the '18 pick).

OG: Best 3/D in the game.

Kuminga and Moody are 2-3 seasons away if ever. Garland and OG are here today. I'm done with young guys, we have enough. If you want to see the Cavs win, you want NBA veteran players. If I were Altman, I'm not dealing Garland unless I'm getting someone who can contribute this year. Chasing the "potential dragon" is for lottery teams and losers.

 

[ryanf]

Good break down here. I love Bridges, but OG is a better athlete, Mikal is longer (should have been the '18 pick).

OG: Best 3/D in the game.

Kuminga and Moody are 2-3 seasons away if ever. Garland and OG are here today. I'm done with young guys, we have enough. If you want to see the Cavs win, you want NBA veteran players. If I were Altman, I'm not dealing Garland unless I'm getting someone who can contribute this year. Chasing the "potential dragon" is for lottery teams and losers.

i find it funny that you make this statement... You should always be careful moving a guy who has that much talent, and if you do, make sure you get a player who you know can actually play, not more scratch tickets you sold yourself on after watching youtube-hype videos all offseason.

and then post a youtube-hype video yourself a few posts after.

 

[weepinwillow]

i find it funny that you make this statement... You should always be careful moving a guy who has that much talent, and if you do, make sure you get a player who you know can actually play, not more scratch tickets you sold yourself on after watching youtube-hype videos all offseason.

and then post a youtube-hype video yourself a few posts after.

eh.. we all use whatever to make a point. But true enough.
My point is if you are going to move Garland (who possesses very unique top NBA level skill sets), move him for a proven top level NBA player (I'm defining that as starting-level who does at least 2-3 things very well), which OG already is. I think he'd be a phenomenal fit between Okoro and Mobely because he can hit the 3 at a great rate, finish at the rim and defend 2-4 at a high level (he's + in all these skill sets).
Gambling Garland's talents on "potential" is a stupid move, as Garland has both talent and potential.

 

[Ozone]

eh.. we all use whatever to make a point. But true enough.
My point is if you are going to move Garland (who possesses very unique top NBA level skill sets), move him for a proven top level NBA player (I'm defining that as starting-level who does at least 2-3 things very well), which OG already is. I think he'd be a phenomenal fit between Okoro and Mobely because he can hit the 3 at a great rate, finish at the rim and defend 2-4 at a high level (he's + in all these skill sets).
Gambling Garland's talents on "potential" is a stupid move, as Garland has both talent and potential.

The problem with your thinking is that Garland's potential is the only reason not to trade him. His talents as you call them are a dime a dozen guard skill that any number of g-leaguers can replace in a second. The thing that separates him is handles and not much else. Trading him for Kuminga & Moody would in fact require the Cavs to add value not the other way around. You are acting as if Garland is already proven , but he is not more proven than these rookies besides proving he is a smart egg that can dish some to easy targets on a losing team.

 

[weepinwillow]

The problem with your thinking is that Garland's potential is the only reason not to trade him. His talents as you call them are a dime a dozen guard skill that any number of g-leaguers can replace in a second. The thing that separates him is handles and not much else. Trading him for Kuminga & Moody would in fact require the Cavs to add value not the other way around. You are acting as if Garland is already proven , but he is not more proven than these rookies besides proving he is a smart egg that can dish some to easy targets on a losing team.

Ooof.
Just an awful, awful take. Like, burn your account awful. It's hard to keep reading it, someone should report it for vulgarity.
There was a mountain of difference between Darius Garland and Jeramiah Martin, Yogi Farrell and Brodric Thomas last year (three G-League G's who couldn't replicate Darius' skill set if given a career's worth of playing time, much less a second).
And I think Garland has proven skills/talent and still has potential to be even better than a 19 pts/6 ast guy with .451/.395/.875 shooting splits. I don't think he's untradable, but the asking price needs to be higher than prospects.

 

[Ozone]

Ooof.
Just an awful, awful take. Like, burn your account awful. It's hard to keep reading it, someone should report it for vulgarity.
There was a mountain of difference between Darius Garland and Jeramiah Martin, Yogi Farrell and Brodric Thomas last year (three G-League G's who couldn't replicate Darius' skill set if given a career's worth of playing time, much less a second).
And I think Garland has proven skills/talent and still has potential to be even better than a 19 pts/6 ast guy with .451/.395/.875 shooting splits. I don't think he's untradable, but the asking price needs to be higher than prospects.

You obviously never play or have ever played the game against anyone good if you really believe that . Hey whatever makes you sleep well at night when they overpay him after another " acceptable" season despite his rookie one being on par with the G-league bench mob

 

[Lee]

You obviously never play or have ever played the game against anyone good if you really believe that . Hey whatever makes you sleep well at night when they overpay him after another " acceptable" season despite his rookie one being on par with the G-league bench mob

Are you saying he isnt good because he had a bad rookie season? How about 3.3 pounts and 2 assists on 43% shooing in 10.5 minutes a game...yeah that guy never got better either, in fact that guy never averaged more than 9 points a game or 5 assists until his 5th season despite playing 4 years in college.....ps he won 2 mvp's and not in the g-league.

 

[CavsKermit]

Good break down here. I love Bridges, but OG is a better athlete, Mikal is longer (should have been the '18 pick).

OG: Best 3/D in the game.

Kuminga and Moody are 2-3 seasons away if ever. Garland and OG are here today. I'm done with young guys, we have enough. If you want to see the Cavs win, you want NBA veteran players. If I were Altman, I'm not dealing Garland unless I'm getting someone who can contribute this year. Chasing the "potential dragon" is for lottery teams and losers.

I really like both OG and Bridges but neither one is going to be made available for a trade. It's simply too difficult to obtain those players. Once you have them, you're not voluntarily parting with them.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

It's Derios Gurlend for me.

 

[CavsKermit]

I get the optimism about Garland but I hate the scratch off take. Both of them are just as highly recruited and both have a higher ceiling esp Kuminga than Garland has. The OG thing I hope is a joke smh no mid range game not a playmaker not a leader ok shooter already overpaid. C'mon man

After watching last season's spacing, this obsession with trading for non-shooters is borderline crazy. It really is. You're not going to remake the league. Teams will scout you and make a point to get back in transition. You have to be able to run a half court offense that isn't premised on driving into a crowded paint 80% of the time.

 

[Ozone]

Are you saying he isnt good because he had a bad rookie season? How about 3.3 pounts and 2 assists on 43% shooing in 10.5 minutes a game...yeah that guy never got better either, in fact that guy never averaged more than 9 points a game or 5 assists until his 5th season despite playing 4 years in college.....ps he won 2 mvp's and not in the g-league.

You can see what I wrote smh
He is getting better so there is plenty of optimism about him around here as there should be. However it seems pretty obvious some of it is overreaction based on his improvements after arguably being the worst starter in the NBA as a rookie.
I don't hate the idea of keeping him and see if he takes that jump. The problem for me with that is if an opportunity presents itself to get a high floor and upside SF before that Garland jump does or doesn't happen has to be considered an option. After he gets paid next summer, which will happen if he is in CLE and esp if Sexton gets paid soon which looks probable based on the media day GM comments etc. Then Garland has to become so much more than he is right now, he has to be the guy who does what he says he is working on, shooting more off the dribble instead of always looking to pass etc.
He does that this season and the Cavs will get a ton of offers for him, but at that point they wouldn't trade him.
I just think it is a risk to trade him and have him break out elsewhere, but to act like it is a given that will happen for a passive 6' guard who has to be motivated to be more confident by others instead of a drive from within like his backcourt buddy has, makes the option of moving him now, if the offer is legit well worth it.
I would rather trade him for Barnes or the GSW pair than see if his improvements are break out level, because imo they will be subtle improvements at best in year 3. Now maybe in year 4 or 5 he becomes an all star. Some act like he is destined for it without question which I just can't get my head around at all.
He makes good decisions has elite handles and can shoot in space. good for him, but its not something anyone around him is willing to avow as being all star level stuff, that's all outside noise imo What the Cavs did yesterday was make it clear Darius understands he needs to be a leader he needs to put in a lot of work to be great and has been there all summer to back that up. Those are not affirmations he is there as a player , they are confirmations he is interested in in becoming better on and off the court.

 

[Ozone]

After watching last season's spacing, this obsession with trading for non-shooters is borderline crazy. It really is. You're not going to remake the league. Teams will scout you and make a point to get back in transition. You have to be able to run a half court offense that isn't premised on driving into a crowded paint 80% of the time.

Rubio and Pangos are more than capable of doing what Garland already does. His potential is his ticket to staying here
and Barnes/Kuminga types do not grow on trees like 6' guards do

 

[CavsKermit]

Rubio and Pangos are more than capable of doing what Garland already does. His potential is his ticket to staying here
and Barnes/Kuminga types do not grow on trees like 6' guards do

Ah yes, let's start Rubio, Sexton, Barnes, Mobley, and Allen. We'll be legends when it comes to the worst spacing lineups in the history of the NBA.