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Isaac 3 & D Okoro - A Two Way Playing Basketball Savant

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Who is Isaac Okoro's Favorite Eastern Roman (Byzantine) Emperor?

  • Arcadius (if one does not count Constantine as first)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Justinian the Great

    Votes: 9 15.8%

  • Zeno

    Votes: 2 3.5%

  • Heraclius

    Votes: 3 5.3%

  • Basil II, the Bulgar Slayer

    Votes: 6 10.5%

  • Nikephoros II Phokas, the Pale Death of the Saracens

    Votes: 7 12.3%

  • Alexios I Komnenos

    Votes: 4 7.0%

  • John II, the Beautiful Komnenos

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Constantine XI

    Votes: 4 7.0%

  • Jim I Chones, the Magnificent

    Votes: 26 45.6%
  • Total voters
    57
Cavatt said:
They aren't ignoring the position. It hasn't worked out, but it isn't the same as ignoring it.

They got Cedi the year Lebron left, drafted Sexton with the only pick they had left, Used 4 picks on a SG with length, Drafted another SF in the same draft, and then Drafted another wing who was sold as a SF, but might be a SG. They also got Prince in a trade. They felt getting Rubio was more valuable than Prince and I agree. He has 1/10 of Rubio's IQ.

I get your point KPJ is a SG, but if we had him and Windler healthy we wouldn't be having his convo.

It's bad luck, but there is a really low hit rate on Sf's. It's just the way it is. They used 7 draft picks in the last 3 years on wings in the draft and trades. 1 is broken, one was traded for nada, 1 was traded for Rubio, one is apparently a SG.

You are mad because you can't trade Collin for a starting level SF. Sorry none are available.
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Outside of Windler, they haven't drafted a wing. In no world was Porter ever a SF, and we got took on Okoro being billed as an SF. In 4 years they've drafted one guy 6'7-6'9.
The Human Q-Tip said:
The Raptors didn't draft any SF's in 2018, 2019, or 2020. They drafted OG at No. 23 in 2017, and then Barnes at No. 4 this year. They also drafted Delanto Banton at No. 46 this year, but we have no idea if he's any good. Until this year, we'd drafted as many SF's as Toronto has, and we could have had Barnes instead of Mobley if we'd wanted.
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They also drafted Bruno in 2014 and another wing that same year. Every couple years they've used a low pick on a raw wing and tried to develop them. We have done that absolutely zero times.

And God how I wish we could've grabbed Barnes too, but Mobley was the superior pick. I mean honestly zero reason we couldn't have got back in the first to grab Saddiq Bey last year.
 
Ozone said:
lol thats what you take away from him not initiating offense on the preseason with better playmakers like Rubio on the floor or better offensive newcomers gifted usage? He is fine and was never going to be more than a 3rd option scorer in his prime that he is nowhere near yet. The kid plays with relentless energy trying to do what this coaching staff needs him to do as bad as it makes him look he keeps doing it anyway.
I give him a 25% chance of not being the starter on this team most games and being a far better on ball initiator like he showed to close last season whenever he doesn't have better initiators playing with him. If he always does then he wont be anything more than work in progress slasher who needs to be a better shooter before this coach is giving him the green light to jack it up with far better options around him right now.
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I said in another post…..this kid never should have taken at #5. He is, at best, the 7th or 8th best player on this team. If he were on another team he would be 10th or 12th. This kid belongs in the league but he will never be anything more than a middle of the bench role player.
 
Man Called X said:
Outside of Windler, they haven't drafted a wing. In no world was Porter ever a SF, and we got took on Okoro being billed as an SF. In 4 years they've drafted one guy 6'7-6'9.
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I'm just saying that Toronto didn't either. OG in 2017, then nothing until this year.

Man Called X said:
They also drafted Bruno in 2014 and another wing that same year. Every couple years they've used a low pick on a raw wing and tried to develop them. We have done that absolutely zero times.

And God how I wish we could've grabbed Barnes too, but Mobley was the superior pick. I mean honestly zero reason we couldn't have got back in the first to grab Saddiq Bey last year.
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Well...I thought going back to 2014 was a bit far. I figure the last 5 draft was pretty fair. Anyway, I'm not saying that to be a dick -- I just think that the idea of drafting a project wing in the second round and actually having him become a plus starter is a real longshot, and not even Toronto has done it. I mean...Bruno isn't exactly going to solve any of our problems, and Toronto pretty much ditched him as a failed effort after his rookie deal.

My guess is that at some point, we're going to be dumping one or more of Sexton, Garland, and Okoro, and that our sole focus in the 2022 is going to be the best wing on the board. If it's not, I'll grab my pitchfork and join in the hunt for Koby.

I think the hard truth is that if we want a reasonable shot at getting the kind of starting quality wing we want, it's going to be either 1) using our best first round pick, 2) trading a bunch of assets, or 3) having a bunch of cap space and just paying for a guy who is willing to come here. We haven't had 3), and we haven't had the assets for 2). It's apparently what we tried to do this offseason, and it didn't happen. Taking a flier on a second rounder has a very small chance of working, and considering the number of young guys we already have who need minutes and a functioning system, I'm not sure we really even have room for that kind of guy.
 
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The Human Q-Tip said:
I'm just saying that Toronto didn't either. OG in 2017, then nothing until this year.



Well...I thought going back to 2014 was a bit far. I figure the last 5 draft was pretty fair. Anyway, I'm not saying that to be a dick -- I just think that the idea of drafting a project wing in the second round and actually having him become a plus starter is a real longshot, and not even Toronto has done it. I mean...Bruno isn't exactly going to solve any of our problems, and Toronto pretty much ditched him as a failed effort after his rookie deal.

My guess is that at some point, we're going to be dumping one or more of Sexton, Garland, and Okoro, and that our sole focus in the 2022 is going to be the best wing on the board. If it's not, I'll grab my pitchfork and join in the hunt for Koby.

I think the hard truth is that if we want a reasonable shot at getting the kind of starting quality wing we want, it's going to be either 1) using our best first round pick, 2) trading a bunch of assets, or 3) having a bunch of cap space and just paying for a guy who is willing to come here. We haven't had 3), and we haven't had the assets for 2). It's apparently what we tried to do this offseason, and it didn't happen. Taking a flier on a second rounder has a very small chance of working, and considering the number of young guys we already have who need minutes and a functioning system, I'm not sure we really even have room for that kind of guy.
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And I'm just saying that every year there is a late first round wing or two that plays productive minutes and we've all but avoided them.
 
Man Called X said:
And I'm just saying that every year there is a late first round wing or two that plays productive minutes and we've all but avoided them.
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Do you want to trade guys we selected in the lottery for those late round picks or something else?
 
Man Called X said:
In no universe was KPJ a 3. KPJ was the 3rd guard to make the Sexland rotation work.
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Agreed. We as fans talked about lineups with KPJ on the floor with two other guards, but does anyone remember it happening? I don't. Now he starts at point guard in Houston.
 
Man Called X said:
In no universe was KPJ a 3. KPJ was the 3rd guard to make the Sexland rotation work.
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He's listed as a SG/SF. In any event, you've got to have late first rounds picks and the only one we traded away was that Bucks 2022 pick for Allen which I'd gladly do again.
 
CavsKermit said:
He's listed as a SG/SF. In any event, you've got to have late first rounds picks and the only one we traded away was that Bucks 2022 pick for Allen which I'd gladly do again.
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I assure you it isn't his current team calling him that, the Rockets have played KPJ exclusively at point guard. That's his natural position and it's where he has played in the NBA.
 
Cavatt said:
They aren't ignoring the position. It hasn't worked out, but it isn't the same as ignoring it.

They got Cedi the year Lebron left, drafted Sexton with the only pick they had left, Used 4 picks on a SG with length, Drafted another SF in the same draft, and then Drafted another wing who was sold as a SF, but might be a SG. They also got Prince in a trade. They felt getting Rubio was more valuable than Prince and I agree. He has 1/10 of Rubio's IQ.

I get your point KPJ is a SG, but if we had him and Windler healthy we wouldn't be having his convo.

It's bad luck, but there is a really low hit rate on Sf's. It's just the way it is. They used 7 draft picks in the last 3 years on wings in the draft and trades. 1 is broken, one was traded for nada, 1 was traded for Rubio, one is apparently a SG.

You are mad because you can't trade Collin for a starting level SF. Sorry none are available.
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I think these last two draft is really where Koby drop the ball. It's when he had the stockpile of future 2nd round picks and could have started making moves to really build our wing depth.

I understand trying to give Cedi, KPJ, and Windler the chance to develop but I think Koby needed to realize the hit rate for wings and adjust accordingly that not all were going to work out. By time the 2020 draft came along, we knew knew the ceiling on Cedi wasn't going to be as high as we hoped. Windler had already gotten hurt and KPJ was starting to have problems.

Even in 2020 I would have tried for Okoro plus another wing. I think this year it was apparent that they needed wing depth and to come away without even one while sitting on all those future 2nd round picks is where I would really say Koby messed up. It showed a real lack of understanding of what we could get in both the free agent and trade market.
 
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